Bug with clip export: routing through send causes clipping

[Sean Aitken]

I was noticing that when I exported clips from an old project that the resulting WAV was clipping. The original audio on the track had plenty of headroom. After a lot of trial and error, I discovered that it was because I had the track routing through another BUSS (in this case vocals). No additional gain was applied. When I changed the track to route directly to my main outs (audio interface channels 1/2), and then exported clips, the problem was gone. No more clipping.

I would expect that if I'm routing to another send, then to mains, that the volume would remain the same.

I'll work out more details tomorrow, but it's definitely a problem.

[Bristol_Jonesey]

This might be because you have 2 or more pairs of hardware outputs active in the project and you select "Entire Mix" for the export.

This happened to me years ago because I'd set up outputs 3/4 to feed a headphone amplifier.

My exports using Entire Mix were always boosted by 6dB

The solution, as you have found, is just to use Main Outs in the Export dialog

Edited April 19, 2023 by Bristol_Jonesey

[Sean Aitken]

I'm not sure that's it. It's the "export clips" preset, which does seem to use the hardware output. I have 28 tracks in this project. Many are sent to a stereo buss, such as "Vocals", "Instruments", "Drums". I was going to create a video, but didn't have the time. The solution I found was to select all tracks, then using "Control+Click" on the output, set all to "Main Mix". Now when I export all clips, they are fine.

I just checked, and I have no additional sends on any of the affected tracks. It's like because they are being sent to the stereo BUSS before routing to the main out, that the problem occurs.

The routing was simple. Track -> Stereo Buss track (or whatever it's called now) -> Main Out. No additional gain was added, or FX. I triple checked. It seems like a legitimate bug. I'm going to do with with a few projects soon, and will try to create a video showing what's going on.

Note: The only reason I'm doing this is because export to OMF crashes Cakewalk, so this was the next best option.

I've used Cakewalk / SONAR for many MANY years... I'm still a fan (although I've kinda moved on to Cubase - mainly because it's cross-platform).. As a software engineer myself, this is the type of bug I would want to squash!

Edited April 20, 2023 by Sean Aitken

[Sean Aitken]

Here's a video demonstrating the issue. I start with the track routing through a stereo buss ("Vocals"), then opening the resulting export in WaveLab, clearly showing the clipping. Then I switch to Main Out, and no clipping. Simple.

 

[Andres Medina]

Sorry, it was a bit hard to see clearly the details of your video, but I have had a similar issue, which was my fault. Not sure if this applies to your problem.

When exporting, I used the export preset Tracks Through Entire Mix, which sum all hardware outputs, which were two (Main Out+Speakers Out), so the audio was clipping more or less depending on the fader position of the speakers out. In this case, the solution was to mute the speakers out on exporting, as the preset by its nature sums all outs.

Double check that your export preset is the right one, and if it is, that the settings are correct.

 

[Sean Aitken]

That's good to know! In this case, the clip export feature is ideal, as it eliminates the silence, and with broadcast WAV, when I go through the import process in Cubase (through the media pool), I can add them back as tracks, with the clips in their original location (and it seems to also preserve the slight overlaps, where I can quickly re-create fades).

I'll play with the settings some more on the next project I need to do the export. Maybe one of the devs can take a quick look, or someone can see "oh, this it what you're doing wrong" based on the same exact scenario.

Thanks a ton!!