2021.04 Feedback

[msmcleod]

45 minutes ago, David Baay said:

Hi Mark, can you expand on this? How exactly do they differ? In particular, I would expect the lists to be the same, and the envelope to be the same as the old 'chart' view - at least so long as the changes are all jumps.

If all you have is jumps, then essentially they are the same in that the tempo at any point in the timeline will match.

That doesn't necessarily mean however, there is the same amount of tempo entries in the tempo map as there is in the tempo list (although if they indeed ALL jumps, then it's likely they will be the same).

1.  If you created a bunch of nodes all at 120bpm in your envelope, there would only be one entry of 120bpm in the tempo map (the first one) as there are no changes in tempo.  For the most part, only tempo changes are written back to the tempo map.

2.  When you create a curve or a line from one tempo value to another,  individual tempo jumps are inserted into the tempo map to reflect the changes in tempo over the course of the shape (in a similar way to how it looked before if you were to draw a line or curve in the old tempo view).  The resolution of the tempo changes is governed by the TempoMapDecimationResolution initialization variable (defaults to a 16th note).  What you see in the tempo inspector is the start and end tempo, and the curve type. What is in the tempo map, is lots of individual tempo changes.

However... the above is only true when you edit the tempos inside the inspector/tempo track, or use "Insert Tempo Change" or "Insert Series of Tempos" commands.  In these cases, you're working on the tempo track envelope and the tempo map is then rebuilt from that envelope.

If you're using "Set Measure/Beat at Now", or using any of the tempo extraction methods (e.g. dragging a clip to the timeline, extracting the tempo using audio-snap, or using "Fit to Improvisation"), then the reverse is true:  those commands work on the tempo map first (like they always did), and rebuilds the tempo track envelope from the tempo map.

Given the above, if you're using "Set Measure/Beat at Now" then it's important not to edit the tempo yourself between setting measure/beats - just continue setting the beats and trust it to do its job.
 

[chris.r]

1 hour ago, David Baay said:

2 hours ago, msmcleod said:

Do not confuse the Tempo List in the Tempo Inspector with the old tempo map. It may look the same, but it isn't. 

The Tempo Inspector shows a list representation of the envelope nodes, not the tempo map.

Hi Mark, can you expand on this? How exactly do they differ? In particular, I would expect the lists to be the same, and the envelope to be the same as the old 'chart' view - at least so long as the changes are all jumps.

I would like to hear more too. Except that the nodes can serve as a handle that we can drag with mouse now, and the curves, the two was likely the same to me (working same way).

Oops... posting at the same time.

Edited May 3, 2021 by chris.r

[willard cottrell]

Noel,

 

I developed a workflow that uses the tempo track in the multidock.  I currently have the following in my multidock - console, markers, tempo, PVR.  I can't get the tempo view in the selection area.  See float 2 png

[David Baay]

11 minutes ago, msmcleod said:

If you're using "Set Measure/Beat at Now", or using any of the tempo extraction methods (e.g. dragging a clip to the timeline, extracting the tempo using audio-snap, or using "Fit to Improvisation"), then the reverse is true:  those commands work on the tempo map first (like they always did), and rebuild the tempo track envelope from the tempo map.

Thanks for all the info, Mark. That's very helpful. I see now that based on this, if you have redundant tempo entries and 'Set' a later point, the redundant entries get deleted which shouldn't be of any consequence in most cases. I'll have to play around and see if there's any real-world scenario where it's actually problematic.

[msmcleod]

24 minutes ago, David Baay said:

Thanks for all the info, Mark. That's very helpful. I see now that based on this, if you have redundant tempo entries and 'Set' a later point, the redundant entries get deleted which shouldn't be of any consequence in most cases. I'll have to play around and see if there's any real-world scenario where it's actually problematic.

Actually, it's probably the opposite... i.e. using "Set" may introduce duplicate tempo entries at the measures/beats - which is fine - they'll stay there as long as you don't edit the tempo envelope. So multiple uninterrupted "Sets" one after another will be fine. Editing the tempo envelope is likely to remove those duplicates, which makes it harder to then use "Set" afterwards.

As Cakewalk is essentially M:B:T based, the tempo map is central to all time calculations in Cakewalk where absolute time is involved (which is basically all the time).  Keeping the number of entries in the map to a minimum is crucial for performance reasons.

[Base 57]

The Tempo Map Decimation Resolution.

 

I can't decide whether to put that on the band name list or in the project startup affirmations list.

 

[immrama]

When loading an existing project with Motu Ethno Instrument or trying to add Ethno to an existing or new project, I get an instant crash at the point Ethno is being loaded. No error messages - Cakewalk just closes. No issues in earlier versions of Cakewalk. Anyone else experiencing the same issue or running Ethno successfully in 2021.04?

[Keith Lane]

19 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

MPC beats has preexisting stability issues that have been reported to AKAI. Until they fix this its not going to change. If you send a dump file for the hang I can verify its the same issue. You can also try disabling the strict exception handling in the build posted in this thread just in case its related (unlikely)

Thx for the update on the issue,

I gave Promidi's sugestion a try, no change in behavior. What I don't get is some cakewalk users arn't having this isuue, but I always have ? Your welcome to the dump file Noel,  though give me a shout on FB and talk me though finding it, as I'm stugling to find it on my own, I looked in %temp% and it's not there ! 

I really would like to get this working as I love drum machines and need a good excuse to buy a MPC Studio

[Noel Borthwick]

@Keith Lane details about capturing a hang dump are in my signature

[Glenn Stanton]

some feedback on the 144 build UI (the latest for "auto-update option) - it looks like the inspector width is skewed by the addition of the tempo track/map and or some other adjustments. the PC icon appears clipped in several views. i'm using the Mercury theme to ensure its the default there. i'll try the build 147 and see if its changed.

never mind! build 147 fixes it.`

Edited May 4, 2021 by Glenn Stanton

[Ben Staton]

4 minutes ago, Glenn Stanton said:

some feedback on the UI - it looks like the inspector width is skewed by the addition of the tempo track/map and or some other adjustments. the PC icon appears clipped in several views. i'm using the Mercury theme to ensure its the default there.

Hi Glenn,
Thanks for the report.
My immediate thought was that it looks like a custom theme issue. I realize you're using Mercury, but can I ask if you were using a custom theme before that? Nothing wrong with that, but if Cakewalk starts up with a custom theme that isn't up-to-date, it's possible you could run into this issue even after switching back to Mercury. One way to find out is to set Cakewalk to the original Mercury theme and then restart it. If that solves your problem, then you probably need to update your custom theme.
We also introduced a theme compatibility warning in the latest release, which you should see on startup if your custom theme needs updating.
Thanks,
Ben

[Glenn Stanton]

no, it's the default theme. i was using minimalistic orange but i switch out of it to make sure it wasn't a theme issue. as a note build 147 has corrected this issue but at the moment it's a separate download from the update notification in the CbB app (which is the 144 build).

[Keni]

Minor item for sure... If an item at all?

 

For now, I like the new highlighted waveform images. But I have encountered an issue.

 

When I assign a track color of yellow, there appears to be no highlighting. I'm guessing the highlight function is adding yellow to create the relative image? If such is the case, it appears a routine needs to be added for the situation where the selected color is yellow and substitute something else? White? Not visible enough?

 

...just a thought. I can live with it of course.

 

Thanks Gang!

 

[Starise]

Thanks for this wonderful update.

Nice to see an addition to the PC for those who didn't have it. I especially liked the outlines on wave forms.

I don't commonly upload directly to any service but decided on a whim to upload to Bandlab to see how it works. My intention was simply to upload a completed mix. 

I likely selected an incorrect upload choice since my tracks all uploaded as individual tracks. This was not my main issue though.

All tracks in my  mix were frozen before I uploaded  to BL. When the project uploaded to BandLab I had two tracks that went back to midi and were playing a default piano sound instead of the original VST.

This was a small 8 track mix. 

Why did the tracks upload as unfrozen midi tracks when they were frozen in Cakewalk? The odd thing , it wasn't all tracks. Only a few.

[Jacob Winkler]

When I go to add an audio effect, there is a significant delay accompanied by some flickering before I can see the effects.  By 'significant' delay, I'm talking probably less than a second, but not the instantaneous feedback I'm accustomed to. I'm assuming this has something to do with the new high resolution options... But it is quite unpleasant!

[Noel Borthwick]

@Jacob Winkler do you have the high DPI setting enabled in preferences? If its not enabled there should be no change.

[Noel Borthwick]

5 hours ago, Starise said:

Thanks for this wonderful update.

Nice to see an addition to the PC for those who didn't have it. I especially liked the outlines on wave forms.

I don't commonly upload directly to any service but decided on a whim to upload to Bandlab to see how it works. My intention was simply to upload a completed mix. 

I likely selected an incorrect upload choice since my tracks all uploaded as individual tracks. This was not my main issue though.

All tracks in my  mix were frozen before I uploaded  to BL. When the project uploaded to BandLab I had two tracks that went back to midi and were playing a default piano sound instead of the original VST.

This was a small 8 track mix. 

Why did the tracks upload as unfrozen midi tracks when they were frozen in Cakewalk? The odd thing , it wasn't all tracks. Only a few.

We'll look into why frozen tracks aren't uploaded as audio. Thanks. 

[Jacob Winkler]

I didn't change anything in Preferences, but I also don't see the high DPI setting anywhere... I've been looking under 'Display', is that not correct?

But if it's not the high DPI setting SOMETHING is very different in the behavior of the plug-in menus, they are VERY sluggish!

 

 

[John T]

I don't know what y'all did with the plug-in menu fonts, but it's like angels are blowing gentle clouds of comfort and joy onto my tired eyeballs, and I want you to do it to the whole program.

Also: didn't expect to like the waveform outlines, but that's really visually agreeable "in the flesh" as it were.

Automation display improvements also really great. Has something about the editing functionally changed? Perhaps an illusion because of the nicer visuals, but it feels really great to edit with all of a sudden.

Not had something this good for free since the last time I robbed a bank*.

* have never robbed a bank, it's a joke.

 

[Keni]

Any chance the new menu system will reach the drum map selection menu?