Bruno de Souza Lino Posted August 12, 2023 Share Posted August 12, 2023 (edited) 20 hours ago, pseudopop said: I don't mean to belittle anyone (though I obviously am) but if all it takes to replace you is a software that sounds like you or a 3d model that looks like you, were you really that unique and skilled in the first place? In order for you to be replaced by said software, a model of your voice must be trained by such, which is rarely a concern for nobodies of the internet like myself and potentially you and others. 1 hour ago, pseudopop said: I would be surprised if studios weren't already planning something like this for the near future, without the drugging and killing, of course (probably). Not really studios, but Spotify is. Making use of AI generated music would solve the primary problem they have currently, which is having to pay musicians to use their music. And they barely do that these days. 4 hours ago, Eusebio Rufian-Zilbermann said: Copyrightable? very questionable. I would argue that no, it doesn't meet the requirements of a copyrightable "work" (of course, I wouldn't be shocked if politicians succumb to lobbying pressures and further erode the public domain beyond what the Constitution says) Trademarkable? Possibly, but the requirements for maintaining a trademark/registered trademark need to be met (e.g., making an investment in creating a brand out of it) Wouldn't all of those fall into prior art? Because we have yet to meet an algo that can train on models of real life stuff which doesn't exist yet. 11 hours ago, mettelus said: I think this is the real issue, as this is the intent of some. Essentially stealing someone's brand and profiting off that is a clear-cut no-no. This is one of the reasons why 15.ai doesn't exist anymore and Uberduck has removed several voices models which came from the former. The owners of these voices (people, actors and voice actors) demanded them to be removed off the platform. Edited August 12, 2023 by Bruno de Souza Lino 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mettelus Posted August 12, 2023 Share Posted August 12, 2023 (edited) 5 hours ago, pseudopop said: There are only so many Mission Impossible movies Tom Cruise is able to make before age catches up with him. LOL, quite true! Tom would be on the short list. But this has already been done several times in the newer Star Wars, Indiana Jones, Terminator, and even Gladiator to either "youthify" actors or outright use dead ones in scene. I am sort of CGI'd-out with movies and seems the general public is swaying that way as well. Flashy effects for lack of acting/script is a terrible trade off IMO. There are so many classic movies I have never seen and is interesting to be pulled into the story/acting rather than outrageous visuals (maybe why they are "classics" 🙂). 5 hours ago, pseudopop said: I can't remember the article, but I recall someone telling how they put a unique technical gadget up for sale on Amazon, and after only a few weeks, cheap Chinese copies started to pop up. This one actually strikes a nerve for me, as I consult people often on how to protect IP. Could write a book on this one alone (and then have it stolen, of course), but an interesting anecdote: I once asked someone who works for the US Patent and Trademark Office, "How many cases do you have filed for patent infringements from China?" She replied, "That number is significant." So I said, "Now the punchline... What are you able to do about them?" I got the blank stare back and, "Pretty much nothing." The IP game shifts dramatically when certain players adhere to rules but others do not (and cannot be held accountable). Edited August 12, 2023 by mettelus 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mettelus Posted August 12, 2023 Share Posted August 12, 2023 (edited) Dupe Edited August 12, 2023 by mettelus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno de Souza Lino Posted August 12, 2023 Share Posted August 12, 2023 43 minutes ago, mettelus said: LOL, quite true! Tom would be on the short list. But this has already been done several times in the newer Star Wars, Indiana Jones, Terminator, and even Gladiator to either "youthify" actors or outright use dead ones in scene. I am sort of CGI'd-out with movies and seems the general public is swaying that way as well. Flashy effects for lack of acting/script is a terrible trade off IMO. There are so many classic movies I have never seen and is interesting to be pulled into the story/acting rather than outrageous visuals (maybe why they are "classics" 🙂). Like they did in Logan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Arwood Posted August 12, 2023 Share Posted August 12, 2023 Ok, did anyone try the thing out? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antler Posted August 12, 2023 Share Posted August 12, 2023 On 8/11/2023 at 5:01 PM, PavlovsCat said: EDIT: I thought I'd include this interesting article on the legal aspects of using someone else's voice, as some have wondered about where law stands on this (of course, it varies from country to country, but overall, it's clear that laws haven't yet caught up to technology in this area). https://www.forbes.com/sites/schuylermoore/2022/10/28/who-owns-voice-and-image-artificial-intelligence-rights/ This might be relevant too. A while ago, a footballer questioned who gave EA Sports the right to use their likeness in their FIFA games. https://www.easportslaw.com/news/easports-image-rights-fifa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PavlovsCat Posted August 13, 2023 Share Posted August 13, 2023 (edited) 10 hours ago, antler said: This might be relevant too. A while ago, a footballer questioned who gave EA Sports the right to use their likeness in their FIFA games. https://www.easportslaw.com/news/easports-image-rights-fifa It's not my industry, but I know in the US, for American football and other sports, the negotiations go through the players' unions. Either earlier this year or last year there was some issues with the agreement in one of the sports -- that is, there was problems in the negotiations, but I've never heard that EA had used any player's likeness and name without an agreement -- that would be a foolish move, as it would be a slam dunk in courts around the world for the player. Edited August 13, 2023 by PavlovsCat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno de Souza Lino Posted August 13, 2023 Share Posted August 13, 2023 (edited) 6 hours ago, antler said: This might be relevant too. A while ago, a footballer questioned who gave EA Sports the right to use their likeness in their FIFA games. https://www.easportslaw.com/news/easports-image-rights-fifa In short: a persons's name and likeness is their own property and they have a right to decide how it is used. Rockstar has been the target of a few lawsuits over the years because of that. Granted that doesn't quite work when you are football player playing for a team and your whole team is used. Although if I'm not mistaken, some soccer games sometimes don't have certain players in teams because the player in question didn't give permission to have his likeness used. Edited August 13, 2023 by Bruno de Souza Lino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eusebio Rufian-Zilbermann Posted August 13, 2023 Share Posted August 13, 2023 17 hours ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said: Wouldn't all of those fall into prior art? Prior art applies to patents (protected innovation). It does not matter for copyright (protected expression) or trademark (protected branding) But yes, I don't think anybody would try to patent their voice (unless they are the Bene Gesserit...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno de Souza Lino Posted August 13, 2023 Share Posted August 13, 2023 4 hours ago, Eusebio Rufian-Zilbermann said: Prior art applies to patents (protected innovation). It does not matter for copyright (protected expression) or trademark (protected branding) But yes, I don't think anybody would try to patent their voice (unless they are the Bene Gesserit...) What I am alluding here more applies to the idea that a person's unique voice at least for now, always exists before the AI model which replicates it, meaning it could be considered part of their likeness and not to be used without permission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumbquestions Posted August 13, 2023 Share Posted August 13, 2023 (edited) Deleted. Dumb question Edited August 13, 2023 by dumbquestions 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackson white Posted August 14, 2023 Share Posted August 14, 2023 (edited) soundalikes has been/was? a lucrative business for session musicians for decades, when the number of entertainment media channels was fairly limited. On 8/11/2023 at 9:35 AM, jude77 said: what the legal issues would be, if any, if someone used an imitator of a singer/actor https://www.billboard.com/pro/ai-music-tools-copy-artists-voices-legal-questions/ it's only an issue when there is enough money for the lawyers to make a case. On 8/11/2023 at 7:15 PM, mettelus said: the premise of models/actors who looked GOOD, but couldn't model/act sing for crap. plenty of examples, same as it ever was. melodyne was in the "witchcraft' category when it first came out, mainly because it was less artificial sounding than autotune which interestingly enough has since evolved into a 'sound' of it's own. i imagine the largest market for AI ripoffs is most likely just for personal gratification and possibly a potential revenue stream for some artists to 'officially' license their formants. however a YT full of Adele/Drake/etc/etc 'hits' would get really boring really quickly, kinda like synth presets, and this whole issue will just as quickly become passe'. so probably not that big of a deal. are 'tribute bands' still a thing? Edited August 15, 2023 by jackson white clarification/elaboration 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PavlovsCat Posted August 14, 2023 Share Posted August 14, 2023 (edited) Considering that this topic involved a discussion on AI regarding singers, rights/licensing, I thought this article I just came across would be of interest. https://www.musicradar.com/news/google-universal-ai-vocals?utm_content=future-music&utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR2eaCJ4rH-zF7uG_Gy7_Tp54XFVNyP8ePHmiNmx0MEOa1PHT9Nn8bvEWk8 Edited August 14, 2023 by PavlovsCat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Blanc Posted August 14, 2023 Share Posted August 14, 2023 2 hours ago, PavlovsCat said: Considering that this topic involved a discussion on AI regarding singers, rights/licensing, I thought this article I just came across would be of interest. https://www.musicradar.com/news/google-universal-ai-vocals?utm_content=future-music&utm_campaign=socialflow&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwAR2eaCJ4rH-zF7uG_Gy7_Tp54XFVNyP8ePHmiNmx0MEOa1PHT9Nn8bvEWk8 Quote "There’s nothing more precious to an artist than their voice," Said the Warner executive who will take your AI generated Ed Sheeran song down because he has the copyright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treesha Posted August 14, 2023 Share Posted August 14, 2023 Not sure I feel like learning this but I would consider using it on myself to see what thats like. My voice is very different with getting older and pollen allergies and I often struggle with it. I have recordings of my younger years I could use. Kinda curious about singing with myself. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jude77 Posted August 15, 2023 Share Posted August 15, 2023 On 8/13/2023 at 7:17 PM, jackson white said: soundalikes has been/was? a lucrative business for session musicians for decades, when the number of entertainment channels was fairly limited. On 8/11/2023 at 10:35 AM, jude77 said: what the legal issues would be, if any, if someone used an imitator of a singer/actor https://www.billboard.com/pro/ai-music-tools-copy-artists-voices-legal-questions/ it's only an issue when there is enough money for the lawyers to make a case. That's the truth! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Arwood Posted August 16, 2023 Share Posted August 16, 2023 Yes, just google Elvis impersonators!! I have a friend William Styles that is a talented musician, and he does Elvis for a living. He didn’t need AI to do it either lol! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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