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Noel Borthwick

[CLOSED] 2019.11 Hotfix Release Candidate (HFRC)

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It appears that something in the 2019.11, Build 63 update broke track name communications between Cakewalk and iZotope for use by iZotope's Neutron 3 Visual Mixer. I haven't checked other iZotope inter-plugin communications. This is a new problem, iZotope plugin's have been showing track names and communicating those track names to visual mixer until now. On the attached screenshot red boxes outline where the track names should be shown.

 

 

 

 

2019-12-13.png

Edited by Bill Phillips
To clarify that problem is the result of recent updates.

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On 12/11/2019 at 8:31 AM, siordanescu said:

 

Noel, the version ... 63 is not installed , over the one I have ... 54. I did an update through the band lab assistant and it tells me that the update is only installed over the version ... 54. But I have the version ... 54! I checked!

 

Did this get sorted out? I have the same issue.

 

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On 12/12/2019 at 12:14 PM, Bill Phillips said:

It appears that something in the 2019.11, Build 63 update broke track name communications between Cakewalk and iZotope for use by iZotope's Neutron 3 Visual Mixer. I haven't checked other iZotope inter-plugin communications. This is a new problem, iZotope plugin's have been showing track names and communicating those track names to visual mixer until now. On the attached screenshot red boxes outline where the track names should be shown.

 

 

 

 

2019-12-13.png

Your screenshot shows Relay is the VST2 version (see the plugin title area at the top) but the Visual Mixer is the VST3 version.  I don't think VST2 will do track names.  Sadly with all VST3 the track names aren't coming out right, they seem to have extra garbage characters on the end

B3LrXV.jpg

 

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10 hours ago, Matthew Sorrels said:

Your screenshot shows Relay is the VST2 version (see the plugin title area at the top) but the Visual Mixer is the VST3 version.  I don't think VST2 will do track names.  Sadly with all VST3 the track names aren't coming out right, they seem to have extra garbage characters on the end

B3LrXV.jpg

 

Matthew, thank you. You are correct and I hadn't noticed that. I switched to the VST2 version or relay to get access to the Advanced features. See screenshot. Looks like I'll need to pick between the two versions choosing between getting the track names or the advanced features. I've reported both problems to iZotope and they say the problems are likely Cakewalk specific because they don't support Cakewalk. It's nice that Melodyne does support Cakewalk!

 

2019-12-14.png

Edited by Bill Phillips
Clarification

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The UI paint problems with the VST3 version in Bandlab may still very well be iZotope's bug, can't really tell.  The track name garbage though is almost certainly Bandlab's bug, looks like they aren't null terminating the track name when they hand it to the plugin maybe.

The VST2 version of Relay in Cubase 10.5 doesn't even have the advanced drop down arrow.  Which I think is funny (since Cubase is the defacto VST platform).  But the VST3 one correctly resizes and repaints the UI, which Cakewalk doesn't seem to do right.  In Reaper and Ableton 10 both the VST2 and VST3 plugins work correctly and have all the options visible.

I'd say the odds of getting this fixed aren't that good.  Maybe someone from Bandlab will see this and can put it on the list.  I think they can get a demo version of the iZotope plugins that would be enough to test/debug this.

Edited by Matthew Sorrels

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1 hour ago, Matthew Sorrels said:

The UI paint problems with the VST3 version in Bandlab may still very well be iZotope's bug, can't really tell.  The track name garbage though is almost certainly Bandlab's bug, looks like they aren't null terminating the track name when they hand it to the plugin maybe.

The VST2 version of Relay in Cubase 10.5 doesn't even have the advanced drop down arrow.  Which I think is funny (since Cubase is the defacto VST platform).  But the VST3 one correctly resizes and repaints the UI, which Cakewalk doesn't seem to do right.  In Reaper and Ableton 10 both the VST2 and VST3 plugins work correctly and have all the options visible.

I'd say the odds of getting this fixed aren't that good.  Maybe someone from Bandlab will see this and can put it on the list.  I think they can get a demo version of the iZotope plugins that would be enough to test/debug this.

Thanks for the insights Matthew. For me that's all useful information. Hopefully it will get sorted out. I really like the iZotope Production Suite for mixing.

Bill

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On 12/14/2019 at 12:43 PM, Matthew Sorrels said:

The track name garbage though is almost certainly Bandlab's bug, looks like they aren't null terminating the track name when they hand it to the plugin maybe.

Seems only to affect track/bus names shorter than 7 characters.

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Hello
When will the problem with track names in plugins be fixed when using iZotope Relay plugins?
In the photo Two options for using these plugins: VST2 and VST3.
In both cases, there are incorrect track names and their ordering.
The iZotope website says:
"The track naming feature in Neutron and Relay is specific to DAWs that support this functionality. DAW manufacturers have to intentionally make this functionality available for us to be able to use it."
I use Sonar Platinum version 2020.01.
Please correct this misunderstanding.

Relay Name VST2.jpg

Relay Name VST3.jpg

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Another problem that @Maxim Vasilyev didn't mention is that the features in the Advanced tab are available in the VST2 version of relay but not available in the VST3 version.

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On 12/15/2019 at 11:06 PM, Noel Borthwick said:

@Matthew Sorrels we'll look into the string issue. Thanks for the report.

@Matthew Sorrels I finally had a chance to look at this. The problem is not in the Cakewalk code. The channel names are provided by a standard VST3 interface called IAttributeList and provided via ChannelContext::IInfoListener. In this the string is properly null terminated but VST requires the user of the string to use the string size provided and properly null terminate their target. This is not being done by the Izotope plugin hence the garbage appears. 
I will pass on this information to Izotope.

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Oh well I managed to sort out the string garbage by fixing some code in the VST3 SDK . The SDK code was not copying over the null terminator for the string 😛  
I'll submit my change to Steinberg as well since any app that uses that would be susceptible to the same problem.

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10 hours ago, Bill Phillips said:

Another problem that @Maxim Vasilyev didn't mention is that the features in the Advanced tab are available in the VST2 version of relay but not available in the VST3 version.

I've fixed this issue as well for the next release. It had to do with some peculiarities with how Relay requests the host to do resizing via VST3. 

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12 hours ago, Maxim Vasilyev said:

Hello
When will the problem with track names in plugins be fixed when using iZotope Relay plugins?
In the photo Two options for using these plugins: VST2 and VST3.
In both cases, there are incorrect track names and their ordering.
The iZotope website says:
"The track naming feature in Neutron and Relay is specific to DAWs that support this functionality. DAW manufacturers have to intentionally make this functionality available for us to be able to use it."
I use Sonar Platinum version 2020.01.
Please correct this misunderstanding.

@Maxim Vasilyev the problem with track names displaying garbage has been fixed. As mentioned above its actually caused by the way the VST3 SDK reported this so technically could have been easily addressed from the plugin side (most other VST3 plugins handle it). However I have made a change to resolve it from our end.

As far as VST2 goes there is no way for a host to report track names to the plugin via the standard VST protocol so this won't work with Relay in any host. You must use the VST3 version to get this functionality. Cakewalk has supported VST3 channel naming from the get go for many years now.

With regard to track ordering in Neutron, this is a deficiency in the plugin since it it appears to be sorting the track names alphabetically and ignoring the host specified track order. There is a specific VST3 interface that can be used by the plugin to identify the order of tracks. If they use that the tracks will be sorted in the same way that they appear in the host. This is how it works with the Softube Console One. BTW the same track ordering problem can be observed in other VST3 hosts such as Reaper. 

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