CbB for Linux

[Starship Krupa]

4 hours ago, Whinbush said:

Right back at you, Genius, is that all you got, have you ever tried Linux, if so then please share your experience.

"Is that all I got (sic)?" I was merely agreeing with your statement.

Be careful what you wish for.

I've been following Linux' fortunes since early 1992. I downloaded it from a BBS on floppies and gave it to one of my company's programmers because we had chattedf about him using UNIX at university and I thought he would be interested in this thing. I have a Linux box in my home right now, a retired 32-bit iMac.

I've lost track of how many Linux systems I've built. I find the OS fun to tinker with and useful for lightweight productivity things like web browsing, email and word processing. Libre Office runs great on it, so does Chrome, and for the vast bulk of people, that's most of what they do on a desktop computer.

I use my computer for those things, but I'm also an enthusiast of audio production and games, two areas Linux is terrible for.

For audio production work, where it absolutely falls on its a55 is when I try to set up audio on it for anything more complex than an onboard Realtek chip.

For games, nobody makes decent games for Linux.

The usual Linux apologist answer to this is something along the lines of "it's the fault of the hardware companies for not supporting it." "If they would only make games for Linux, people would buy them." Followed by a list of software that actually does support Linux. I've heard the pitch a hundred times, it never changes.

Like Sakini said, I haven't seen a Linux weenie like you in decades. If this is some kind of 90's roleplaying or an elaborate troll, I have to hand it to you, you sound just like they did back then. Participating in this topic reminds me of my younger days, when the Linux-smitten would loudly proclaim how Linux was going to take over the market "real soon now" and that Windows was doomed. I haven't seen one of you boys (and you're always boys) around in a long old time. Here in the Bay Area the younger ones tended to be into facial hair, polyamory and sword collecting and the older ones kinda looked like Hollywood serial killers.

The market has had a very long time to speak, and it has and continues to speak clearly: the demand for audio production software on Linux is tiny. Do not mistake LOUD for large. I imagine that the notable commercial DAW software companies that do support Linux, Cockos and Tracktion, did it mostly to shut the Linux whiners up.

"Linux is no longer an underdog in music creation circles and is much much better than the current Windows offerings, which are terrible."

The first part of that statement is not quite true, Linux, while indeed being a dog for music production, is not an underdog, because to be an underdog, the dog must be in the fight, which it isn't. You think Linux is The Answer. You are convinced that it's going to take over the world real soon now, and that you're smarter about the software market than the people who run Adobe, BandLab, Presonus, Acoustica, Steinberg, Avid, Magix, iZotope, MeldaProduction, Waves, UAD, IK Multimedia and Image Line who are going to be left behind as the Linux platform assumes its rightful supremacy. You're that market-savvy, yet somehow you got the idea that coming to a forum for a Windows-only commercial product and whining and picking fights would be a good way to drum up support for your favorite computing platform.

The current Windows offerings are "terrible?" Cakewalk is a "Windows offering" that you're begging to be ported to Linux. You went on about how great Cakewalk is, you do realize that what you're asking for is a DAW on Linux that works as well as Cakewalk does on Windows. You had to run Windows to know that Cakewalk was so great. And that's pretty much how it is in the world of audio production. The software runs on Windows and MacOS/OSX/whatever Apple's term for it is (funny that when Apple finally realized that MacOS 9 was crap and needed a full rewrite, they had the sense to base its successor on FreeBSD).

Why not just go download a copy of REAPER and use that? Support a company that supports your platform! Boycott the rest into submission. REAPER used to have kind of a Linux-y loudmouth would-you-please-just-STFU culture around it and if you're lucky, you might find some of those people in their user community to hang with.

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

1 hour ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said:

Not to say Microsoft doesn't collect telemetry data, but claiming this is the reason Windows 10 has performance issues is just fear mongering and incorrect.

Oh really, do your homework, they took advantage of the programmer who wrote the Minix OS, to shrink it down even further so they could use it in their spy chip, also tell me why the fan never stopped spinning and the computer could barely do anything under ms crap, yet as soon as Lubuntu or MX Linux were installed the computer fan stopped constantly spinning and the resource usage is barely noticeable, so what was ms doing that required so many resources, I could give many more examples, but I doubt you would believe those either, stick up for ms if you want, they are fully dependent on people like you to cover up for them and keep their gravy train thundering on.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Whinbush

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

1 hour ago, Starship Krupa said:

"Is that all I got (sic)?" I was merely agreeing with your statement.

Be careful what you wish for.

I've been following Linux' fortunes since early 1992. I downloaded it from a BBS on floppies and gave it to one of my company's programmers because we had chattedf about him using UNIX at university and I thought he would be interested in this thing. I have a Linux box in my home right now, a retired 32-bit iMac.

I've lost track of how many Linux systems I've built. I find the OS fun to tinker with and useful for lightweight productivity things like web browsing, email and word processing. Libre Office runs great on it, so does Chrome, and for the vast bulk of people, that's most of what they do on a desktop computer.

I use my computer for those things, but I'm also an enthusiast of audio production and games, two areas Linux is terrible for.

For audio production work, where it absolutely falls on its a55 is when I try to set up audio on it for anything more complex than an onboard Realtek chip.

For games, nobody makes decent games for Linux.

The usual Linux apologist answer to this is something along the lines of "it's the fault of the hardware companies for not supporting it." "If they would only make games for Linux, people would buy them." Followed by a list of software that actually does support Linux. I've heard the pitch a hundred times, it never changes.

Like Sakini said, I haven't seen a Linux weenie like you in decades. If this is some kind of 90's roleplaying or an elaborate troll, I have to hand it to you, you sound just like they did back then. Participating in this topic reminds me of my younger days, when the Linux-smitten would loudly proclaim how Linux was going to take over the market "real soon now" and that Windows was doomed. I haven't seen one of you boys (and you're always boys) around in a long old time. Here in the Bay Area the younger ones tended to be into facial hair, polyamory and sword collecting and the older ones kinda looked like Hollywood serial killers.

The market has had a very long time to speak, and it has and continues to speak clearly: the demand for audio production software on Linux is tiny. Do not mistake LOUD for large. I imagine that the notable commercial DAW software companies that do support Linux, Cockos and Tracktion, did it mostly to shut the Linux whiners up.

"Linux is no longer an underdog in music creation circles and is much much better than the current Windows offerings, which are terrible."

The first part of that statement is not quite true, Linux, while indeed being a dog for music production, is not an underdog, because to be an underdog, the dog must be in the fight, which it isn't. You think Linux is The Answer. You are convinced that it's going to take over the world real soon now, and that you're smarter about the software market than the people who run Adobe, BandLab, Presonus, Acoustica, Steinberg, Avid, Magix, iZotope, MeldaProduction, Waves, UAD, IK Multimedia and Image Line who are going to be left behind as the Linux platform assumes its rightful supremacy. You're that market-savvy, yet somehow you got the idea that coming to a forum for a Windows-only commercial product and whining and picking fights would be a good way to drum up support for your favorite computing platform.

The current Windows offerings are "terrible?" Cakewalk is a "Windows offering" that you're begging to be ported to Linux. You went on about how great Cakewalk is, you do realize that what you're asking for is a DAW on Linux that works as well as Cakewalk does on Windows. You had to run Windows to know that Cakewalk was so great. And that's pretty much how it is in the world of audio production. The software runs on Windows and MacOS/OSX/whatever Apple's term for it is (funny that when Apple finally realized that MacOS 9 was crap and needed a full rewrite, they had the sense to base its successor on FreeBSD).

Why not just go download a copy of REAPER and use that? Support a company that supports your platform! Boycott the rest into submission. REAPER used to have kind of a Linux-y loudmouth would-you-please-just-STFU culture around it and if you're lucky, you might find some of those people in their user community to hang with.

Iinux is on most of the computers on the planet, not windows, there is a reason. Do you know what version of windows NASA uses.

And yes, I like cakewalk, I stripped out windows to make the most of it, yet I still find Reaper more responsive, I put aside the glitches that occurred in Cakewalk after each microsoft updated because I wanted to give Cakewalk the benefit of the doubt, after all it worked until windows changed and broke it, so how could it be Cakewalk's doing. I liked it for sure, but under Linux everything I have tried just works for me, especially without needing the most up to date expensive processors just to keep ms moving along. When I refereed to windows offering being terrible, I was actually talking about windows 10 and 11.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Whinbush

[Sakini]

2 hours ago, Whinbush said:

Iinux is on most of the computers on the planet, not windows, there is a reason. Do you know what version of windows NASA use.

Ok linux is very good for some things(I am also a Linux user since many years) but linux just for linux has  no sense. If you want to make music you will also need compatible softwares, plugins, audio interface etc , computer technology is not the only thing to take into account., maybe it is a  vicious circle but if linux is not used by a lot of people daw/plugins company will not have to spend a lot of money for few people. Will you be ok to pay a linux cakewalk version 2 to 3 times more expensive to to make it profitable ?  

Idem for plugins , hardware ?

 

Edited June 22, 2023 by Sakini

[Bruno de Souza Lino]

35 minutes ago, Whinbush said:

Oh really, do your homework, they took advantage of the programmer who wrote the Minix OS, to shrink it down even further so they could use it in their spy chip

Who are they? Microsoft? Microsoft is a software company. If you're talking about modern CPUs running a MINIX 3 server on lower hardware rings...Do you know how complex modern CPUs are? You can almost count on the fingers of your hands the amount of people that truly understand hardware at component level and those people are too busy being well paid by companies to do actual work as opposed to silly little mind games like "spy chips."

39 minutes ago, Whinbush said:

also tell me why the fan never stopped spinning and the computer could barely do anything under ms crap, yet as soon as Lubuntu or MX Linux were installed the computer fan stopped constantly spinning and the resource usage is barely noticeable, so what was ms doing that required so many resources,

Disabling hybrid shutdown and hibernation usually solves 100% of those issues but at the cost of taking a bit longer to bring the computer back up from a cold boot or full hibernate.

40 minutes ago, Whinbush said:

I could give many more examples

As long as those are concrete examples, unlike your last bit of text...

41 minutes ago, Whinbush said:

stick up for ms if you want, they are fully dependent on people like you to cover up for them and keep their gravy train thundering on.

And I'm sure the whole Linux community must be proud of the disservice you're doing to them.

[Bruno de Souza Lino]

1 hour ago, Starship Krupa said:

The current Windows offerings are "terrible?" Cakewalk is a "Windows offering" that you're begging to be ported to Linux. You went on about how great Cakewalk is, you do realize that what you're asking for is a DAW on Linux that works as well as Cakewalk does on Windows. You had to run Windows to know that Cakewalk was so great. And that's pretty much how it is in the world of audio production. The software runs on Windows and MacOS/OSX/whatever Apple's term for it is (funny that when Apple finally realized that MacOS 9 was crap and needed a full rewrite, they had the sense to base its successor on FreeBSD).

The sad part about that particular statement is that if the current Windows offerings are terrible, then every single company which also makes Linux native software and plugins are also terrible because they all have Windows versions. Even Ardour has a Windows version.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Bruno de Souza Lino

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

1 hour ago, Sakini said:

Ok linux is very good for some things(I am also a Linux user since many years) but linux for just linux has  no sense. If you want to make music you will also need compatible softwares, plugins, audio interface etc , computer technology is not the only thing to take into account., maybe it is a  vicious circle but if linux is not used by a lot of people daw/plugins company will not have to spend a lot of money for few people. Will you be ok to pay a linux cakewalk version 2 to 3 times more expensive to to make it profitable ?  

Idem for plugins , hardware ?

 

Hi Sakini.  Linux has come a long way, there is other Daws to run on it, other plugins, and I just buy an audio interface that works in both Linux, its easy now. As long as what you are using works for you, that's all that matters.  I would just like to see Cakewalk run on Linux, it won't happen given all the opposition.

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

39 minutes ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said:

The sad part about that particular statement is that if the current Windows offerings are terrible, then every single company which also makes Linux native software and plugins are also terrible because they all have Windows versions. Even Ardour has a Windows version.

Why do they have windows version though, because people are tied into windows, it would be stupid not to have them. People are like sheep, they follow, I thought Cakewalk could be a leader, I know and admit am wrong, I was told it before I posted here, had to experience it to be sure.

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

51 minutes ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said:

Who are they? Microsoft? Microsoft is a software company. If you're talking about modern CPUs running a MINIX 3 server on lower hardware rings...Do you know how complex modern CPUs are? You can almost count on the fingers of your hands the amount of people that truly understand hardware at component level and those people are too busy being well paid by companies to do actual work as opposed to silly little mind games like "spy chips."

Disabling hybrid shutdown and hibernation usually solves 100% of those issues but at the cost of taking a bit longer to bring the computer back up from a cold boot or full hibernate.

As long as those are concrete examples, unlike your last bit of text...

And I'm sure the whole Linux community must be proud of the disservice you're doing to them.

No mind games, other than the one your in, never mentioned Minix server either,  you have lost the plot. And no, I am for linux, there are many on here who are not, they are doing the disservice. 

[Byron Dickens]

How do you know that someone you just met uses Linux?

He's already told you 15 times how superior it is.

[Byron Dickens]

1 hour ago, Whinbush said:

Iinux is on most of the computers on the planet, not windows,

Bullshit.

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

Just now, Byron Dickens said:

Bullshit.

 

Just now, Byron Dickens said:

Bullshit.

No, you need to do some research.

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

3 minutes ago, Byron Dickens said:

How do you know that someone you just met uses Linux?

He's already told you 15 times how superior it is.

Who are you referring to,  happy to see you can count.

[Starship Krupa]

1 hour ago, Whinbush said:

Iinux is on most of the computers on the planet, not windows

C'mon, now I know you're roleplaying. That's another one from the Linux moonie playbook: make an unsupported claim that, even if true, would have no bearing on the "discussion." Sure, the fact that NASA uses Linux for some things proves that it's good for audio work!

Speaking of NASA, do you know what audio software they used when studying and cleaning up the audio from Neil Armstrong's "One small step" speech? GoldWave for Windows. Apparently when NASA has audio work to do, they use systems other than their Linux ones.

But really, who gives a crap what NASA or anyone else uses? 

19 minutes ago, Whinbush said:

I know and admit am wrong, I was told it before I posted here, had to experience it to be sure.

So someone warned you away from posting a Linux beg on this forum and you did it anyway? Are most other Linux users as smart as you?

I am about 75% convinced that your schtick is a put-on. Is this for a class you're taking or just your own amusement?

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

2 hours ago, Starship Krupa said:

C'mon, now I know you're roleplaying. That's another one from the Linux moonie playbook: make an unsupported claim that, even if true, would have no bearing on the "discussion." Sure, the fact that NASA uses Linux for some things proves that it's good for audio work!

Speaking of NASA, do you know what audio software they used when studying and cleaning up the audio from Neil Armstrong's "One small step" speech? GoldWave for Windows. Apparently when NASA has audio work to do, they use systems other than their Linux ones.

But really, who gives a crap what NASA or anyone else uses? 

So someone warned you away from posting a Linux beg on this forum and you did it anyway? Are most other Linux users as smart as you?

I am about 75% convinced that your schtick is a put-on. Is this for a class you're taking or just your own amusement?

Don't be confused, I was told this place was closed to Linux, being an optimist I had to check this out, they were right. You all deserve windows, keep on using it. And NASA were using windows 98 when the rest of the ms fan club had moved on, why, because of bugs and instability creeping in. And as for the man on the moon movie, another prime example of people falling for big tech, surly they wouldn't lie or mislead anyone.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Linux Daws Are The Best

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

Anyway, the door is closed, no Cakewalk for Linux.  Moving on.

[Sakini]

I repeat Linux is very good for certain uses. Especially for servers. But does that mean that there is a large ecosystem for music around Linux?

Without ideology, you have to look at reality as it is. How many professional studios use Linux for production?.

The fact that Linux is great for servers doesn't matter if it's harder to find the software you want for music. I buy an android smatphone it's because I can install my applications. And not because android is based on Linux.

If I need to buy a car, I don't need a jet engine just because those engines are absolutely more efficient.

I used Ubuntu Studio for a long time with qtractor, hydrogen, zynAddsubFx , Calf and others software. (I dont like Ardour workflow, that not depends on windows/linux ). all these software are ok, but to switch to a more efficient daw I had to switch to CbB and S1. And so I changed my OS. I chose the OS according to my softwares and not the other way around. The goal is to do music not computer

Edited June 22, 2023 by Sakini

[azslow3]

Since I work and develop under Linux, I always have X2 in Wine, with several Cakewalk and other plug-ins. The rest in Windows VM.

Unfortunately primary music software and hardware is not Linux aware. In reality that could be almost zero effort for plug-ins to support Linux, they all use multi-platform frameworks which are Linux aware. Native Instrument is using Qt (f.e. for Kontakt), which original platform in Linux... But they don't do this. Simply while they can... So for audio recording,  Linux is fine. For MIDI it is not worse the trouble. One day that can flip, as I have written most plug-ins can appear under Linux within a day, there are DAWs there, VST3 is also officially supported on Linux. But till that happens, no reason to convince other DAWs.

BTW most computers in the word are probably running Linux. Just not end-user PCs, which some people think are "the only computers". But there are servers/farms/grids/clouds, Android devices (phones, TVs, etc.), tiny and embedded devices (f.e. consumer routers), which are technically speaking are computers running Linux. Other UNIX direct successors was no longer popular after related companies disappear (SUN, SGE, DEC), but Apple has decided to go BSD way (probably not liking Linux license). Note that many "own ways" Microsoft was trying with time was also replaced by "normal" UNIX concepts. I mean till now no one has really managed to make something better then this "vintage"  concept 😏  

[Byron Dickens]

2 hours ago, Linux Daws Are The Best said:

And as for the man on the moon movie, another prime example of people falling for big tech, surly they wouldn't lie or mislead anyone.

That explains it. One of those "moon landing was a hoax" nutjobs.

2 hours ago, Linux Daws Are The Best said:

Anyway, the door is closed, no Cakewalk for Linux.  Moving on.

Don't tease us like that.

[Linux Daws Are The Best]

57 minutes ago, azslow3 said:

Since I work and develop under Linux, I always have X2 in Wine, with several Cakewalk and other plug-ins. The rest in Windows VM.

Unfortunately primary music software and hardware is not Linux aware. In reality that could be almost zero effort for plug-ins to support Linux, they all use multi-platform frameworks which are Linux aware. Native Instrument is using Qt (f.e. for Kontakt), which original platform in Linux... But they don't do this. Simply while they can... So for audio recording,  Linux is fine. For MIDI it is not worse the trouble. One day that can flip, as I have written most plug-ins can appear under Linux within a day, there are DAWs there, VST3 is also officially supported on Linux. But till that happens, no reason to convince other DAWs.

BTW most computers in the word are probably running Linux. Just not end-user PCs, which some people think are "the only computers". But there are servers/farms/grids/clouds, Android devices (phones, TVs, etc.), tiny and embedded devices (f.e. consumer routers), which are technically speaking are computers running Linux. Other UNIX direct successors was no longer popular after related companies disappear (SUN, SGE, DEC), but Apple has decided to go BSD way (probably not liking Linux license). Note that many "own ways" Microsoft was trying with time was also replaced by "normal" UNIX concepts. I mean till now no one has really managed to make something better then this "vintage"  concept 😏  

Hi azslow3 , happy to hear from you. Good news regarding the midi side, I have a Kawai piano, usb midi out, straight into the laptop running Lubuntu, from there into pianoteq , or even straight into Reaper with pianoteq playing back the sound as a plugin on the midi track. I also connect the mics through a new SSL 12 usb interface into Reaper on Lubuntu, no driver to install, just worked straight off the bat.

Edited June 22, 2023 by Linux Daws Are The Best