pwal³ Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 it's less enticing to learn how to do, say, for example, double-tracked vocals when a plugin does it for you, the list is endless 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Vere Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 (edited) The thing about a DAW is you can choose to totally ignore the features and use it like an 8 track. You can choose,like me, to only have 1 reverb unit and 2 compressors like I did in the 80’s. So for me the audio recording part never really changed other than Melodyne. I think the biggest improvement over the old days is what we now get out of midi. This has made the one man band sound 100% better than it did back then. I just posted a song in the song forum that is about 8 tracks. And I didn’t use Melodyne. It totally could have been done on a 8 track and midi sync to an Atari. Vocals and guitar tracks all one complete takes. It’s not my best work for sure but it was done this way on purpose. Edited January 30 by John Vere 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockeyjx Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 1 hour ago, John Vere said: I just posted a song in the song forum that is about 8 tracks. And I didn’t use Melodyne. It totally could have been done on a 8 track and midi sync to an Atari. Vocals and guitar tracks all one complete takes. It’s not my best work for sure but it was done this way on purpose. With so much of the music today being squashed dynamically, it is refreshing(and real) to get some dynamics and slightly imperfect takes or sound. In terms of this thread, I think some people will focus on making a recording "clean" and high fidelity vs a good song done well enough, but unique. That, to me, is a downside to digital. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted January 30 Author Share Posted January 30 My pet peeve is the overkill of Melodyne on instruments and vocals. You can go through older recordings when stuff is not perfectly in tune but yet we'd rather trust some colors than our ears. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigb Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 3 hours ago, hockeyjx said: With so much of the music today being squashed dynamically, it is refreshing(and real) to get some dynamics and slightly imperfect takes or sound. In terms of this thread, I think some people will focus on making a recording "clean" and high fidelity vs a good song done well enough, but unique. That, to me, is a downside to digital. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheens Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 (edited) imo great sounding 2023 DAW music MP3 stream (on a date could this get a girl into the mood maybe ? ya ?) + great sounding 45 year ago analog tape track MP3 stream Edited January 30 by Sheens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigb Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 Like the hot girl for my date apparently... 😕 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheens Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 (edited) here in Europe...video unavailble AND in confriends call Edited January 30 by Sheens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Smith Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 I believe there may have been some advantages, however I much prefer the present way things are. So long as I can mold my thoughts into something I envisioned I like it. DAWs are amazing. I'm not smoking anything, I swear. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grem Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 Just got around to reading this article. It was very well written. Very good analogies he used. Was able to connect and understand exactly what he was saying. Best quote from article IMHO: "the importance of constraint as a catalyst for creativity" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigb Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 1 minute ago, Grem said: Just got around to reading this article. It was very well written. Very good analogies he used. Was able to connect and understand exactly what he was saying. Best quote from article IMHO: "the importance of constraint as a catalyst for creativity" Glad you feel that way Michael! The new forum update will be removing one vowel from the keyboard just to make you creative! 😁 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grem Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 On 1/30/2024 at 2:37 PM, craigb said: There are songs that I hear on XM that just don't have the sound/impact of the songs I remember. Example: "The Ocean" Led Zep, album "Houses Of The Holy". The drum lick that John puts in that song, made that song!! It was the highlight of it. Today when I hear it on XM or even the local radio station, that triplet kick is almost unheard now. So younger people that hear it today for the first time will not get the very important 'feel' of the song. Seems that radio today has computerized all music to eliminate the "loudness difference" with algorithms that have effectively drained the dynamics and altering the mixes of once great recordings!! ZZ Top "LaGrange" is another example, when it was released on CD it had way too much reverb on it. Did not have the same sound as the original. Kansas "Leftoverture" release on CD was the same way. Way too much reverb. ZZ Top corrected this when they released their "Studio Albums" box set. Thanks Billy! (However, some radio stations still use that over-reverbed versions) I could go on... but I will stop this rant from getting out of hand!! Blame it on @craigb, he got me started!!! 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigb Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 40 minutes ago, Grem said: Blame it on @craigb, he got me started!!! My parents always said I should be a responsible person. They neglected to realize that always means I'm the guilty party! 😆 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grem Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 54 minutes ago, craigb said: that always means I'm the guilty party! Weird how that always works out that way!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rain Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 (edited) Deep Purple's Getting Tighter - 2010 remaster vs original. They killed the groove - and that groove was what the song was all about. I watch a lot of music related content on YouTube these days, so of course I get the targeted ads. And essentially, what they are advertising are products and libraries designed to get that sound you're familiar with - and that will make you sound just like everyone else. I cringe every time one of those ads start and I hear those libraries. Back in the days, I read about the making of Nine Inch Nails The Fragile in Keyboard magazine. Trent Reznor had hired a guy (Keith Hillerbrand from memory) to create a huge library of weird, unique sounds for him to use, just for that album. To me, the making of that record always represented everything that was fantastic about DAWs and working with computers. But there are also a lot of opportunities to remove almost every variable from the equation, thereby compromising the chances of creating something original. And it seems that a lot of people aren't making music for the love of art, so they're quite content to just assemble songs. It's their take on the same basic idea. If you spend 5 minutes on social media, it's quite obvious that most people only want to have their turn in the spotlight doing the same thing as everyone else. I remember recording demos with nothing but my guitars, a little Marshall transistor combo, an Akai XR10, a tube distortion, a wah pedal, and a Boss flanger. And the delay on my Sony reel machine. A lot of the things I had in mind like mellotron parts, a Hammond, or horns were simply impossible, so I would have to create something that had vaguely similar sonic qualities using what I had. In many ways, it often made the songs more interesting. It's something I try not to let go of, even now that I have access to all those instrument libraries. Edited February 3 by Rain 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mettelus Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 Ah, the waveform I euphemistically call "the worm." I have cautioned a lot of newer folks about creating a "visual caterpillar" with their work... in doing so they have already removed a prime ingredient from the song. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shane_B. Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 17 hours ago, Grem said: There are songs that I hear on XM that just don't have the sound/impact of the songs I remember. Example: "The Ocean" Led Zep, album "Houses Of The Holy". The drum lick that John puts in that song, made that song!! It was the highlight of it. Today when I hear it on XM or even the local radio station, that triplet kick is almost unheard now. So younger people that hear it today for the first time will not get the very important 'feel' of the song. Seems that radio today has computerized all music to eliminate the "loudness difference" with algorithms that have effectively drained the dynamics and altering the mixes of once great recordings!! ZZ Top "LaGrange" is another example, when it was released on CD it had way too much reverb on it. Did not have the same sound as the original. Kansas "Leftoverture" release on CD was the same way. Way too much reverb. ZZ Top corrected this when they released their "Studio Albums" box set. Thanks Billy! (However, some radio stations still use that over-reverbed versions) I could go on... but I will stop this rant from getting out of hand!! Blame it on @craigb, he got me started!!! The website with all those dB readings is great. https://dr.loudness-war.info/ I got a lot of CDs as they first came out back in the day. Before the loudness wars began. I have the original CD of Brothers In Arms. Mobile Fidelity by far wins the dynamic range war for the good side. If you are Moody Blues fan, without doubt the best version of Days Of Future Passed is the Mobile Fidelity version. It's like you're sitting right there live. A Night At The Opera, Dark Side Of The Moon. Absolutely beautiful to listen to from Mobile Fidelity CD. I'm a little torn on this topic though. For example, I hear things in the background in all the current Beatles releases I never heard before. I don't know if that's a result of the compression or remix. The trick at home is to tame spikes so you don't over trigger compression while still maintaining some kind of dynamic range. It's taken me many years on a DAW to fully get an understanding of that and get a grasp on it. It just seemed to be a lot easier and almost a non-issue with analog. I have YouTube Music. Some albums are significantly softer than others. I listened to The Wall yesterday and I was constantly raising and lowering the level. So I'm assuming they do not compress the music for streaming, but I don't know. Another thing I like about YTM is there are no gaps between songs if you are streaming a full album, but you can skip around tracks. IOW it appears they don't just rip the albums to mp3s with gaps. I also have it set to stream in high quality. It sounds really good to me. I haven't picked up on any compression artifacts, but I haven't listened to anything on a good home system yet. Just in the truck and TV. I can hear compression artifacts sometimes when I listen to XM in the truck. My truck has a really good Bose system with a sub and it sounds almost as good as my home system. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kennywtelejazz Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 (edited) I have been so conflicted about the role The DAW has played in my musical life . Overall it's nice to have a DAW but The DAW been such a major time suck with me trying to catch up and crest multiple learning curves that seem to change every time a DAW has a major version upgrade . On many levels this BS does not help my music . How would you like it if I took your guitar and changed the strings to heavy gauge strings just before your performance ? What about me hoping on stage and switching your right handed guitar over to a lefty guitar ? or hows about me taking your rows of keyboards and changing all the notes and sounds from black keys to white keys and all the white key notes and sounds to black keys 😁 Before I got involved in recording with a DAW I had been striving to play my chosen instrument with my feet firmly planted on a pathway to achieving a personal virtuoso level . I used to listen listen listen , play play play and try to emulate the musicians I resonated with . I did my best to copy and learn from them ... I'm not gonna drop any names here ....FWIW it seems like a lifetime ago and Yet I did get a little respect and get taken under a few great players wings 🙂 For the record I am grateful to have a DAW but in the end I wish I hadn't wasted all the time I eventually did dicking around with it .The same goes for social media I'm just not gonna pucker up and get on my knees just to get people to listen too me🙊 I have gone full circle and my guitar playing comes first . I treat The DAW as a beefed up tape recorder and I wont waste my time sitting here trying to look up the horses AZS trying to figure out why my cart is not moving because the horse belongs in front of the cart not behind the cart .... I'm glad I caught this musical performance while having my morning coffee this fine morning .It brought me back to how I feel about musicians that can actually play . I don't care what genre music is in . If it's good it's good . Apparently these 2 don't need a whole bunch of cwap to sound good . 😉 Updated link to the video since CBS made it private ... https://www.cbsnews.com/video/saturday-sessions-billy-strings-and-chris-thile-perform-wild-bill-jones/#x Kenny Edited February 3 by kennywtelejazz 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigb Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 3 hours ago, kennywtelejazz said: Kenny "This video is private" Apparently is only meant for Kenny! 😆 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kennywtelejazz Posted February 3 Share Posted February 3 Not true .... CBS did that , not me 🤣 Here you go . https://www.cbsnews.com/video/saturday-sessions-billy-strings-and-chris-thile-perform-wild-bill-jones/#x Kenny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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