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Tez

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Posts posted by Tez

  1. On 8/14/2020 at 12:56 AM, noynekker said:

    I haven't had that problem, just the load times are much longer.

    Ditto... I also got the Tonal Balance Bundle, everything but O9, the O9 individual module VSTs and Tonal Balance load quickly, but these slow pokes take 15-20 seconds, once loaded no problem, and the standalone starts up fine...

    @noynekker Out of curiosity  what machine do you have I'm wondering if it's an OEM issue as this slow load time also occurs in another DAW not just CbB & Splat for me. If it's a registry issue iZotope support hasn't helped, and all my other iZotope plugins load just fine!

  2. 1 hour ago, Desert Hermit said:

    Thank you, Tez!!

    You're most welcome, I wish someone could have told me, and saved me more than 2 weeks of "Sturm und Drang" tracking it down!

    Just be aware if you're still in warranty,  you might want to let it run at startup after which manually stop it. In my case I'm out of warranty so, it's completely useless to me and I disabled it... Happy music making 😁

    Meanwhile I have another problem, namely Ozone 9! I have Ozone 9 Advanced as part of the recent iZotope Tonal Balance upgrade at a terrific price and just couldn't resist despite my O9 issue which is the VSTs including the individual module VSTs that's part of O9 Advanced all take 15-20+ seconds to load in Splat and CbB & iZotope support say's all is fine at their end. All other iZotope  products I have load quickly, it's just O9. If you know anything please share , or for that matter anyone who sees this... 😟

  3. 1 hour ago, bitflipper said:

    It does not.

    And that also applies to MIDI input regardless. PDC is only for live input, so the only way around it is to bypass all effects or Isolate the heavy delay comp plugin & take it out of the signal path manually which is not too convenient and maybe  a bit complicated to do, when the objective is to temporarily reduce the apparent midi latency to record a midi sequence... Pity...

  4. Yes, the reported issues are broader than XPS! I think I noticed ACPI potential issues when not using a tweaked "High Performance" power plan, so hopefully  it's mitigated by the plan.  The bios was updated recently, via dell's update service (manually initiated),  and what the change log was I didn't find out. Dell notifications pop up for updates, but I've found it's best to ignore them as they can fail or worse a potential security risk, and then initiate the update manually.  I'm highly disinclined to disable the network (goodbye internet), or any  interdependent services. But this "remediation" service had no dependencies and is supposed to be explicitly a hardware check at startup,  why it ran continuously is beyond my ken, and I surmise was interfering with hardware interrupts so, bye bye!

    Meanwhile, there's no guarantee spikes won't occur, if for example you have a SCSI drive that gets woken up to retrieve a large amount of data that could do it. Despite that kind of event, minimizing dropouts to near zero when exclusively using the DAW is the goal 😏... 

    Oh, and by the way another annoying service is the "Intel(R) Security Assist" Security Helper, which repetitively runs the isaAgent.exe pinging some intel back channel and failing,  and no one seems to know for what reason? That also can be stopped, one less network stress!

  5. Once pointed to LatencyMon I started running it to identify ISR & DPC spikes and spikes = audio dropouts! “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.” Well, that’s how it felt, I’d make changes to the system, do another run with similar if not identical results. Mostly graphics drivers, occasionally the HD Audio bus drivers and related kernel drivers would spike... But there were others though less frequently, and each time for the past couple of weeks, following a failure, I’d scan the drivers for viruses, google the web for potential solutions for these diver latencies. Power tweaks were all done, background apps were blocked in settings, USB, ethernet and power management options were changed, but every 20+ minutes or less a spike would occur depending on when I started a LatencyMon run. This is a ubiquitous issue for gamers, audiophiles and the like with a glut of solutions from tweaking the bios to re-installing or updating drivers and other tweaks. My drivers, bios and w10 are all up to date, and I concluded that LatencyMon shows what spiked but not why, and can send you off down a maze of rabbit holes, so I figured it might be specific to the machine OEM...

    I’ve got a Dell XPS 8900, and I noticed a “Dell SupportAssist Remediation” service running, and it turns out other Dell users had issues with this service. This service is supposed to scan the system on startup for hardware issues and auto generate a support ticket if any are found but only generates the ticket if you’re not out of warranty, and I am, hence a completely useless activity! What it’s doing beyond startup I dread to think!

    I disabled the service and ran LatencyMon for over an hour without spikes and similarly a CbB test project for over an hour without any dropouts...

     

    So, if you’re CbB on Dell user with a similar issue, maybe this tale of frustration and anxiety might help ☺️

    • Like 4
  6. 30 minutes ago, Kevin Walsh said:

    I do hope that you find the performance  you're looking for with the set up you have.

    Well, on an optimistic note just before crashing I decided to run my test one more time, only this time I checked the "Always Open All Devices" option, the performance module showed CbB happily bouncing though each logical core, and it ran for more than half an hour with no dropouts. The interesting thing was that LatencyMon showed a spike on a graphics related driver, issued it's red audio issue warning  right in the middle of the test, but as stated CbB was unaffected 😁...

    So I can sleep a tad better tonight. But... I'll have to run it for longer tomorrow and hopefully with the same result. On my prior PCs all had third party sound cards installed as a build option, but not this one, and I'm not good at playing with a pc's innards, and external devices had their drawbacks back then. Anyhoo tomorrow's another day...

  7. 21 hours ago, Kevin Walsh said:

    HDAudBus.sys is the high definition audio driver for your computer

    Yup that's the ISR which I believe kicks off Wdf01000.sys - Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, Microsoft and that's the spiking DPC. It turns out the latency issue with Wdf01000.sys is all over the web going way back and no solution that I can find, except to bypass windows drivers altogether and ASIO4ALL has been updated since 2017... So will keep looking for a solution...

  8. 2 hours ago, Steve Harder said:

    That totally stopped my audio engine dropouts.

    What were your dropout codes?

    Well, one and all thanks again for all your input! I have to remark that with 4.01GHz core and 32GB ram my system should be amply audio capable, and by and large it is. The test performed (described above) does nothing but stream audio silence to the FXs. LatencyMon shows several drivers with spiked DPC execute times, and these cause underruns resulting in an Audio Engine dropout 1.

    Namely the Kernel Mode Driver Framework Runtime, I believe triggered by the High Definition Audio Bus Driver and also the Port Class (Class Driver for Port/Miniport Devices) used by audio devices, and in this case both I believe are audio related, and last the NVIDIA Windows Kernel Mode Driver, which is up to date as is W10. This test was also done with no internet, no router and the AV off, same result. These sporadic spikes are the problem, the performance tweaks are in effect, so the question is what is causing them. If anyone has had this particular issue and has fixed it please let me know...

  9. So far, conducting multiple tests as described above:

    And using the settings described in the OP, the audio dropout 1 occurred after about 15 mins and  LatencyMon showed a big  spike in HDAudBus.sys driver. No event errors occurred during the tests, and the same result occurred  for several test repetitions .  Incidentally,  running LatencyMon  whilst writing this without CbB running, just the browser, the same spike occurred.

    The system is always up to date, so as to what this means I'm far from sure, is it the driver's poor performance or the task using it, CbB is using WASAPI, the browser isn't.  Power throttling is disabled, no page faults occurred for CbB, and it seems this spike is the best candidate for the dropout, although other spikes possibly misleading, can show up. So I'm at a loss as to how to fix this. As to Realtek ASIO I share the opinion of  Mr @scook ...

  10. 3 hours ago, JonD said:

    but I'm not clear on if you did the tweaks

    Not as yet, just being cautious, but if as you say there's no down side, I'll see what relevant. The "power/USB management" did pique my interest as the midi input is via USB, but as I mentioned for the test above the midi was not active, and the dropout occurred regardless with no activity whatsoever.  Other than the mouse as far as I'm aware, there's no other USB input I use for CbB. So I'm curious, in what way is it crucial, and am I missing something?

    Anyhow thanks for your help, much appreciated!

    Update: Just applied the power option tweaks, much of the others like "Privacy Options" were off or just don't apply to my system and for the moment deferring the optionals. I just realized that I can always revert to the previous "Preferred" plan if "High performance" has issues. So, will see if this improves dropout frequency first...

    Update: Just ran my test mentioned above, unfortunately despite the tweaks an Audio Engine dropout 1 occurred  with no activity or midi input whatsoever. So, hopefully LatencyMon will reveal something...

     

  11. @JonD I just ran a test with a project where my synth is Pianoteq with Ozone 9 in the FX  rack, and REmatrix  in the prochannel  of a bus. The midi input for the synth was set to none, the echo was off and the midi keyboard was switched off. I walked away for a while to see if a dropout might occur with no activity or midi input. Without fail it did,  an Audio Engine dropout 1.  My question is, if you  might know,  how would I use latencymon to track down the cause, as it seems to me for this scenario something  might well be affecting CbB. I'm assuming that the "LatencyMon.exe" is a standalone app not an installer?

  12. 3 hours ago, gustabo said:

    Do you have core parking turned off on your machine?

     

    Well, when I check the resource monitor all cores are active, if parked it should say so, no? I was under the impression that desktop w10 core parking was disabled...

    3 hours ago, JonD said:

    Have you run latencymon to determine what process(es) might be causing the dropouts?

    I'm not familiar with latencymon,  something I'll have  check out. For DAW tweaks I've got the pdf "Tweaking Windows 10 for Music Production" from Creative Source, some of it might be appropriate, but this is not a DAW dedicated machine, maybe one day I'll be able to afford one, meanwhile I have to exercise caution...

    Regardless, thanks guys for the input,  if some process or another is the culprit, hopefully I can track it down, this might be the case as I've noticed dropouts on simply opening a minimalist project... 🙄

  13. Even on projects with a single synth and only a couple of FX plug ins, Audio engine dropouts keep occurring. These are the basic settings: WASAPI Exclusive, Buffer Size: 40.5 msecs, Multiprocessing Engine checked>Plugin Load Balancing checked, DropoutMsec: 1000, Midi Playback: 1000 msec buffers (the max allowed).

    I still get too many Audio Engine dropouts: mostly 1, occasionally 9 and even a 3. Dropout 1 often happens when nothing is going on, no activity, no midi input. I started using WASAPI hopefully to eliminate this plague of dropouts. If someone has any suggestions to fix this I’d be grateful...

    My system should be well able to handle CbB performance, basic specs can be found here: 

     

  14. I think I've narrowed the issue a little . For a completely blank new project, no buses, no tracks, no vsts, the template generates all the buses present when initially saved. For my 5.1 speakers, using WASAPI exclusive, this was set to 3 hardware stereo outs, but the template in this case only shows the 1st hardware out, which maybe an old issue.  For a new project template that has some of the buses included in the track template the existing buses will persist. Saving the template without the existing new project's buses  and inserting it into new blank project as described in the OP, half the time there is no issue, the behavior is as expected, but sporadically it will shutdown cakewalk on project close. It seems there's a conflict  with a new project's existing buses and the track template's version of the same, and probably something more. So, I think this is a bug...

  15. @Base 57 I'm not surprised you couldn't duplicate 2 & 3, it probably depends on the track template in my case the synth was pianoteq, the FX Ozone 7 and the audio out generates 3 buses, an input bus, a verb bus which uses Rematrix in the ProChannel   and mix bus for the input & verb which sends to the pre-master. I also have a template that just generates the 3 buses mentioned using a blank audio track in the track pane, and guess what... Scenarios 2 & 3 don't happen. So, I'm speculating that it's an issue with how the FX and synth instances are being handled in the specific context in the OP. Now using the blank audio track bus template and independently inserting Pionoteq and the FX , for each new untitled project, scenarios 2 & 3 don't happen. Whatever's going on  must be complicated 🙃 ...

    Update:

    It seems the issue resides with the track template used in the OP, namely just creating a new blank project as before an inserting the track template in question, on closing the untitled project without saving also closes Cakewalk, this should not happen, typically the Start Screen should be invoked. So now I'm really confused 🙄...

  16. I have a blank project template with an empty track pane and 2 buses, a pre-master with a send to the master which has all the sends to the hardware outs.

    Scenario 1.

    Create a new blank project, and immediately create a second new blank project. The window tab only shows the last blank project.

    An addition to the track pane of a project has to be made for a subsequent new project to appear in the window tab.

     

    Scenario 2.

    I have a vst3 synth track template, Midi source, Synth track folder and 1st audio out to a specific bus configuration and an audio FX in the rack.

    Create a new blank project, and insert the track template, create a second new blank project and insert the same track template.

    Close the first new project without saving and the Cakewalk app closes.

     

    Scenario3

    Create new projects as per Scenario 2, and for each perform a “Save as” so now these are no longer untitled projects.

    Close the first project and the Cakewalk app closes.

    Last, since the projects were saved opening each one in the same cakewalk session, the behavior is as expected, namely closing one of them does not terminate Cakewalk and the other remains.

     

    This all seems a bit buggy to me...

  17. Make sure you delete the synths and the associated tracks from the Synth Rack view, then try, "Save As..." from the File Menu, and choose a different name, then close the project and open the newly named project. If  the problem persists it maybe you don't have full administrator privileges, then try launching Cakewalk as an administrator, and see if that's the issue, on saving your modified project.

    These are just suggestions of things to try, otherwise it doesn't sound like a CbB issue perse...

  18. @Base 57 Agreed, the Aux tracks need to be selected as they're just audio tracks with an aux input patch point,  but the bus does not need to be selected.  Since buses can be abandoned in favor of Aux tracks, it's tempting to think of them in the same way 🙄...

    1 hour ago, Base 57 said:

    However the hardware out is not recalled properly

    This also applies to a generated Aux track as it's an audio, just as initially described for the audio track in my OP...

    • Like 1
  19. 1 hour ago, Base 57 said:

    Just to clarify, This is a problem with Track Templates.  For me Project Templates are working as expected.

    I concur, Project Templates under WASAPI so far hold their assignments as saved.  With Track Templates, in addition to my OP, it should be noted that if the saved template has sends assigned to Aux Tracks, which are not present in the project these Aux tracks do not get generated, maybe this is to be expected as they are not buses,  but if so why not? With regard to Aux tracks, if  a project a track has a send assigned to to Aux track, and the given Aux track is renamed, this is not automatically reflected in the sending track, but the actual assignment still persists. Just another quirk, this doesn't happen for bus assignments, which always match the bus name.

  20. Under WASAPI with multiple stereo hardware outs there are 4 selectable options from 1/2 to 7/8.

    The simplest scenario for odd track template behavior is to create an Audio track with the primary out assigned to 1/2, insert a send assigned to 3/4, and save the track as a track template.

    In a fresh project insert the track template previously saved and the “send” is not present as saved, just the primary out. Further, if the previous assignments were 3/4 for the primary and 1/2 for the send, not only is the send eliminated on the track template insert, the primary defaults back to 1/2. Similarly, if multiple sends to hardware outs were inserted, they would be eliminated.

    If there’s a “master bus” already in the project with just a primary assigned to 1/2, I observed the template track primary defaulting to the “master bus”.

    The above is just one case of track template functionality not as you would expect. In the case were a track template ought to generate buses and these buses send to hardware outs, there are additional problems which arise, with the generated buses. This probably should be checked out. If bus and aux track generation is not guaranteed for a track template when not already present in a project this should clarified.

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