User 905133

See reply above.

It might not have been clear, but I have been using TTS-1 for a long time. I also started using TTS-1's ports successfully years ago. However, I was using PatchMix DSP, so I had absolutely no need to learn another method. I thought it was clear in the previous post that I had gotten access to the TTS-1's ports within Cakewalk and could assign FX to different TTS-1 channels ["parts" in Roland-speak] using Aux Tracks yesterday. It seems like you guys are describing another method. ADDENDUM: I will double check my method, but it worked last night. Of course, maybe you guys are doing something that I am not and that's what's causing your crashes? If so, it might be good to figure out what that step is.

For the sake of comparison I am calling this ^^^ Method 2. (2a): Did you insert the TTS-1 with the Instrument Track per Output checked in the Insert Soft Synth Options? (2a var 1) Not yet. First I tried my go-to insertion method: right click in the track area which brings up the wizard. Instrument Track Per Output selected. Note: only a single instrument gets inserted. (2a var 2) Tried my alternate insertion method: drag plug-in from Browser to track area. Four tracks were created. (2a) Tried the new menu menu system route Menu Bar > Insert > Soft Synth... > flyout menu > Cakewalk folder. Four tracks were created (but it took longer than var 2). (2b) Then you go into the TTS-1 settings and assign each "Part" to an output. This is consistent with what I have done for years. (2c) You then route those 4 to some master or main output. I generally go directly to output channels, but I can try this with Method 2. (2d -> 2etc.) The other steps you outlined above are pretty much part of any common sense workflow, and maybe I will try another time to duplicate those methods and variations to try to see if I can make TTS-1 crash on my PC. But first, I wanted to double check my method. I'll call it Method 1 for the sake of comparison. I'll call my original method (the one using PatchMix DSP) Method 0. So, I opened the file using Method 1 from last night. It works as I described. I only used 3 out TTS-1's 4 ports, but it still works--meaning I can pile up FX in each of the three FX bins. As I said, I have an older computer and if I tax the CPU beyond its abilities under normal conditions, I run the risk of adding audio artifacts. But that's not unique to TTS-1. I'm not here yet (16 individual TTS-1 tracks/channels/parts each with its own FX). It might be that these steps go beyond how TTS-1 was intended to be used and are what causes the crashes you guys see. I have a lifelong history of pushing the limits of the technology I use, but for me finding the limits and then using the technology up to that point and not beyond is par for the course.

QUICK UPDATE: I opened your file, loaded TTS-1, pointed track 2 to TTS-1, it played. 1st reply: I am not awake yet, my audio interface has not yet been booted, and only took a very brief look at the midi data. Its a shot in the dark, but see if the attached tweak plays. Explanation for 1st reply (just some background): Some software synths have been known to become silent when certain midi data is sent to them. Others have noted that "Pitch Bend Sensitivity" data does this with some synths. That's why I suggested it initially. However, when I tested your file with TTS-1, PB Sensitivity (which is in track 1) did not mute TTS-1. I did try it with another soft synth (Dimension Pro) and sure enough, track 2 played, but when I pointed track 1 to Dim Pro, it became silent. Rather than delete the admittedly shot-in-the-dark reply, I figured you might run into this issue somewhere down the road based on the data in track 1 in this file. snowstorm--PSSensitivity removed.mid

Not sure if this is how you did it, but it seems to be part of the missing link. My workaround involves creating Aux Tracks off of the TTS-1 Track and assigning them to the TTS-1 Outputs. From there I just moved the FX plug-ins to the TTS-1 Output Tracks. So far, no crashes, but I only have 2 or 3 plug-ins on each of three TTS-1 Outputs. It seems that with my workaround, I now have what you described here (using Cakewalk instead of PatchMix): So, thanks for helping to lead me to this. There are other things I used to be able to do with PatchMix that I have been sorely missing. Maybe using Aux Tracks, Patch Points, Sends, etc. I might find more workarounds using Cakewalk. As for trying to recreate the kinds of crashes you and others have, I will have to spend more time on that. For me, the time has been worth the effort because it seems to be useful for routing methods I thought I would never get back. Other relevant resources I found: http://www.cakewalk.com/Documentation?product=Cakewalk&language=3&help=Mixing.13.html

That's what I originally thought you meant in the first place. I was able to use TTS-1's four outputs with my E-Mu PCI Card. I did it using the PatchMix DSP utility [a mixer where I could had up to 32 ASIO Input Channels and and up to 32 ASIO Output Channels and could use them as sends and returns in various ways, including with SONAR/Cakewalk Tracks as well as other software]. But, I have not been able to do that ever since a Windows update made the card useless except for ADAT Clock and a Firewire port. I might be able to set it up with my current interface. Not sure. I'd have to consult the manuals, sort out the available options, and test it out. But, evidently your solution is to use Cakewalk's Console and I suspect Aux Tracks or something else to provide the functionality that I had with using TTS-1's four outputs and PatchMix. That is the missing link I need to teach myself if I am going to try your method. I would need a workaround in Cakewalk for what I used to do with the PatchMix Console. PS: I just took another look at the SOS article you linked. If the explanation of how to do in Cakewalk what I did in PatchMix DSP is in there, I didn't see it. BTW, after the Windows Update made my PCI Card 85% useless, PatchMix no longer boots. Otherwise I could look at my ASIO Channel routings and try to reconstruct them using Cakewalk. I could try to reconstruct it in SONAR X1 under XP SP3.

I think I still have a free Kontakt variant, but I never use it. My experiences with multitimbral synths come mostly from 1980s/1990s/2000s hardware (Sequential Circuits Multi-Track, Casio CZs and VZs, Rolands, E-Mus, and a few others). As for TTS-1, I took a midi file I've had for a while ("Whitebird") which I once tweaked to play on a Roland M-GS64 (Sound Canvas variant, not unlike TTS-1). Opened it up in Cakewalk 2021.04 and pointed all tracks to a single instance of TTS-1. Looks like there are 7 or so channels of MID data. While playing it, I started piling up plug-ins in the TTS-1 FX bin. So far: TH2 SONAR, the Gated Snare Reverb FX Chain with Cakewalk Compressor/Gate and Sonitus Reverb, AIR Chorus, TR5 Metering and Lurssen Mastering Console (graphic activity usually elevates my CPU power), and Amplitube 4. So far its all MIDI playing the one TTS-1 with the plug-ins. If I understand the use case you described, I need to render each MIDI channel to its own audio track so I can have separate FX on single tracks. Or is there an easier way to get FX on individual tracks (without using TTS-1's 4 outputs)?

Thanks for the clarification. Yeah, I thought "assigning the multiple audio outs in TTS-1" meant using TTS-1's 4 audio channels. I can definitely use up to 16 forced midi channels and one instance of TTS-1 using the MIDI output track control/widget (typical multitimbral synth). With my current set up I can try adding some audio plug-ins to see if it I can get it to crash. That being said, today I was testing some TRacks FX (not in TTS-1, though) and one caused the infamous Unhandled Exception Error. It was one of the FX that need to be purchased and Cakewalk didn't handle it well.

Yesterday I started to try this. However, with my current audio interface and settings I cannot hear the four different outputs simultaneously. I was able to do that previously, with a different interface that had a more flexible ASIO channel routing system. Maybe someday I will change my setup.

Please notice what I wrote: esp. "for some of us." I did not say "for everyone." Please understand that not everyone has the same experiences. You can contradict me, but that doesn't make you right. Also, doing an internet search and finding "people battling it as far back as 2006" does not disprove that, "TTS-1 has worked flawlessly as intended for some of us over the years." I have seen people talk about issues with TTS-1. I never doubted their experiences. We all have different experiences. We all have different preferences. We all have different workflows. Obviously my experiences are not the same as yours. I stand by what I wrote.

Thanks for clarifying this. I was thrown off by the following: I now understand that you were saying (correct me if I am wrong):

@msmcleodCan I set up personal defaults so that I always get the tempo track and inspector with the settings I have above? I think I recall your saying recently that Tempo Track settings do not get saved in Workspaces. Thanks for any tips on how to do this.

Glad you got it solved. FWIW for years (but not recently) I have used Cakewalk/SONAR to backup and restore bulk data dumps from a number of modules--including some with terrible small buffers (VZ-8m), Proteus 2000-based gear (202K/206K sized banks), among others (probably the P/1+ Orchestral, too). I do remember having to tweak the sysx parameters occasionally, though I haven't been doing much bulk data dumping/restoring since starting with CbB. A few years ago I started using a patch librarian an E-Mu gear user developed. If someone has developed a librarian for your gear, that might be a better route if you create your own banks or if you want to juggle presets/patches from a number of different banks. For restoring banks your solution is ideal.

Using Window's file properties, you can edit them from CbB's Media Browser. Right-Click on the MP3 File. Choose the Details tab. Edit.

As a Cakewalk user since it was a MIDI sequencer (pre-Digital Audio versions), I don't do much with tempo changes, but I used your question as an opportunity to try the new Tempo Track. I didn't try using an loading an old file, but I was able to get something that looks like the traditional tempo view. It was a quick test (my first time trying the new Tempo Track). [references to the Early Release program (including feedback/bug reporting) removed since 2021.04 has now been released.]

That's the Devo version, right?

Maybe someone can figure out why TTS-1 has worked flawlessly as intended for some of us over the years? Perhaps there's something about it that makes it not work properly on newer computers with CPUs and other chips/devices built past a certain date? Toward that end, I'm willing to test drive on my PC a few TTS-1 only *.cwp files known to crash on other systems.

Got the concept down. Thanks!!

So far my theme personal tweaks have not gotten into tweaking the strips, but now that I know what's up with them, maybe I might look into it. So thanks to @murat k. for raising the issue and to @Colin Nicholls for providing the explanation. Let me see if I understand it. I booted the editor and selected Tungsten as the base for a potential new theme. Correct me if I am wrong: the Original Plug-in Tree Icons [strip] is the base editor strip and the one above it (Theme) is the strip as it is in Tungsten.

Thanks for the clarification.

No forward and back-and-forth in plugin? = ???? Guess # 1: ???? = Ctrl+Z doesn't get passed on to plug-ins Guess # 2: ???? = Ctrl+Z doesn't do anything in the Cakewalk interface itself. Until we get clarification, your guess is as good as mine.

Thanks for your thoughts and for the opportunity to clarify. My initial reason for showing the image here was to suggest that if vision/size/resizing is a concern, potential buyers might want to wait until there are some changes to CV-1 to use their 15-day trial. Today I started to assemble some images to show more. I have a draft of a CV-1 within VM within CbB that shows a comparison. So far as I can tell, the nested images reflect the size of CV-1 in standalone mode as well. Yes, I tried those panel controls, but on my PC they just changed the visibility of the left/right/bottom panels. I also tried the resizing triangle in the lower right hand corner of the frame (both within Cakewalk and CV-1 standalone). As for resizing, I much prefer that software handles that itself; I really don't like to change my monitor settings to adapt to software. On my PC some plug-ins can be resized within CbB by changing the size of the plug-in frame. Some plug-ins don't. Some have artifacts and behave badly when resized. In my experience on my PC, CV-1's content doesn't resize within CbB or in standalone mode. The frame gets bigger but the plug-in's visual content stays the same size. This might vary on other PCs. One of my concerns was a comment that CV-1 might make a good starter software modular to learn on. That was also part of my reasoning for addressing the resizing issue. As I mentioned, I like the crispness of many of the AAS sounds I have (based mostly on the free AAS Player, the Session series, and VA-3). Yesterday I listened to the CV-1 sounds and those have a similar crispness. In fact, I have tested a number of those as plug-ins within VM's plug-in hosts. To me they all work well within VM's control environment. I assume AAS will work on improving CV-1.

I was curious about this. I don't design entire themes, just elements as I need them, so I wanted to try to match the view that you use. In the image you posted, the elements are there, but you can't see them well because they are dark grey on a black editor background (Dark setting in the editor). They are more visible if you use the Light setting. Are you saying the issue is with the color of the icons Cakewalk uses in the Tungsten Theme? (I don't generally use it, because I have trouble with the preponderance of greys and black, black on greys, etc.). Or are you saying the image elements used with the Dark setting within the Editor are not the ones actually used in Cakewalk?

One of the nice things is that we all have different preferences, workflows, learning curves, etc. Learning curves really vary from person to person probably based on prior experience among other factors such has how a person's brain works. I lucked out decades ago by getting in on the ground floor when my college got a Moog modular synth. Based on that, I gravitated towards E-Mu's digital synths (Proteus/1 and later sound modules) which had virtual patch cords--digital counterparts to what I was very familiar with. So, when I stumbled onto Voltage Modular, designing presets and making music by choosing modules based on functions, patching them together, etc. was quite natural for me. It just makes more sense because I can see what's what. Personal preference. Some people have no desire to create sounds and prefer to use presets designed by other. IMO, there's nothing "wrong" with that nor with creating music with "real" instruments or with purchased sounds, loops, etc. designed to impress people. Also, I don't think there's anything "wrong" with people who post songs they made in various online locations, again, all designed to impress people. Granted, modular synths (hardware or software) may not appeal to you. That's fine, too.

If you prefer Instruments (as opposed to Voltage Modular modules) and if you haven't invested in VM yet, I would encourage you to try Nucleus (currently free**) first to see if you can get into modular sound design. With your interest in the VM2500, you might want to wait to see if they come out with an Instrument based on the modules. Cherry Audio has done that kind of thing before. Also, in the chat for the video demo someone asked if CA would be developing an instrument version and the reply (something like "anything is possible") leads me to believe it is indeed possible. Personally, I like VM--a lot!! So, I am not trying to talk you out of at least trying to get into it. But if funds are an issue, if you might prefer a VM2500 as an Instrument (if that is in the works), and if you are unsure about the modular learning curve, getting Nucleus and waiting a bit might work for you. **Just checked CA and PIB--free at both; might be others offering it free. There's a risk, though. You might really like VM and within 24 or 48 hours you might spring for Core and some modules. ?