Midi & Audio reset causes Kontakt zero volumes

[Jim Stamper]

I  totally messed up a complex mix today.  I had a stuck midi note so I clicked on Midi & Audio Reset. I very rarely have to do that.

Some time later, after a lunch break, I realized my whole mix was out of balance. Then I found my dozens of Kontakt7 (Player) patches were all at volume ZERO!

After more hours and hand-wringing, troubleshooting, and thinking what might have happened, I discovered that the Reset causes this. I can easily reproduce it now.

I tried unchecking the "Other Options" in the Preferences Midi section. I also made sure that Kontakt Instrument Options: Controller boxes are not checked. None of these settings make any difference.

I admit I'm not a midi wizard, but is it really supposed to work this way?? 

[Andres Medina]

I had a similar problem years ago, and this is what was suggested then and it worked:

{in Kontakt] Click on the wrench > INSTRUMENT OPTIONS > CONTROLLER > Uncheck "Accept standard controllers for Volume and Pan" > CLOSE.

Edited June 3, 2023 by Andres Medina

[scook]

I don't use Kontakt but there are quite a few threads regarding Kontakt and the CbB per-project preference setting Zero Controllers When Play Stops

This is likely the cause of the volume change.

[Jim Stamper]

20 minutes ago, scook said:

I don't use Kontakt but there are quite a few threads regarding Kontakt and the CbB per-project preference setting Zero Controllers When Play Stops

This is likely the cause of the volume change.

I saw those posts too, tried it, and it didn't make a difference. This is one of the "Other Options" referred to in my original post.

Also I forgot to mention that none of my other midi instruments (non Kontakt) were affected, they all maintained their Volume settings.

Thanks anyway.

[mettelus]

Something also to bear in mind with some Kontakt instruments is that volume is bound to the MOD wheel (to give a breath and bow effect). As long as you do not touch the MOD wheel, volume will not adjust, but if you touch it once, then you have to either use it for every note played or insert a value for it at the beginning of the track (to reset it).

[Promidi]

Personally, for any given MIDI track or Simple instrument track, what I do is I add an arbitrary volume event (CC7 and/or CC11) at the beginning couple measures ( before any note events.)

[Jim Stamper]

8 hours ago, mettelus said:

Something also to bear in mind with some Kontakt instruments is that volume is bound to the MOD wheel (to give a breath and bow effect). As long as you do not touch the MOD wheel, volume will not adjust, but if you touch it once, then you have to either use it for every note played or insert a value for it at the beginning of the track (to reset it).

Good thought to keep in mind.  I did test that and it's not what happened in my case.

 

8 hours ago, Promidi said:

Personally, for any given MIDI track or Simple instrument track, what I do is I add an arbitrary volume event (CC7 and/or CC11) at the beginning couple measures ( before any note events.)

That's a good idea. It probably takes a little more time overall (adding automation to each track) vs. using the volume control in each patch like a mixer to set levels and continuously make adjustments.  I'm feeling like there's a bug in either Cakewalk or Kontakt which causes my unintended zero volumes when using Midi Reset.

[JnTuneTech]

To add to @Promidi 's suggestion regarding pre-setting the MIDI controls: While I mostly like that approach too, I have recently begun to deviate from that with Kontakt instruments in Cakewalk, because of the unpredictability of mix results when I change the project tracking to another Kontakt instrument and/or version, especially when I have opened old projects that had referenced a different version of Kontakt I no longer have installed, and in the upgrade process (opening a hopefully saved .nki), the volume settings in particular seem to  mismatch.

In my recent projects, I have taken to using no MIDI track volume (cc7) in Cakewalk, -which seems to only happen if I use the default track volume of 101 (or do a reset to that), and let the volume settings saved in the .nki determine the starting point. -On a case by-case basis anyway, as of course if later, I want to program using CC7, I make a note of that, and carry on as usual. -So far, most of my instrument volumes seem to stay put more often that way, when switching things around and back again, to open on other systems, etc. -Maybe that's just me though.

@Jim Stamper - Did you mention what volume control in Kontakt is affected for you?  Does the volume slider in the instrument GUI, or the Kontakt instrument header, show the change to zero as well? Or is it more like a mute button function reaction? -If you, for instance re-load the .nki of your instrument, does the volume return to normal that way?  How are you dealing with the aftermath? What control do you use to bring the volume back up again, and does it stick?  -Also, I would highly recommend not saving a mix right after hitting the Cakewalk reset function - though I know that can be problematic on its own...

[Jim Stamper]

On 6/3/2023 at 3:47 PM, JnTuneTech said:

 

@Jim Stamper - Did you mention what volume control in Kontakt is affected for you?  Does the volume slider in the instrument GUI, or the Kontakt instrument header, show the change to zero as well? Or is it more like a mute button function reaction? -If you, for instance re-load the .nki of your instrument, does the volume return to normal that way?  How are you dealing with the aftermath? What control do you use to bring the volume back up again, and does it stick?  -Also, I would highly recommend not saving a mix right after hitting the Cakewalk reset function - though I know that can be problematic on its own...

The volume controls affected for me are every volume control in every patch I have loaded in the Kontakt GUI. The track volumes (set at 101) are not affected. I don't know about the Kontakt master volume, I didn't notice it - I've probably never changed that control away from the default. To deal with the aftermath ... I located an older version of the project (lucky to have one that was not affected), I saved each of those Kontakt multi's as a new multi (so it retained my desired patch volumes).  Then in the new project I replaced each Kontakt multi with my newly saved ones, then all the volumes were at the right level again. I just have to be careful from now on not to hit Reset for a stuck note. In fact the stuck note was not even in a Kontakt instrument, it was a different VST.

Edited June 4, 2023 by Jim Stamper
clarification

[JnTuneTech]

6 hours ago, Jim Stamper said:

The volume controls affected for me are every volume control in every patch I have loaded in the Kontakt GUI. The track volumes (set at 101) are not affected.

Wow, and thanks for replying.  -I do a lot of work with multis and back them up too, just for that type of thing, in fact. I will now be sure to look out though, and maybe I will test some of my stuff (with backups in place) with the reset function, to try  and dig deeper and to see what the deal is.  -I would say - good to know, -but since we haven't solved anything for you, for now again just thanks for the detailed info!