Harley Dear Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 (edited) Hi all. This is going to sound real dumb, but I am getting a problem with CbB increasing tempo and I am sure I am not imagining things. We use CbB as backing track for our band -all MIDI files. I have the 'View Tempo' ribbon bar on which shows a constant flat line. I sure I have also disabled all the tempo increases in the Events list. The laptop I am using is a games machine 0 Rog Strix G15 Asus. We hook up to a Soundcraft Ui24R. The power source is very stable here (in NZ ) as well. I had noticed some time ago, a slight variation in tempo when using an on-line metronome to gauge the tempo of a song but thought it was my imagination. Now I am not so convinced it was that. So my question is, is there anything you know that might affect the tempo in a Cakewalk file? I am not computer tech savvy by the way. Many thanks in anticipation, Harley Edited December 23, 2022 by Harley Dear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobertWS Posted December 11, 2022 Share Posted December 11, 2022 What device is rendering the MIDI to analog audio? I would start there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 12, 2022 Author Share Posted December 12, 2022 23 hours ago, RobertWS said: What device is rendering the MIDI to analog audio? I would start there. Not sure I understand you correctly by 'rendering' but I use my Rog Strix G15 ASUS laptop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msmcleod Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 I've had timing trouble with pure MIDI projects in the past. The issue I had is that normally timing is tied to the audio clock, but as there were no audio tracks in my project, the timing was drifting. There's two solutions: 1. Just add a blank audio track. 2. Set the timing in Project->Clock->Source to "Internal" However, depending on how your hi-resolution timer is set up both in your BIOS & in Windows itself, option 2 might not be accurate enough. I find keeping the clock source as "Audio" and inserting a blank audio track the most reliable. Also make sure that your Playback Timing Master is set to the correct audio device. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 12, 2022 Author Share Posted December 12, 2022 2 hours ago, msmcleod said: Also make sure that your Playback Timing Master is set to the correct audio device. Thanks msmcleod, How do I go about achieving my Playback Timing Master is set to the correct audio device? Sorry, I'm not IT savvy 😩 Thanks - Harley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
57Gregy Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 11 hours ago, Harley Dear said: Not sure I understand you correctly by 'rendering' but I use my Rog Strix G15 ASUS laptop. What software or hardware synth is making the sounds. 30 minutes ago, Harley Dear said: How do I go about achieving my Playback Timing Master is set to the correct audio device? Press 'P' on your computer keyboard for Preferences. Ensure that setting is to the audio interface or sound card you want to use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Baay Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 On 12/10/2022 at 10:53 PM, Harley Dear said: We use CbB as backing track for our band -all MIDI files. Does this mean MIDI is driving an external hardware synth with no soft synths in the project? Given that you're using a laptop and don't mention an external MIDI interface or other hardware, I would think you must be using soft synth in which case it's not really possible to have timing issues without also having audio distortion or some sort. Or are you possibly outputting the MIDI to the laptop's onboard "Wavetable" synth (let's hope not!). In any case, if these are somehow 'pure MIDI' projects with no soft synths or other audio track content as Mark mentioned, I would suggest a third option for keeping the audio clock active: Enable CbB's audio metronome for playback, output it to a bus, and mute the bus. Usually just having the metronome set to 'Audio' in preferences is enough, but having it actually active on playback can be helpful in some instances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeringAmps Posted December 13, 2022 Share Posted December 13, 2022 7 hours ago, Harley Dear said: Playback Timing Master is set to the correct audio device? hit the letter "P", that will open PREFERENCES. Select Driver Settings Playback and Record are at the top of the page.... In my case, on this computer, the RME Babyface (and CbB "sees" it as Fireface) is my interface. I am using the ASIO driver (which in general should always be your first choice). HTH t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 15, 2022 Author Share Posted December 15, 2022 Hi Tom, Yes, the preferences for driver settings is as you describe. It's good to know I need to check this so thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 15, 2022 Author Share Posted December 15, 2022 On 12/13/2022 at 7:44 AM, David Baay said: Does this mean MIDI is driving an external hardware synth with no soft synths in the project? Given that you're using a laptop and don't mention an external MIDI interface or other hardware, I would think you must be using soft synth in which case it's not really possible to have timing issues without also having audio distortion or some sort. Or are you possibly outputting the MIDI to the laptop's onboard "Wavetable" synth (let's hope not!). In any case, if these are somehow 'pure MIDI' projects with no soft synths or other audio track content as Mark mentioned, I would suggest a third option for keeping the audio clock active: Enable CbB's audio metronome for playback, output it to a bus, and mute the bus. Usually just having the metronome set to 'Audio' in preferences is enough, but having it actually active on playback can be helpful in some instances. @David Baay Sorry, it was my lousy explanation. My 'tracks' in CakeWalk are all MIDI. I don't have any audio. CakeWalk on my laptop ( with all tracks being MIDI ) goes into our Ui24R. The attached xls file shows how we run this for our standard template. Harley Ui24R-Cakewalk map Jun 25 2022.xls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 15, 2022 Author Share Posted December 15, 2022 On 12/13/2022 at 6:25 AM, 57Gregy said: What software or hardware synth is making the sounds. Press 'P' on your computer keyboard for Preferences. Ensure that setting is to the audio interface or sound card you want to use. Cakewalk in my laptop, hooked up to t our UI24R is making the sound. All tracks on Cakewalk are MIDI - there are no Audio tracks. Harley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 15, 2022 Author Share Posted December 15, 2022 On 12/13/2022 at 3:07 AM, msmcleod said: 2. Set the timing in Project->Clock->Source to "Internal" @msmcleod Hi Mike, I'm not seeing 'Clock' come up in the menu 'Project' . I know I am doing something wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Tim Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 (edited) @Harley Dear Mark means in the Preferences, in this section: You can see mine is set to Audio, he suggests you set it to Internal. Edited December 15, 2022 by Lord Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msmcleod Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 3 hours ago, Lord Tim said: @Harley Dear Mark means in the Preferences, in this section: You can see mine is set to Audio, he suggests you set it to Internal. Only this to internal if you're using pure MIDI tracks, and there are no audio tracks or softsynths in your project. In all other cases, this should be set to Audio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Baay Posted December 15, 2022 Share Posted December 15, 2022 (edited) The spreadsheet reveals the sound source is TTS-1. A synth track is an audio track with input from a soft synth rather than a hardware input; it is effectively the same as a recorded audio track in terms of how audio is rendered, clocked and streamed to the analog audio output of the laptop. As I said previously, I can't imagine how you would have tempo variation from that setup without audio distortion/pitch changes unless there are tempo changes in the project or the MIDI is not in sync with the timeline everywhere. Edited December 15, 2022 by David Baay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 16, 2022 Author Share Posted December 16, 2022 14 hours ago, David Baay said: The spreadsheet reveals the sound source is TTS-1. A synth track is an audio track with input from a soft synth rather than a hardware input; it is effectively the same as a recorded audio track in terms of how audio is rendered, clocked and streamed to the analog audio output of the laptop. As I said previously, I can't imagine how you would have tempo variation from that setup without audio distortion/pitch changes unless there are tempo changes in the project or the MIDI is not in sync with the timeline everywhere. Thanks David. Maybe it's my imagination then ( not dissing your comment at all ) and I'll look at some way to try and get that established/rubbished. I appreciate you taking the time to help me out. Harley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 16, 2022 Author Share Posted December 16, 2022 20 hours ago, msmcleod said: Only this to internal if you're using pure MIDI tracks, and there are no audio tracks or softsynths in your project. In all other cases, this should be set to Audio. Thanks @Lord Tim and @msmcleod for pointing me in the right direction. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 16, 2022 Author Share Posted December 16, 2022 Well, looks like I had it set up correctly. Mmm...maybe Alzheimers is creeping in....certainly hope not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeringAmps Posted December 16, 2022 Share Posted December 16, 2022 Does it matter that Playback is set to 5 and Recording is set to 1? I have always set both to 1. @Harley Dear Also, and I think this was mentioned above, why not record a moment of silence on one track. That way there would be some audio to reference. t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harley Dear Posted December 22, 2022 Author Share Posted December 22, 2022 (edited) On 12/17/2022 at 2:29 AM, DeeringAmps said: Does it matter that Playback is set to 5 and Recording is set to 1? I have always set both to 1. Hi Tom, that's just how it ended up when I set it up initially. Because it worked, I never thought to change it. I'm going through the various CWP files and adding the audio as sugested Thanks everyone for taking their time to help me out. It's really appreciated. Harley Edited December 22, 2022 by Harley Dear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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