Quinellipe Zorn

I'm not suggesting the "bakers" are responsible. This is the forum I am on, this is the one where we talk about the product, if Bandlab isn't somehow incorporating this feedback it is not my job to do their sentiment analysis and so forth for them, nor to chase after wherever they might be when this is very clearly a forum they know people are voicing opinions (PS - more specifically, come for support, which will beget a lot of feedback with it; it's their job to review that correspondence, and if they aren't, that says a lot about the company and direction; it also tells me then there's no point in voicing anything at all to them).

Maybe it's my eyes/prescription (or just that I don't clean my lenses enough, haha) but seems fine to me except that I prefer the font in the CbB, that seems to cause the equivalent of "blurring" in the Sonar one, a bit of "messy" what-is-it, kerning? some-such...my spouse professionally knows this stuff but not handy

you're like me, old enough to see it come around again. from what I see it's a seesaw in underlying notions of what is crisp, what is attractive, what is frictionless; I doubt it will ever be "solved" (I remember, what was it, the '90s, the dream of every user having their own UI - I guess that will come back again sometime tho' is mostly disdained/in disrepute, and I do understand the issues with non-directed/non-best-practice UI paths

From the screen shots, the Sonar Tungsten seemed fine to me, no "significant" difference. But that might be the difference of looking at these shots versus a live screen in front of me. In any case, thanks much; to me it seems like whenever Bandlab is ready to be more clear about the commercial path generally it's looking fine to migrate to me/for my purposes. But also not seeing any reason to change until I must.

I'm not necessarily against a subscription model. I'm not necessarily against a Bandlab membership model. Will just wait and see. I don't see a reason to lose time on projects in preparing for a change when it's so speculative, for my own/our situation. Worst case I pay for an unwanted year or such of some subscription while looking at alternatives, which I'd rather do than lose time on projects now. That said, Bandlab has all the earmarks of a company that emphasizes growth to then do a hard "enshittification," as the term has been popularized. But, hey, even those companies can still be relatively okay in the marketplace, such as it is.

My grip is if the business does not listen to the developers, the business is at fault.

I think it's difficult to tell if anyone's really listening; if so, it shouldn't die, but if they aren't, then, to your point, it's indeed beating a dead horse. Hard to say. I proceed in hopes that the company is all ears.

If Bandlab isn't watching this forum, that's Bandlab's problem. If "the Bakers" are interacting here, it's also their obligation to provide feedback within their company based on those interactions. A company official cannot transact with customers and then disclaim it isn't their role to provide feedback, or such. (And I'm not suggesting whatsoever that the engineers are making such disclaiming, and I have full confidence that they provide feedback. If not, well, that's on the company.)

Precisely. "This is the weirdest, softest rollout of any software I have ever seen, bar none."

I think it's suitable for people to complain here. If the complaints here are not heard, that's not on the consumers, that's on the company.

Not seeing it myself; if not already done, would at least put in a support ticket (https://help.cakewalk.com/hc/en-us/requests/new).

Just wanted to check back again where you accessed this link from, @OutrageProductions? Still same issue as above, but I could come back here to this and use your link to get to support.

I do think the vast majority who know enough to think about plugins will be looking around for them and find out info, etc.. But bundled plugins are nice, especially, of course, if they are great plugins. I regret a bit that I never spent time on much that came with Sonar/Cakewalk as I also discovered plugins independently of the tool, and some of the bundled ones can be their own enticements. But the real enticements, IMHO, are not the freebies or "good" stock ones, but the big-name ones (as people look those up and get impressed, plus it is, usually, a real value - I once bought a software just for the discounted plugin as the bundle was a ridiculously great deal) and any "amazing little secrets." Otherwise, it's just noise.

Given your stability and that you prize stability, it seems to make sense to me to remain, as there's no substantial leap from 2022.11 to now, other than a raft of bug fixes, none of which matters if the bugs you're experiencing now are of no major issue to you and you are able to keep your rig entirely stable/static(-ish as possible). I prefer to be on the current version as I've only seen progress, and the only remaining bugs I see are relatively minor. There are still lots of "little" things, mainly in the UI as far as I experience, but fewer functional bugs to the degree those were noticeable in 2022.11. I was a little bit disappointed with 2023.09 as so many little twiddly issues remain, but it was definitely an incremental improvement. And I THINK, but am not 100% sure, for me 2023.09 is even more stable (prior versions have been rather stable, too). There was an issue in the past where turning on my synth which talks via USB while Cakewalk was open would cause a crash in Cakewalk, which Cakewalk never recognized as an actual bug, but was partly resolved in some earlier release and entirely resolved in either the release before '23.09 or '23.09, I forget which (and, no, there were zero changes to the synth or USB architecture on my end during that time). As aforementioned, I know there's also plug-in-caused instability, although ultimately the DAW provider does also have a role to minimize that, it's a two-way street there. (In actuality my overall DAW setup is a little less stable on the whole, but I'm near-certain that's a plug-in-issue and not Cakewalk's.) So, for a lot of/most people, I'd say get current, but as you are engaging a very stable and controlled environment functioning to your satisfaction, makes sense not to change - you likely won't get satisfactory improvement on the little bugs versus the risk that something becomes destabilized, however unlikely that is.

PS - if I click "sign in" up top, it takes me away from that link and never goes back, just FYI. But it's no problem to submit the request from this link, worked absolutely fine, thanks again! Will be curious to see where you accessed that from and see what happens when I access from that same link/page.

That link works fine for me, thanks! But not the one I listed. Where did you find that link?

Retried clearing cookies for site and all temp files/cache, same problem.

PS - although, interestingly, NOT if I click on the "Submit a request" atop the "Submit a request" form below! In that case, I get same as I reported originally above.

Given your result, I looked around more on the site, I find it works fine from "contact us" at https://www.cakewalk.com/sonar for me though the problem report form looks different. NOT QUITE - seems to be the Bandlab-only form, as the device doesn't leave anywhere for Windows as client.

Thanks! I tried it on a browser that had no trace of the site, though perhaps because I logged into Bandlab first? Were you already logged in? Did you do try from https://help.cakewalk.com/hc/en-us/categories/360001718074 or a different page?

At least it's reproducible on this end. But to me that's less the issue than it's an easy thing to diagnose that may cause an issue and the system should be able to give a warning at some sort of threshold. That said, I also realize they may choose not to address it at all. Whatever, I just want to submit it for their consideration. As said above, at https://help.cakewalk.com/hc/en-us/categories/360001718074 (could be any other page, of course, just a starting example), clicking on "Submit a request" at the top simply goes to a page that only has the choices to "log out" or "nevermind", both as pictured below. Clicking either choice simply goes to https://www.bandlab.com/feed/trending I just tried this on a browser that I'm fairly sure I've never logged in, and certainly didn't have any cookies for Bandlab, and same issue.

Thanks, yeah, I was just curious about whether the original June sign-ups "mattered" or if people were only getting in by using the much later beta sign-up.

Thanks, yes, I understand to avoid it, and thanks much for the hot-key; mainly, though, the issue is with playback with the loop off of this file afterward, as aforementioned would like to submit a support ticket but as described above seems not to be working.

I tried the "submit a request" but after the "BandLab Zendesk will receive..." prompt, it goes to the "logout" or "nevermind" choice, and BOTH choices simply to the Bandlab feed page, I can't find any way to actually submit this to engineering. It seems an audio clip created from a mistaken constant loop-record of 30 ticks (an issue that I find happens easily by accident though I don't know what is causing me to accidentally select a 30 tick loop) causes the whole file to perform so badly it basically can't work and, if attempting to play, typically, after a long non-responsiveness (no keyboard input can stop it from attempting to play, if one clicks play) crashes with an audio engine error. If the track with the "bad" (troublesome) audio on it is simply deleted, the project goes back to working fine. I simply wanted to send Cakewalk by Bandlab support the project file, but cannot given aforementioned issue. I hope somebody knows some other way to submit that, please, and thanks. (I am guessing the same issue can occur in the next-generation Sonar replacement, so I presume it's of interest to mitigate for anyone who encounters it and doesn't want to spend potentially hours troubleshooting and trying to work around; unless one knows the 30 tick recording loop problem, it takes a very long time to figure out, in my experience).

Thanks!!