Corrupted project

[David Pollock]

I have a huge (for me) project that I've spent untold hours on that has become corrupted to the point it is useless. I must get it working again so I can finish it or I am going to go in the backyard and eat worms. I've read through this post (https://discuss.cakewalk.com/index.php?/topic/55942-whole-cakewalk-is-extremely-buggy-unworkable-cant-take-it-anymore/page/2/&tab=comments#comment-423770) and tried a couple of things as a result as well as other things with no fix. At present, when I open the project, clicking around in it to do anything, CW responds slowly (i.e., clicking on a track doesn't immediately highlight it; it takes a second). But the killer is that once I hit play, CW doesn't respond to anything I do. I have to close it with task manager. So obviously, the project is completely unusable as it is. Previous to this issue, the project became increasingly sluggish--that is, CW responded a second or two later to whatever I clicked on. This became particularly troublesome when drawing envelopes. 

The project has 45 tracks of midi playing EastWest Play instruments exclusively. It's about 40 minutes long (an orchestral piece). Uses some Sonitus plugins and a couple of Play plugins. 

Things I've done:

1. Verified that other projects with Play instruments work as expected. So it is clearly and issue with this project.
2. Installed CW on a laptop and opened the project there. It also froze (though I don't have the huge Play instruments on that machine).
3. Created a new project with 45 Play instruments in it and a few measures of notes. No problem with it.
4. Back on my main computer, played the problem project with FX turned off (no change)
5. Deleted individual plugins with no change.
6. Made a copy of the project. It also froze.
7. Deleted the first track where I have done the most work recently (a cello instrument) but no change.
8. Deleted the first 8 tracks, no change.
9. Deleted all the tracks after the first track (so just the first track left), and while CW did not become unresponsive, it was still sluggish.
10. Deleted the last 20 tracks. Plays without becoming unresponsive but still sluggish.

So I cannot identify a track or plugin that is the obvious culprit though some seem to contribute to the complete unresponsiveness, but I cannot eliminate the sluggishness that also makes it unworkable. 

As described before, as a precursor to this problem, drawing envelopes became a nightmare because CW became sluggish--displaying the envelope a second after drawing it and also drawing jagged envelopes instead of the smoother ones I was drawing (and yes, Snap was off). I had thought it was this way for all instruments, but I just realized some of them do not respond this way. Again, they are all Play instruments but perhaps some differences I do not yet understand. 

I think my system is sufficient to handle the project. See attached info. In addition to that, I have two SSD drives and the Play samples are on the second drive. 

What else can I try??

 

[gustabo]

Have you tried freezing any of the tracks?

[John Vere]

A common way to deal with a corrupted project is to start a new project and copy the data over. There’s a few options available you can try. 

First save the project as a template. Now open the template and see it it is also acting up. If it is, then the issue is with in the project file itself and not you audio or midi. This is not something you can fix so you need to abandon the project file and rebuild. 

If it seems fine then you can use it to rebuild by copying the data from the corrupted project. I would test each track as I go.  

Second method:

You say this is all midi. Save the project as a midi file.  Now open that and replace the instruments.  This is especially preferable because the midi clips will be in the correct places on the time line. I am not dead sure about automation but I would hope it is saved as midi events.  
 

Any instruments or effects used you would save a preset and name it. When inserted into the fresh project then recall the pre set. 
 

Edited June 3, 2023 by John Vere

[David Pollock]

41 minutes ago, gustabo said:

Have you tried freezing any of the tracks?

I had not, but I just tried on the first track (took about 7 minutes) with no change.

[gustabo]

4 minutes ago, David Pollock said:

I had not, but I just tried on the first track (took about 7 minutes) with no change.

I would try freezing quite a few tracks to see if it makes a difference, but then again, it sounds like the project itself is corrupted.

[David Pollock]

7 minutes ago, John Vere said:

A common way to deal with a corrupted project is to start a new project and copy the data over. There’s a few options available you can try. 

First save the project as a template. Now open the template and see it it is also acting up. If it is, then the issue is with in the project file itself and not you audio or midi. 
If it seems fine then you can use it to rebuild by copying the data from the corrupted on. 

Second method:

You say this is all midi. Save the project as a midi file.  Now open that and replace the instruments. 
 

Any instruments or effects used you would save a preset and name it. When inserted into the fresh project then recall the pre set. 
 

Thanks. Saving as a template and playing it caused the same issue. So the issue is with the file itself according to your suggestion. 

It's going to be a pain to go the midi file route because I have to figure out how to recall the specific instrument variations for each track, but I'll try. However, I saved the project as a midi file--twice--and when I open it, I get just 16 tracks. The second time I tried that, I selected all tracks thinking perhaps I had 16 selected the first time, but I still got just 16 tracks, and the only track with midi data is the first one. I have no idea what that's about. 

[John Vere]

Can't say I ever created anything with more than 6 midi tracks in my life so I was unaware of the 16 track limitation. I guess it saves by the Channel. SOmeone else here must have experience with this. 

Then seems your best route would be a fresh project. It will be a lot of work but it is possible to do. 

Just  an Idea,  but what about saving the originals track by track as track templates? 

Create an empty project  then populate it with the track templates. 

I think if you put a midi event at ground zero in each track then you can drag those from project to project and they will be in sync. 

And I think You would need any Banks and Patch changes stored in the track header and not the Instrument. 

Edited June 3, 2023 by John Vere

[Lord Tim]

It sounds very much like there's something causing Play to freak out in this somehow.

Capture a Crash Dump the next time it hangs and get that to a Baker:

You'll get confirmation of what's going on rather than us regular users taking guesses at it.

The other thing I can suggest, if you're open to it, is to send the project (minus any audio if there is any) to one of us to see if it opens. I'm not sure how many of us have Play but seeing as you tried that on your laptop and that doesn't have Play installed and it still froze, it'll be an interesting exercise to see if it does that for other people, and if not, what are the common elements between our systems and yours.  I'll be happy to have a look if you PM me.

Other than that, it's really hard to say what's going on here. That core spike you're seeing could easily be just from the Play usage alone, so I'm not sure we could point to that as anything conclusive.

[Will.]

Yikes! EastWest? Yeah! It is troublesome. I too, have had a similiar experience. Luckily mine started with only 3 instances of it. 

The NKS files with NI Kontrol worked with that specific project for me. 

[JnTuneTech]

4 hours ago, David Pollock said:

I still got just 16 tracks, and the only track with midi data is the first one. I have no idea what that's about. 

In case it helps, that sounds like you may have selected to save as MIDI type 0, instead of type 1, in the Cakewalk save as dialog. -Type 0 saves all MIDI in one track, with only MIDI channel data per event as a differentiator between all the data you had originally created. Type 1 will save each MIDI tracks' data referenced by its original channel assignment, as a track, as you had originally organized them in Cakewalk - normally.  Though if there is corruption, maybe that is also not working right - hard to say from here.

[gustabo]

Have you tried changing the streaming option in Play from disk to ram or vice versa?