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Reid Rosefelt

ProjectSAM Swing! and Symphobia Series 50% Off at NI

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I keep waiting for somebody to list this.  It's HERE.

Like a lot of these NI deals, it isn't 50% off on everything ProjectSAM sells. Just 50% off on these two series. 

I think these are the lowest prices ever for  Swing! and Swing More!

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Dammmmm was waiting for swing bu money short now 

..... :(

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Swing More looks interesting ($199) but I just need convincing horns. There doesn't seem to be a library that can do this well. I just want a Tower of Power vsti for $29 - is that too much to ask??? :)

Bad one's I've tried:

 

Chris Hein Compact (extremely lifeless, and based on that, I didn't want to pop for the four pro versions)

Broadway Gig (a couple usable patches, but meh overall, and the "pro" version is 2 grand, and the company itself seems out of commission)

BigFish Vintage Horns 2 (I like it a lot, has some good tones and kind of realistic in spots)

Blue Brass (fun mixture of new and old horns, has some realism as well)

 

I've researched but do not have NI's Session Horns Pro (doesn't sound at all real to me but others like it)

ditto for Vir2 Mojo 2

 

What about the brand new Eastwest "Hollywood Pop Brass" - sounds decent but it's 100% ensembles, no individual players, and it's $399

 

Maybe it's Orchestral Tools "Glory Days Big Band Brass" which sounds really good but it's $800.

 

 

sorry for the rant, I've just been scouring the universe for options here - any other ideas? Anyone have and like Swing More?

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Before buying any of the ProjectSAM libraries I recommend watching Guy Roland's videos.  Here's one on Swing More.  He has a bunch of them for almost all the ProjectSam Libraries.  To be honest I doubt the Swing libraries are what you want, since they are kind of phrase library based (sort of).

 

 

Check out all his videos at https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtBlIrl__YxIEjuZs8vHU1g

 

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Thanks, Matthew! Indeed I dutifully watched that video. He does a good job and is very thorough. However, crikey Project Sam looks like it needs a ton of keyswitch massaging. Sounds decent though. Yes it is more "big band" than "funk" . . . I admit to being lazy as heck and I'm leaning towards the Eastwest offering, which appeals to my laziness. But $400 bones is a lot for what Hollywood Pop Brass is. That would buy a lot of food. I like food.

 

thanks for the thoughts - there's also the Samplemodelling route but I just want better sounds than even that. Plus it doesn't look like the Samplemodelling stuff ensembles well.

 

sorry for turning this thread into my personal  horn rant.

 


 

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20 minutes ago, emeraldsoul said:

thanks for the thoughts - there's also the Samplemodelling route but I just want better sounds than even that. Plus it doesn't look like the Samplemodelling stuff ensembles well.

If I remember correctly, Samplemodelling does sample libraries whereas Audio Modelling does instrument modelling; only saxophones though. Their philosophy would be that you can build your own ensemble to your exact requirements, at the cost of taking time.

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To be honest I have to admit I like NI's Session Horns Pro, not so much for the sound but because I really like the instrument features/scripting (including the phrases which for someone like me are a lot more useful).  All the rest that I might consider for the funk brass sound are kind of over priced.  Mojo 2 looked interesting but the pricing is way too high.  Eastwest and Play are pretty much no go for me with the way they handle the streaming.  I can't invest more money in a platform that won't render correctly at full speed.  I'd also recommend you avoid Cmusic Production's brass, very disappointed with the Trumpet I got from them.

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14 hours ago, emeraldsoul said:

Chris Hein Compact (extremely lifeless, and based on that, I didn't want to pop for the four pro versions)

Is this just the brass? I was considering getting the pro versions of the four libraries at some point (i.e. my long term wishlist) as the demos sounded quite good to me. My main targets would be epic/cinematic orchestral arrangements, and maybe also in some tunes in the pop/rock genre.

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1 minute ago, antler said:

....build your own ensemble to your exact requirements, at the cost of taking time.

tenor.gif

 

I'm a huge fan of swing/jazz.....just not at that price point ;)

 

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I've never had much luck with build your own ensemble.  Real players playing together aren't the same as a bunch of separate recordings.  Of course real players aren't the same as multi-sampled libraries either.  But multi-sampled libraries of single players put together never seem to jell right.  It's like two stages removed.

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3 minutes ago, Matthew Sorrels said:

But multi-sampled libraries of single players put together never seem to jell right

Might just be my ear, but the tutorial videos (of the modelled instruments) sounded quite good to me. It mentioned that you have to slightly detune each instance, and also tweak the controller curves as well (e.g. redraw it with the mouse); don't know how long it took to do the whole thing though.

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Interesting that right after this thread came up Broadway Lites is back on sale at VSTBuzz.

 

I punted on the last 77% off sale a year or so ago because I thought it looked a little dated and with no real way to upgrade.  I'm not paying $2k for any single library and even at 50% off it's still way outside reasonable.  I start running out of interest when a library crosses the $300 mark.  But Broadway Lites does look interesting, might be worth it at this price.  Still trying to decide if I want Swing/Swing More though.  I have Symphobia 1 and 3, not sure about getting 2.

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I have Swing!  I have been watching videos of Swing More! over the last few days.

These are NOT, I repeat not, mainly phrase libraries.  Nobody who has them or watches Rowland's videos would say that. I have heard that said more than once, and I don't know where it comes from. Rowland himself just denied they were phrase libraries on VI:Control.

 It is true that there are some phrases in them, but for the most part they are playable instruments.

They have nothing to do with funk or Tower of Power.  Tundra has as much to do with funk as they do.   😁

They are for old-fashioned Hollywood Big Band.  Think 40s.  Glenn Miller and Frank Sinatra.  Film Noir.  Lighter stuff from Henry Mancini.  A lot of people like Cory Pellizari  feel that they are mainly to be used for animation, and they are used a lot in ads.   They work well for comedy.  The other night I was watching "Dead to Me" on Netflix and I heard one of the silly overdone drum solos from Swing More! 

Swing! has instruments for Django-type  jazz manouche and western stuff, including a slide guitar.  Swing More! has a piano, a banjo, and even vocals.

The strength is not in the individual instruments, IMHO.  The strength is in the ensemble patches which sound very real--because they are. Swing More! includes recorded versions of an ensemble playing jazz chords with different inversions and different orchestration.  

But these libraries also add a lot of decent individual instruments to your palette, like a World library does. Some are better than that.  I've been a harmonica player since my teens, and it has the best blues harmonica I've ever found. I'm using the 4 Whistlers patch on a western theme I'm working on now.  It's useful to have stuff like this around when you find you need it. 

I'm very interested in the big band chords in Swing More! and the saxophones.  I will buy it someday but I'm pretty strapped for cash now, what with the OTS sale and other things. But I'm thinking about it...

 

 

 

Edited by Tiger The Frog
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On 7/9/2019 at 6:28 AM, emeraldsoul said:

 I've just been scouring the universe for options here - any other ideas? Anyone have and like Swing More?

Sometimes I wonder if the answer is just to get a group of musicians together to record what you want to produce.

If the price of a 'great' library is 2 grand, and you're going to use it only once or twice, would it be cheaper to hire some musicians and studio time for a day?

I don't know, really. Just putting it out there.

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2 hours ago, Tiger The Frog said:

These are NOT, I repeat not, mainly phrase libraries.  Nobody who has them or watches Roland's videos would say that. I have heard that said more than once, and I don't know where it comes from. Roland himself just denied they were phrase libraries on VI:Control.

Your right, I (of course) read VI and it came up there and then watching the videos they always start on the chord patches, which are kind of phrases.  But watching more of it you can see it's really normal instruments.  ProjectSAM libraries aren't really deep sampled though, but that's not actually all that bad.  Not sure I really need every note sampled at 10 velocity levels.

 

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1 hour ago, Matthew Sorrels said:

Your right, I (of course) read VI and it came up there and then watching the videos they always start on the chord patches, which are kind of phrases.  But watching more of it you can see it's really normal instruments.  ProjectSAM libraries aren't really deep sampled though, but that's not actually all that bad.  Not sure I really need every note sampled at 10 velocity levels.

 

My feeling about Swing! is that it is not about creating the greatest single instruments ever.   But they create combos--instruments that are designed to mesh well together.  If you want to do an accordion solo, maybe Tarilonte is a better choice. But if you put together the Jazz Manouche Guitars, the acoustic bass, and the accordions, some drums--you have something that sounds like Gypsy Jazz.  Same for the Western instruments.  We're used to working with an orchestral library from one company, but when we try to put together a different genre--it's catch as catch can.  You can work quickly with this.  And for people who don't know anything about jazz chords--Swing More! can do the work for you. A little fooling around and you can get something that sounds like a real jazz ensemble.  I want it.

The biggest complaint I would have about Swing! is the interface.   I wish the articulations could be done with key switches, but they change through the use of velocity and the modwheel.  Sometimes this is intuitive and great and sometimes it really gets in your way.  I see that Swing More! has at least some keyswitched instruments.  You really need a keyboard that can register delicate differences of velocity or else you will have to fix it in the DAW, which is what I do. 

Did I mention that I would like to buy Swing More?

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20 minutes ago, Tiger The Frog said:

My feeling about Swing! is that it is not about creating the greatest single instruments ever.   But they create combos--instruments that are designed to mesh well together.  If you want to do an accordion solo, maybe Tarilonte is a better choice. But if you put together the Jazz Manouche Guitars, the acoustic bass, and the accordions, some drums--you have something that sounds like Gypsy Jazz.  Same for the Western instruments.  We're used to working with an orchestral library from one company, but when we try to put together a different genre--it's catch as catch can.  You can work quickly with this.  And for people who don't know anything about jazz chords--Swing More! can do the work for you. A little fooling around and you can get something that sounds like a real jazz ensemble.  I want it.

The biggest complaint I would have about Swing! is the interface.   I wish the articulations could be done with key switches, but they change through the use of velocity and the modwheel.  Sometimes this is intuitive and great and sometimes it really gets in your way.  I see that Swing More! has at least some keyswitched instruments.  You really need a keyboard that can register delicate differences of velocity or else you will have to fix it in the DAW, which is what I do. 

Did I mention that I would like to buy Swing More?

@Tiger The Frog just wondering what you make of eastwest Hollywood pop brass. One could join the creative cloud for 20 bucks a month and access it and a crapton of other libraries.

 

Have you heard those pop brass ensembles?

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1 minute ago, emeraldsoul said:

@Tiger The Frog just wondering what you make of eastwest Hollywood pop brass. One could join the creative cloud for 20 bucks a month and access it and a crapton of other libraries.

 

Have you heard those pop brass ensembles?

I want to do that someday, particularly because I want to check out all their world libraries.  But I have so many libraries I already own that I haven't fully explored.  And I also like making music and not just buying stuff. 😁

I'm not particularly interested in having a Pop Brass library, though.   I know that all the ones @emeraldsoul  has are out there, but they aren't on my wishlist.  

I'm attracted to the idea of the jazzbo tenor saxophonist,  soulfully playing in a smokey club with a pianist, bass and drummer.  That would be fun to try to do. 

Swing! is great but I actually think that Swing! and Swing More! together make a set.  😟 They complete each other.  Most people who buy only one but Swing More! but I had a special desire for the instruments in Swing!--like the harmonica.  

 

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personnaly i would be happy with swing more alone ....enogth for my lofi hip hop second album ;)

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