John Vere Posted September 8, 2023 Share Posted September 8, 2023 That's funny me and Jonesey said the same thing at the same time,, Great minds.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Tim Posted September 8, 2023 Share Posted September 8, 2023 1 minute ago, Milton Sica said: Good thing we're not talking about cars. I don't know one person in the whole world who would buy an automobile knowing it has a known amount of defects/bugs. That's what I'm talking about. If it were a car, would you buy it and put your life/family in it? And I close my posts on the topic. But we're NOT talking about cars. We're talking about software. This isn't an apples to apples comparison. My point still stands. Name me one bit of complex software like this that has no bugs, and the developers promise their next release is bug-free and they'll do the work for nothing. I'll save us both a bit of time: you can't, because this does not exist. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Vere Posted September 8, 2023 Share Posted September 8, 2023 1 minute ago, Lord Tim said: I'll save us both a bit of time: you can't, because this does not exist. Or these elusive bugs he cannot even name. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Tim Posted September 8, 2023 Share Posted September 8, 2023 To be clear though, there most definitely *are* bugs in CbB, of course, like there is in all other software like this. But it needs to be reproduced by the Bakers in order to get them fixed, which requires proper steps to make it happen and as much information as possible about hardware, software environment, what you were doing before it happened, any crash dumps, etc. Without that, just saying "this is a bug" is absolutely useless. It might be. But the people that can actually do something about it need to know what it is first to fix it (if it is indeed a bug - Noel even mentioned in a recent thread that most crashes are plugin related, usually due to the very loose VST spec - the crash dumps clearly show that). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msmcleod Posted September 8, 2023 Share Posted September 8, 2023 1 hour ago, Milton Sica said: Good thing we're not talking about cars. I don't know one person in the whole world who would buy an automobile knowing it has a known amount of defects/bugs. That's what I'm talking about. If it were a car, would you buy it and put your life/family in it? And I close my posts on the topic. Modern cars certainly do have bugs, for example: - I drive through a spot that has a lot of tree cover, so my headlights switch on... it thinks it's dark, even though the dashboard clock clearly shows its the middle of the day. It takes up to 5 minutes to work out that it's not still dark and turn the headlights off. - The automatic wipers come on with a single drop of water, but then don't when it's raining lots of fine drops. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol_Jonesey Posted September 8, 2023 Share Posted September 8, 2023 27 minutes ago, msmcleod said: Modern cars certainly do have bugs, for example: - I drive through a spot that has a lot of tree cover, so my headlights switch on... it thinks it's dark, even though the dashboard clock clearly shows its the middle of the day. It takes up to 5 minutes to work out that it's not still dark and turn the headlights off. - The automatic wipers come on with a single drop of water, but then don't when it's raining lots of fine drops. I was using the Sat Nav to guide me to a location I'd not been to before. It took me somewhere completely different to the UK post code I'd (accurately) typed in. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol_Jonesey Posted September 8, 2023 Share Posted September 8, 2023 1 hour ago, Milton Sica said: Just read the release approaches. What are "release approaches"? I've read all the release notes that accompany every update, and they always list the bugs which have been fixed. Are you saying they list the ones that haven't been fixed? If not your post and general stance on this matter is nonsensical 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian A Menear Posted September 11, 2023 Share Posted September 11, 2023 thanks for some of the info on my question above. ive only been using cakewalk for about 2 years. its my 1st DAW and i really like it. i would gladly pay for it even if it was a few hundred$$. i would nt like it if was subscription based because i would always forget when payment is due and overdraft. it was frustrating when i was working on a time sensitive project to have issues with the new version. i know theres always bugs to work out with anything new. hopefully they all get fixed before true release date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starship Krupa Posted September 12, 2023 Share Posted September 12, 2023 On 9/2/2023 at 7:37 AM, JohnnyV said: Small price to pay for a $500 DAW that is free. Oh how I wish that people would stop repeating figures like that. Cakewalk By BandLab, upon its first release was similar in feature set to SONAR Professional, a program that listed for $199.00 6 years ago. CbB was never "SONAR Platinum, but now FREE!" SONAR Platinum was a suite that bundled SONAR Professional with a huge pile of plug-ins. I think maybe half a dozen (if that) of the plug-ins that came with Platinum were included with CbB, and I believe a couple that Professional had that CbB doesn't. We can assign any personal value we want to CbB, but its closest antecedent sold for $199. If I were shopping for a DAW today, and had to choose between SONAR Platinum and SONAR Professional, I'd go with Professional, no question. I have all the plug-ins I need, and THEN some. It's a different scene now; many more companies are offering loss-leader freebie mixing and instrument plug-ins, many other people are using software tools that didn't exist back then to make free ones. I could comfortably do what I do with nothing but free software, it's just more fun to shop and get exactly what I want. 😄 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xoo Posted September 12, 2023 Share Posted September 12, 2023 On 9/8/2023 at 5:48 PM, Bristol_Jonesey said: I was using the Sat Nav to guide me to a location I'd not been to before. It took me somewhere completely different to the UK post code I'd (accurately) typed in. Been there. So to speak 🙂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Dickens Posted September 12, 2023 Share Posted September 12, 2023 (edited) 7 hours ago, Starship Krupa said: Oh how I wish that people would stop repeating figures like that. Cakewalk By BandLab, upon its first release was similar in feature set to SONAR Professional, a program that listed for $199.00 6 years ago. CbB was never "SONAR Platinum, but now FREE!" SONAR Platinum was a suite that bundled SONAR Professional with a huge pile of plug-ins. I think maybe half a dozen (if that) of the plug-ins that came with Platinum were included with CbB, and I believe a couple that Professional had that CbB doesn't. We can assign any personal value we want to CbB, but its closest antecedent sold for $199. If I were shopping for a DAW today, and had to choose between SONAR Platinum and SONAR Professional, I'd go with Professional, no question. I have all the plug-ins I need, and THEN some. It's a different scene now; many more companies are offering loss-leader freebie mixing and instrument plug-ins, many other people are using software tools that didn't exist back then to make free ones. I could comfortably do what I do with nothing but free software, it's just more fun to shop and get exactly what I want. 😄 Wrong. There was SONAR Home Studio, Artist, Studio and Platinum. Platinum had many more features, not just more plugins. https://gaga.cakewalk.com/Products/SONAR/Versions#start You're right about the price. It wasn't $500, it was $499. https://gaga.cakewalk.com/Products/SONAR/Buy-Now/SONAR-Platinum#start Edited September 12, 2023 by Byron Dickens 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol_Jonesey Posted September 12, 2023 Share Posted September 12, 2023 9 hours ago, Starship Krupa said: Oh how I wish that people would stop repeating figures like that. Cakewalk By BandLab, upon its first release was similar in feature set to SONAR Professional, a program that listed for $199.00 6 years ago. CbB was never "SONAR Platinum, but now FREE!" SONAR Platinum was a suite that bundled SONAR Professional with a huge pile of plug-ins. I think maybe half a dozen (if that) of the plug-ins that came with Platinum were included with CbB, and I believe a couple that Professional had that CbB doesn't. We can assign any personal value we want to CbB, but its closest antecedent sold for $199. It's scary how you believe this with over 6.1k posts on this forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larioso Posted September 12, 2023 Share Posted September 12, 2023 1 hour ago, Byron Dickens said: Wrong. There was SONAR Home Studio, Artist, Studio and Platinum. Platinum had many more features, not just more plugins. Professional and Platinum were no features at all, just content. My recollection of Platinum is as Starship said was all about content and of not interest. Was it some vocal alignment and drums replacement or similar, which is of no use in my world. Stretching audio nothing I ever used, just use daw as tape recorder and hold clips and plugins and some automation. - keeping it simple There are so many daws that offer the basic stuff that most need. - if there is just one version Sonar it will fail big, not many need all content nor features Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byron Dickens Posted September 12, 2023 Share Posted September 12, 2023 47 minutes ago, Larioso said: Was it some vocal alignment and drums replacement or similar, which is of no use in my world. Who cares whether you have any use for it or not. Many people do. 48 minutes ago, Larioso said: Stretching audio nothing I ever used, Again, who cares whether you have any use for it or not. Many people do. 49 minutes ago, Larioso said: just use daw as tape recorder and hold clips and plugins and some automation. Yet again, who cares? That is your own choice. That may not be other people's choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larioso Posted September 12, 2023 Share Posted September 12, 2023 6 minutes ago, Byron Dickens said: Who cares whether you have any use for it or not. Many people do. Again, who cares whether you have any use for it or not. Many people do. Yet again, who cares? That is your own choice. That may not be other people's choice. I realize that that is my views. And the world of music recording never had those features until recently either. - so how in the world did that happend? - if vocals off, redo it - so "need" is a relative matter - a solution that is seeking a need? - certainly daw makers trying to attract users with new features - everything "needed" is already done There is this documentary that Dave Grohl did over Soundcity studio, very nice film I recommend. A short clip with Tom Petty he told about how they probably made 50 takes of one of his big hits. - it's crafmanship from a lot of practice Now we want effortless gratification! - is something lost here maybe? - I know, who cares! I hired some vocalists and had a rough mix demo for them - one song was to low in pitch and needed up two steps - so had to make a new quick demo with just a guitar, then do the rest later alone - yeah, I could have used some modern features saving some work, but solved it anyway - and so did entire music industry back in the day with 4 track tape machines like early Beatles Yet, this guy with thread "thread syncronization bug" moved to StudioOne Artist which has none of those features as in StudioOne Pro. - after 20 years of Cakewalk Sonar/CbB - he did film score for film industry, and swapped to a daw with nothing fancy - again what is a "need"? Always nice with headroom for things that you might need in future, but not a "need" IMO. Yeah, I know, my views and who cares! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starship Krupa Posted September 13, 2023 Share Posted September 13, 2023 (edited) 23 hours ago, Byron Dickens said: There was SONAR Home Studio, Artist, Studio and Platinum. Platinum had many more features, not just more plugins. Thanks for setting me straight on that. I was misled by the very webpage you linked to, which calls the versions "Home Studio," "Artist," "Professional," and "Platinum." Did you ever point out their error to them back when the site was current? Do you see how I could have been misled into believing that there was a version of SONAR called "SONAR Professional?" Since your knowledge obviously eclipses my own, I beseech you to tell me what the "many more features" that were not plug-ins were. Please? The web page you linked to must be incorrect about this as well as the product names, because what it shows me is only three non-plug-in features that Profession..., sorry, "Studio" (sharp-eyed guy you are, how could their own website have gotten it wrong?) lacked in comparison to Platinum. Drum Replacer and Theme Editor, which were optional when CbB was first released (don't know if they still are), and VocalSync. On my systems, Drum Replacer installed as a plug-in when I tried installing it, so please forgive me for thinking of it as a plug-in. Edited September 13, 2023 by Starship Krupa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starship Krupa Posted September 13, 2023 Share Posted September 13, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Starship Krupa said: Odd duplicate post Edited September 13, 2023 by Starship Krupa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starship Krupa Posted September 13, 2023 Share Posted September 13, 2023 21 hours ago, Bristol_Jonesey said: It's scary how you believe this with over 6.1k posts on this forum. Could you please elaborate? Byron kindly filled me in on how the various versions were actually called "Home Studio," "Artist," "Studio," and "Platinum," and that there were "many more features, not just plug-ins" in Platinum. Are those the things that struck fear in you? If so, I hope that you'll accept my excuse that I was getting my information from the Cakewalk, Inc. website, which according to Byron, got one of the names of their own products wrong. I'm really surprised that nobody ever caught that or alerted them. I also can't figure out why, if there were many more non-plug-in features, that they would have a chart that showed only 3, one of which also functions as a plug-in and another that has nothing to do with audio processing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Jones Posted September 13, 2023 Share Posted September 13, 2023 On 9/11/2023 at 2:52 PM, Brian A Menear said: i would gladly pay for it even if it was a few hundred$$. Don't talk like that! They're still deciding on the price. Better to say "I couldn't afford it if it were more than 50 bucks." 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Anderton Posted September 13, 2023 Share Posted September 13, 2023 On 9/8/2023 at 9:52 AM, Milton Sica said: Good thing we're not talking about cars. I don't know one person in the whole world who would buy an automobile knowing it has a known amount of defects/bugs. Tesla owners, for starters. Anyone who is not aware that cars are recalled periodically, and fairly often, to fix issues is not an inhabitant of this planet who drives a car. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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