Introducing Cakewalk Next and our new brand identity

[Wookiee]

Just now, Jesse Jost said:

Suitable for an off-Disney nightmare

What no Pineapple (Controversial I know but Wookiee's like a little pineapple with their cheese) 

[Milton Sica]

I have a proposal to make to friends of the community, considering that, apparently, at least not until now, registration and participation in the forum will still not be charged.

Therefore, I think we should leave this post aside and create a topic where we, users, could actually help each other.

The topic I propose is that it be an evaluative approach of all DAWs available on the market, considering prices, features, etc.

In my case, I live in Brazil to buy $1 dollar I pay R$5 reais, 1 Euro pays R$6 reais, 1 pound pays 6.50 pounds.

When DAW was free this financial reality did not exist.

Now yes ! Which, of course, must have been included in the world-scene assessments of its use.

[Bruno de Souza Lino]

35 minutes ago, Will. said:

The team is working on the "Software" not the website ?

 

36 minutes ago, Jesse Jost said:

You should also note that the forum website and our codebase have about as much in common as pineapple and a motorcycle.

Yet had time to change it to be this pixaleted mess and expect me to trust that you can do vector graphics properly.

 

[Milton Sica]

3 minutes ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said:

 

Yet had time to change it to be this pixaleted mess and expect me to trust that you can do vector graphics properly.

 

There's so much talk about those pixels that I was remembering someone's comment on the forum that DAW is for music creation.

Unless I have missed something and have to learn to use PHOTOSHOP , COREL DRAW .....

[Bruno de Souza Lino]

2 minutes ago, Milton Sica said:

In my case, I live in Brazil to buy $1 dollar I pay R$5 reais, 1 Euro pays R$6 reais, 1 pound pays 6.50 pounds.

Based on general pricing of DAWs out there, I'd expect to pay between 2000-2400 BRL and 4000-4200 BRL for a perpetual license assuming the currency prices for USD and EUR don't change.

[Keni]

Let’s think about this.

The Bakers don’t want Sonar to perform worse than CbB... so maybe we should give them the trust and faith that they too want it working well!

I know it’s hard for me, but a little patience is probably the best I can have right now.

 I am very excited !

Edited June 8, 2023 by Keni

[Milton Sica]

7 minutes ago, Keni said:

Let’s think about this.

The Bakers don’t want Sonar to perform worse than CbB... so maybe we should give them the trust and faith that they too want it working well!

I know it’s hard for me, but a little patience is probably the best I can have right now.

 I am very excited !

I think most of us still don't realize that the relationship has completely changed.

When the programs are free/free, what is created is a participatory, collaborative community, where everyone seeks the same end, which is the constant improvement of the program.

The company, unilaterally, which is its full right, will change this relationship.

It's kind of like a marriage where the couple owns a joint business and one of them files for divorce but wants to keep the business.

The relationship changes completely. It is no longer partnership/collaboration, but consumption with completely different relationship rules where even that affectionate codename (BAKERS) no longer makes sense.

[Milton Sica]

28 minutes ago, Keni said:

Let’s think about this.

The Bakers don’t want Sonar to perform worse than CbB... so maybe we should give them the trust and faith that they too want it working well!

I know it’s hard for me, but a little patience is probably the best I can have right now.

 I am very excited !

I think most of us still don't realize that the relationship has completely changed.

When the programs are free/free, what is created is a participatory, collaborative community, where everyone seeks the same end, which is the constant improvement of the program.

The company, unilaterally, which is its full right, will change this relationship.

It's kind of like a marriage where the couple owns a joint business and one of them files for divorce but wants to keep the business.

The relationship changes completely. It is no longer partnership/collaboration, but consumption with completely different relationship rules where even that affectionate codename (BAKERS) no longer makes sense.

[chris.r]

1 hour ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said:

Looking at this absolute masterful piece of job, I have my doubts:

Well suited for lo-fi music FWIW.

[Byron Dickens]

57 minutes ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said:

 

Yet had time to change it to be this pixaleted mess and expect me to trust that you can do vector graphics properly.

 

What part of "the people who work on the DAW don't create the website" is so hard to understand?

[Herbert Zio]

1 hour ago, Milton Sica said:

Upon being paid, it enters the market where the cost/benefit ratio is evaluated.

I fully agree. After all, having to rely on third-party plugins or applications to perform functions that are native to other paid DAWs is something I believe they are working very hard to bring to the new Cakewalk Sonar DAW. I hope that the suggestions for improvements and workflow that have been presented to Cakewalk since 2019 are implemented and not overlooked. Otherwise, we will see a major exodus of users (which I find obvious). When it comes to paying, competition becomes strong and opens up a range of other options. I am eager to see the new Cakewalk Sonar and whether it will be worth the investment in 2023 or if it would be better to switch to another paid DAW.

[Colin Nicholls]

EDIT: Dead horse, already dead, almost unrecognizable. Sorry.

Edited June 8, 2023 by Colin Nicholls

[chris.r]

5 minutes ago, Colin Nicholls said:

11 hours ago, Helios.G said:

Just saw a preview of pricing.  Apparently $499 is the price for the top tier level.  It scales down from there.

By all means get your information from an out-of-date google cache. This is almost certainly archaic pages from the olden times. The image in the preview and the other text refer to Sonar Platinum.

Wow, those were the times. I paid slightly above $100 for lifetime updates on biggest discount and was watching every penny closely on both sides before spending. Decided to go for it mainly to get things like Addictive Drums 2, Pianoteq or Melodyne, in addition to the full Sonar version, but also because I realized that I wasn't in position to shell out a hundred or more $$ every year for keeping the DAW current.

[Alan Tubbs]

One also has to figure in how much time and cuss jar fees are involved in learning a new DAW.  If you get older such becomes a real time suck.  I can barely find time here at home to work on music.  I certainly don’t want to spend that time re-wiring my brain when I could be creating.  And at this stage of my life I can afford money over time and whatever Cake charges doesn’t touch the hardware here at home.  Just got a new mk5 ultilight to use with last years summing mixer.  And that doesn’t include other software like pigments and and the new crop of granular reverbs which all  run les than $100.  But for most of my career such was real money and a much bigger investment, so I am sensitive, but also cakewalk or whatever we decide to call the company and software needs to live too - otherwise I’ll spend all my time learning software instead of using it when they go the way of the dodo Gibson.

for giggles I’ll put out a spec sheet:

Next - I’m not sure what it is.  A step up from the free Bandlab software? Maybe pay.  Hopefully you can use it on the Mac so cakewalk can have an in there.

And the new Sonar, stripped down or for owners of previous or paid versions maybe  $100.  Maybe $200 for new users if it includes some starter native effects.  The pc eq is great, the 1176 is usable and the ssl buss is great and as good as you are going to find natively.

then as stated above you could bundle the synths and other fxs.  Comes with rapture super pro for another $100.  A whole synth bundle with Zeta2 and some new libraries another $50.  The la2a comp (another very good emulation) and some special stuff like the aforementioned granular synth, as well as a good, naive and natural reverb.  Even tho I’ve spent plenty of money on those a good bundle would be hard to skip.

plenty of other ways to skin the DAW.  But if you bought Sonar years ago you can’t really think 6 years of upgrades don’t need paying for, well, you get what got (I’m assuming cakewalk by Bandlab will still work for a while).

a sensible price will keep most users and cakewalk can continue to add features and toys that most of us will eagerly lap up.

 

what do you think will work?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[scook]

7 minutes ago, Alan Tubbs said:

what do you think will work?

this is the puzzle

[Canopus]

1 hour ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said:

Yet had time to change it to be this pixaleted mess and expect me to trust that you can do vector graphics properly.

 

1 hour ago, Lord Tim said:

I dunno how it looks on your machines but this is scaling pretty well for me for a bitmap image, and much less pixelated than the one you posted. Perhaps your browser or display scaling is set incorrectly?

I think you’re both right; it simply depends on which browser you’re using. In Chrome the logo looks good enough, but in Firefox it looks quite pixelated.

<nerdy-details>It's because BandLab in the css selector #logo used the declaration “image-rendering: crisp-edges”. Chrome says that's an invalid property value and simply ignores it, while Firefox accepts it but turns the logo into an 8-bit  experience. </nerdy-details>

Oh, well. There are bigger problems in this world right now.

[Bapu]

With all the talk about the good, the bad and the ugly *everyone* seems to overlook the greatest thing Meng ever did.

He carried forward my post count from the old forum.

That alone gets my money for the next SONAR version.

[EnglandBross]

don't joke about the pizza please, I'm Italian ??

 

[Adam Brannon]

On 6/7/2023 at 2:08 AM, flangad said:

 

and what would you think of such pricing model:

release different versions of the software, based on a number of monthly usage hours. example:

- if you need less than 15 hours/month of Sonar usage, it remain free (you are a very casual user)

- if you need less than 50 hours/month of sonar usage, you have to pay a "small user" price

- if you need more than 50 hours of usage/month, you are an advanced/professional  user, so you have to pay a higher price.

don't you think such model could be fair and acceptable for everyone?

You could also have another "dimension" in pricing:

- one shot subscription: you get the software with time unlimited bug corrections but no future functional updates (you have to pay another 1 shot "upgrade subscription" to go from version N to N+1 or get a pack of new major features) , community support

-Premium yearly or monthly subscription: include functionnal updates as long as you renew your subscription , community suport

- professional yearly or monthly subscription : add premium support with SLA, chat/webconferencing, if possible multilingual

 

so you will get a price matrix like this: (see attach file)

 

It would be nearly impossible to maintain a pricing structure like this. The standard in the software industry is a price that comes with 1 year of free update (bugs, features, etc). At the end of that year, you have a choice, pay for another year of updates or don't. Regardless, you still have a working piece of software. This scenario is technically a subscription, whether you pay once a year or every month. When you decide not to pay anymore, you no longer get updates. But the software as it sits at that point in time is yours to keep using as long as you choose. You get what you paid for, no more, no less. There are very few companies that have a "pay or loose access" type of subscription model. ProTools is one of them. Adobe is another. As mentioned in an earlier post, I think the term 'subscription' is being highly misinterpreted. 

[Jacques Boileau]

Not knowing the price point of the new products, it is hard to make an opinion if it is worth it or not. We shall see when it is announced. I would certainly pay a reasonable amount of money to keep going with it. Of course reasonable is different for everyone and everyone's need. If you are a professional studio it is quite different than someone in a bedroom studio doing it as a hobby. And that also makes a difference for subscription vs fully paid. As a hobby, there may be many times (breaks, vacation, etc) where it would feel some months subscription payment hasn't been used.

I would personally probably be interested in a third product: Cakewalk Basic! If that would be at a lower price point of course. Everything that CbB does, without any plugins or Pro Channel. We all collect plugins, some free, some paid, and have probably enough to do all we need. We also have some preferred plugins we all use that replace many if not most of the plugins in Cakewalk. I know about the saying: you can do everything with stock plugins. But the reality is that, thanks to @cclarry , we still go outside and get some plugins for free, or very cheaply, we can use instead... and probably made to think they can do better than the stock ones! Even if we know it is not often true. It might still be refreshing to see a DAW being just a DAW.