Unable to Sidechain In Softube Console 1 [SOLVED]

[Geoff Merson]

I have recenty bought a Softube Console 1 and it works brilliantly, except that the external Sidechain function can't operate, as Cakewalk seems not to recognise it as having that ability.

I have enabled DAW intergration, including Sidechain. It is also VST3, which is required for that.

Attached are files, showing the Sends context Menu, showing Sonitus with the Sidechain option, and Console 1 without it.

Any advice appreciated, thanks.

Edited July 25, 2023 by Broken Silence

[scook]

I don't have the device so this may not help at all...

The labels shown in the drop down would be up to the plug-in and not the DAW.

The DAW does not know what purpose the input serves.

Here is an example of FabFilter Pro-C sidechain input in CbB, the plug-in in instantiated on the TTS-1 track 2, the image shows the track 1 menu w/ Pro-c in the sends

"Input 2" is likely the sidechain input in Console 1 too

IOW send drop down labels are constructed by appending the plug-in name with

• secondary plug-in input pair names supplied by the plug-in  (there could be multiple input pairs which would result in multiple send selections) and
• track name

[Geoff Merson]

Thanks Scook.

I was thinking along those lines as well, but it doesn't appear that way so far, because when External Sidechain is selected with it's button on the C1, there are no LED's indicationg that any reduction/compression is happening, no matter what the threshold or ratio. I've tried increasing the gain on the send, but no luck so far.

I must be missing something, probably really obvious.

[scook]

I assume the send feeding Console 1 input 2 has audio clips in the track and not relying on live input.

If the sidechain needs to receive live input, input echo would need to be enabled on the track sending the data.

[Geoff Merson]

1 hour ago, scook said:

I assume the send feeding Console 1 input 2 has audio clips in the track and not relying on live input.

If the sidechain needs to receive live input, input echo would need to be enabled on the track sending the data.

SOLVED.

Yes, audio clips.

It turns out that you were correct about CONSOLE 1 (Input 2) being the Sidechain path. I opened a new project to experiment, and used a lead guitar with long notes to trigger the C1 compressor on a rythm guitar track, and it definitely ducked.

My guess is that either (from the project that I thought it wasn't working) the kick triggering bass compression was to rapid for me to hear. The Kick drum is pretty fast on that song, and I don't know how much can be expected from side compression, as this is the first time that I've tried it.

I don't see much pointin this thread clutteringup the forum, as there's not much that any can learn from this, so be my guest if you wish to delete it.

Cheers.

[scook]

this isn't clutter

it is good information

thank you

[Geoff Merson]

1 hour ago, scook said:

this isn't clutter

it is good information

thank you

Cheers. I think I know what the problem was, but not sure why.

I used an Aux track. I'll try to explain why.

Intention: Compress the Bass Guitar first for good sound, then use sidechain comression from the Kick Drum track to duck the Bass on those beats. I can't (I think) use the relatively minor compression settings, as well as SC  to duck with sidechain from the Kick, as that would need different Comp settings; so...  : I make an Aux send from the Bass channel. I put Console 1 on the Aux track and send the Kick to the Aux channel Side Console 1. That way, I hoped, I could then duck the already compressed audio from the Bass channel, on the aux' C1 side comp, but the compression meter is unresponsive as well as the comp'.

There must be something about Aux sends that doesn't alow this? If so, is there a way of acheiving what I want? The only other way I can think of, is to mix down the audio from the compressed Bass track, import that track as a replacement, and then use S-Chain? Or do you know a better way?

Sorry that this sounds a bit covoluted, although I've had CW since Sonar X1, I've only recently been trying to get my hands dirty under the hood, and no amount of googling comes up with any answers. 

Edited July 16, 2023 by Broken Silence

[scook]

Does it all have to be done on the fly?

Wouldn't it be easier to

• Get a good bass sound
• Print it and archive the raw bass track
• Duck the new good sounding bass.

 

[Geoff Merson]

16 hours ago, scook said:

Does it all have to be done on the fly?

Wouldn't it be easier to

• Get a good bass sound
• Print it and archive the raw bass track
• Duck the new good sounding bass.

 

Yes, that's what I'm thinking as well. Thought I'd try to se how much I can do on the fly.

I got some stems from my old band, and tried it again with Aux tracks and it worked (side chain). So, with no experience of coding, as in how Cakewalk is 'written', I just guess.  C1 wouldn't load up the channnel strip after I changed my mind about sends (on the project I first reffered to) and re roted them, so I guess that CW keps a record of previous sends and keeps them, even after they've been deleted; it seems that way.  I could be totally wrong,; guessing is what I'm doing.

 

Yeah, Scook, this thread might be useful. Someone else might encounter the same.

Cheers.

 

 

[Geoff Merson]

I tried it again, and it worked (side comp) with Aux tracks (with C1 on).  Seems that if an Aux track is created, then deleted, that CW 'remembers' it, and dictates the  past routing from that (?).  C1 was flashing (tracks) and highlightng a track/channel, that no longer existed. It could be C1, rather than CW, of course. Implementation  isn't the same as Mackie; being bespoke software, so each DAW will act differently (guessing again).

That said, I've got sidechain working. on Aux (Scook I get your comment, and could just do that (bounce it down, then sidechain it), but I wanted to try it on the fly; and found out, it can be done, I don't know the proper teminologies, so my posts might be confusing.  

Cakewalk is an exellent DAW. I first got a Tascam 4 Track. Then I got a Zoom Mrs  1608, which was a game changer. I then got a PC, and because Sonar X1 Essential was affordable to me; I got that. Upgraded to X2 Studio, and X3 Producer (can't resist that shiny). Got used to the workflow of CW.  I'm okay with a new version being paid for. There is this version, available to all, and very capable DAW. The fact that, after Gibson, Bandlab took CW on, and made it available to anyone, considering the decades of work that went into it....well, who can honestly complain?

I've heard peole's songs on these forums in the past, and they sound good. I'll post mine, once I'm in the ball park of sounding presentable.

 

Cheers for the communication, Scook, and take care you all.

[scook]

FWIW, Aux tracks are just regular audio tracks with a patch point as its input.

They follow all the rules of regular audio tracks.

IIRC, there is some garbage collection of unused aux tracks and patch points, but I don't recall exactly how it works ATM

 

CbB has only two basic track types

• audio
• MIDI

All tracks in the track pane are based on these two basic types.

Aux track = audio track with patch point input

Instrument track = audio+MIDI track pair pointing to the same soft synth (aka simple instrument track)

Synth track = audio track with synth input

 

[Geoff Merson]

Scook, I think you're right.  I don't know how it works either. I watched a video about CW patch points and got cramp from shrugging my shoulders too much (doubtless, there will be an occasion when I use them (one day)).

Yeah 'Garbage' is probably a good description., as in, it's stil lin my back yard, even though I got rid of it.  You're right; Aux does act like Audio tarcks; I think (guess) thast I rearranged sends, and CW kept the original links, if my terminoligy is okay?

[scook]

A OK

[Geoff Merson]

2 hours ago, scook said:

A OK

I've seen videos of putting kit pieces of, for example Addictive Drums 2 on to seperate channels in CW, and recording them as audio tracks, but the youtube videos that I've watched put each channel as separate MIDI tracks. I know a way (discovered) that is quicker. I was thinking about puttting it up on the forums (I'm no good at making videos, so probably screen shots), if it's of use to anyone, but I doubt that I'm the only one that knows this method.  Would that be useful to anyone?Also, in the case of AD2, I found a way to separate every kit piece, if needed, so that Overheadds an Room becomes Crash and Ride (without bleed from other kit pieces), in the case that you might want to put the drums on the same reverb bus, without AD2 fx adding to it and making mud. It can be saved as a preset, then loaded up in a project when required.

[scook]

Cakewalk published AD2 templates a few years ago

IIRC, the AD2 multiout templated used a single MIDI track, definitely before the introduction of instrument track per-output was added to CbB, 

 

If you feel like putting together a text/image-based tutorial there is a dedicated Tutorial forum

There is also a dedicated forum for templates

 

Bear in mind there is a 50MB per-user upload quota. To avoid the quota, I use https://imgur.com to host images and Google Drive for files to download and link to them in my posts

[Geoff Merson]

Okay. I wasn't referring to templates per se. What I'll , when I've got decent screen shots and have thought of a good way of wording it, is to post it on the links that you suggested. There is a use case for it.

 

What I've got into doing lately, is sendingtracks to Aux and each Aux has a delay vst on it. The delays  have no repeats (feedback) but one 'echo' these Aux' then get sent to a Reverb bus. With each Aux, the delay time ms varies, giving the impression of distance between instruments within the same space (reverb channel). I know that this cannot be a new idea. With a drum instrument synth, however, (AD2 in tis case), the Overheads and Room are already fx'd, and affected by all other kit pieces.

Basically, it's  a shorcut if someone wants every kit piece on it's own, to process to their own taste. I'll put it up, when I can present it well and it will probably make more sense then. I'll also have a go at making a video, but it will be recorded on a phone (no proper camera), but if it's clear I'll have a go at that.

[scook]

That's fine

I prefer simple screen capture software such as ScreenToGif and LICEcap over phone capture for video. LICEcap is easier to use, ScreenToGif has more features. Try them both.

Windows Snipping and PrintScreen for images

 

 

[Geoff Merson]

Yeah, same here. Just thought if I was able to make a decent enough video, I could put it on Youtube, as naration might explain it better. LICEcap looks useful. Is that the same cockos that makes Reaper? I'll put somethiong up when it's good enough to understand. I don't know all the lingo, so some of what I'm saying may not be clear, unless I give an example. I'm keen to show what I do with AD Drums, because I expect there will be situations when people could make use of the methd that I use.

 

[Geoff Merson]

BTW, I did get thesidechain to work on an Aux and also to send the Aux to another Aux (for pre delay to reverb bus), and the original yrack muted (send pre fader). It is to do with changing my mind, or getting muddled up with sends and CW 'remembering' them, I think. I know it sounds over the top, but I like to create a believable space by varying delays and routimg them to the same reverb 'space'. I'm probably over complicating, but I enjoy having a go at these things.

Edited July 17, 2023 by Broken Silence

[scook]

13 minutes ago, Broken Silence said:

Yeah, same here. Just thought if I was able to make a decent enough video, I could put it on Youtube, as naration might explain it better. LICEcap looks useful. Is that the same cockos that makes Reaper? I'll put somethiong up when it's good enough to understand. I don't know all the lingo, so some of what I'm saying may not be clear, unless I give an example. I'm keen to show what I do with AD Drums, because I expect there will be situations when people could make use of the methd that I use.

 

I mostly use LICEcap for this forum. It is from the REAPER dev,

ScreenToGif allows image editing with text which can be handy.

ScreenToGif can edit LICEcap captures or any animated gif.

 

Video production for Youtube is a completely different subject better discussed with others.

[Geoff Merson]

Thanks Scook, you've been helpful. I've visited these forums for about 10 years, and you've always given good advice. Apart from the posts I've put up in the past, probably on the wrong thread and probably obvious newbe stuff, I've usually found an answer from your replies to other people's queries It's good not feeling patronised by asking something that to some may be obvious, but without knowing,... . ask someone.

Cheers.