copied midi notes are not played in Kontakt and Reaktor instruments in cakewalk

[Istvan Karsai]

This is puzzling and Native instruments say it is a cakewalk issue and I was unable to find help there and this does not occur on other daws it seems

I started this project with importing a midi file into cakewalk. Then instead of routing these midi  tracks to new instruments, I opened up new instruments tracks and copied the midi notes into these new tracks giving the old file a new set of instruments while avoiding routing the midi tracks into instrument tracks (by using a single combined track instead). 

 Several NI instruments behave the same way such as Monark, etheral earth and so on. Most Kontakt and Reaktor instrument:

They are unable to play these copied midi notes. 

While other instruments such as Massive, Prism or from other companies I tested Synth master player had no problem to play these copied midi notes.

If I play with the midi keyboard or I add notes by hand into the same piano rolls the cakewalk plays them, but not the copied ones.

It would be interesting to learn, if you had any similar experiences and why this happens at all? It does not make sense to me, but maybe several NI instruments are reading midi notes in a different ways. Anyway if you have any thoughts on this please respond. Thanks!

[Glenn Stanton]

maybe check to see if the notes are playable by some other VI? like SI-strings has a wide range of notes covered to see if they're in range? check to see if the notes have velocity? that they are of sufficient duration to sound what the synth is set to? 

 

[Istvan Karsai]

Thanks

This is not the issue. If I add notes to the same place bt hand it is played. Monark playes the whole scale, but these copied notes remain silent. The velocities of the notes are ok

Other instruments can play them, just these Kontakt and Reaktor based are not

 

 

[Glenn Stanton]

so if you enter a number of notes manually, and they play, then you copy those and paste them into a new measure - do they still play? and if you copy them into a new track - same? 

[Istvan Karsai]

Thanks for responding.

I imported the midi file. I want to use the midi notes, but with  different instruments.

I open a new instrument track and I copy the midi notes into the instrument track.

Kontakt and Reaktor instrument will not play the copied notes

other instruments will play the notes, so if I change to Si instruments or Massive or others the notes are played back normally

If I add notes by hand or play by midi keyboard into those Kontakt intruments ,those are played, but not the notes I copied from the original midi track

This is the puzzling case. The copied midi notes work with other instruments. The Kontakt instruments are working with notes I enter and not copy.

I also do not route the old midi track to other tracks. I just copy out the midi notes.

Thanks

Istvan

 

[Glenn Stanton]

maybe when you copy them, your channel settings are copied? and if those don't align with Kontakt then they won't sound. check the copied MIDI track channel settings vs the Kontakt settings for that instrument. otherwise, i have no idea why it's not working...

[Istvan Karsai]

Thanks

I tried that and it is not the channel setting. I am really out of ideas

 

[treesha]

Ive had it happen that a midi note wont sound in a particular Kontakt instrument because the instrument does not play in that midi octave, like the midi note is too high or too low for that instrument. 

[Mark Morgon-Shaw]

Did you check the Mod Wheel isn't acting as a volume control and in the down position - Check the Event List of the copied midi data for anything other than note data that may be causing it 

[Istvan Karsai]

Thanks

I tried that and it is not the channel setting. I am really out of ideas

 

problem with Kontakt.cwp

[Glenn Stanton]

it's because you're not using Kontakt... you're using Komplete Kontrol... load up Kontakt on your synth rack and it will work...

Edited August 29, 2023 by Glenn Stanton

[Istvan Karsai]

thanks for the kind suggestions.

It is not about the playable octave. I tried those instruments that plays wide range of sounds

This is happens even if the midi controller is not plugged in and the volume is up when I am looking at the faders. It is true that the mode wheel problem exist with NI instruments, but it does not mute completely the sounds and NI seems to work on this issue, but In this case is not the mode Wheel. 

I made a miniproject here uploaded. It contains the imported midi file and 3 instruments set to play the same sequence I copied out from the midi track.

 

track 1 Si piano

track 2 Monark a Reaktor synth

track 3 Hibrid keys Kontakt synth

If you do not have the last 2 replace them with any reaktor or Kontakt instruments

 

The last 2 will not give a sound

If you enter notes by hand or midi keyboard on the same tracks those will be played.

On the NI site they tried this with other DAWs and it was not the case like this, The NI site people do not have Cakewalk or they did not help.

I hope this community can figure this out, because this just does not make sense!

Thanks

Istvan

 

 

problem with Kontakt.cwp

[Istvan Karsai]

I used also Kontakt directly instead of Komplete Kontrol and the result is the same

[Glenn Stanton]

worked for me. i created a MIDI track and dragged your MIDI over, set the ch  to 1, opened kontakt with a synth. a new audio track with the output to st1+2.

Edited August 29, 2023 by Glenn Stanton

[Istvan Karsai]

Here is the new version I also made a direct Kontakt instrument instead of using KK. I even upgraded my Kontakt player into Kontakt 7 full version.

The result is the same No voice is played with these instruments using the copied midi notes. These instruments play happily any notes I play on the keyboard or write in myself, but not these copied ones

Thanks

Istvan

 

 

problem with Kontakt.cwp

[Glenn Stanton]

and yet when i take your file, create a MIDI and audio track and set it up - works fine. maybe stop using the simple instrument track.

problem with Kontakt (1).cwp

[Istvan Karsai]

Glenn thanks for the advise. I am a beginner and so far I mostly used the simple instrument track.

I tried to reproduce your setup based on the picture but it does not work or I do something wrong.

Could you send an other pic focus on the routing or send back the cakewalk file?

Istvan

 

[Istvan Karsai]

Glenn, I found that you sent back the file I just thought it is the same file I sent out.

As I see you have some audio interface which I do not have I have only the soundcard so I can not set it up as you did Instead I tried an alternative what  the pic shows below and it works. So it seems for some reason the simple instrument track does not work in cakewalk in case of Kontakt and Reactor instruments. We need to use a separate midi and instrument tracks.

Glenn I was trying this problem for days. I am grateful that you provided an idea and solution for this on the same day I posted this stuff. Many thanks for everyone!

If anyone knows how to solve this with a single instrument track please still write it here. Very best!

Istvan

 

 

[Glenn Stanton]

using preferences you can change the HW settings... 🙂  glad it worked! i suggest getting in the habit of separate audio and midi.

Edited August 29, 2023 by Glenn Stanton

[David Baay]

On 8/29/2023 at 10:54 AM, Glenn Stanton said:

check the copied MIDI track channel settings vs the Kontakt settings for that instrument.

This. The MIDI events are on channel 4 (see the Event Inspector or Event list), and the Kontakt instrument is set to channel 1. For a Simple Instrument track you need to go to the MIDI tab in the Track Inspector to access the forced output Channel widget, and set it to 1. Or change the Kontakt instrument to channel 4. Or use the Event Inspector to change the channel of the note events (does not change controllers, but that's not a problem in this case).