Sonar 2025.07 Feedback

[Stewart Kingsley]

On 7/12/2025 at 7:24 PM, Stewart Kingsley said:

Latest version of Sonar still will not continue starting after showing the splash window. Is there a way to get some kind of diagnostics information that I can then post to show the issue I have?

This problem was being caused by the use of Vb-audio Matrix which allows up to 512 mono inputs and outputs. Sonar had a restriction of 128 which caused it to quietly close. Mr Borthwick has solved the problem by increasing the limit beyond 128, which allows these ASIO aggregator softwares to work perfectly with Sonar. 

My thanks to Mr Borthwick for his patience and persistence in getting this fixed.

[Noel Borthwick]

Thanks for sending dumps and data required to diagnose this. While most users wont be using such high I/O counts its easy to run into this problem inadvertently with software like VoiceMeeter that have virtual outputs. Sonar now handles upto 1024 I/O’s and if it exceeds that it will handle it gracefully without crashing

[MikeyT]

The LP-suite of plugins that have been part of Cakewalk for ages no longer seem to work. I've got them everywhere (hundreds of Cakewalk files stretching back decades), so a huge issue for me.

These are VST plugins and I believe they are 64-bit but the only way I know of telling that is that they are in C:\Program Files rather than C:\Program Files (x86)

I raised a separate topic for this here before I saw this feedback thread: 

And I see someone else raised it too, here: 

 

[pedwal wally wally wha]

23 hours ago, Stewart Kingsley said:

these ASIO aggregator softwares

other than Vb-audio Matrix, which others does that include?

[mgustavo]

Hi, I'd like to thank the bakers for this Sonar update, specially the Track View time ruler drag/scroll not visually updating fix.
However it seems there's still an issue with Track View time ruler drag when doing zoom in and zoom out. In some projects it's subtle, but there's still a delay on graphics update. Thanks!

[Stewart Kingsley]

2 hours ago, pedwal wally wally wha said:

other than Vb-audio Matrix, which others does that include?

Any other that already exist or might come along later. If I knew everything, I would be specific. But I dont know everything so I dont assume anything.

[Bahmanyar Afroozeh]

@pedwal wally wally wha Read this, I hope it helps.

https://alternativeto.net/software/vb-audio-matrix/

[minyong um]

This update has caused another delay when playing on Channel View, such as right-click drag and crossfader. These bugs have occurred many times in the last update, and it's a shame that they happen again every time. This is why it's hard to do it right away when a new update comes up..

[IgoRr]

Hello everyone!
I installed the latest update (build 097) today, and when I try to open a previously saved template, from which I start all new projects, a notification appears: "PC2A Leveler Amplifier - Error: Missing or corrupt resource file/s". Then the project opens, but when I try to open the "ProChannel" field in the "Inspector", Sonar crashes. I tried to create a new empty project from the factory templates, and everything happens the same way, but "ProChannel" opens, although it is still impossible to add "PC2A Leveler Amplifier" - this notification appears again and the "PC2A" interface is displayed simply with empty gray background. After trying to remove it from ProChannel and add it again, Sonar crashes again. Absolutely the same thing happens with the latest version of Cakewalk by Bandlab.

Before installing the latest Sonar update, I uninstalled the previous version (build 094), maybe that's the reason? I've already tried reinstalling both Sonar and Cakewalk, but nothing has changed. Is there a way to restore this module, or will I have to completely uninstall and reinstall everything?
Attached is the dump file and a screenshot of the error notification:

Shablon Sonar '25_07192025_111930.dmp

[Matthew Carr]

On 7/16/2025 at 9:06 PM, Noel Borthwick said:

Can you try a different audio interface to rule it out? If you dont have anything handy use your onboard audio device.

After some fun trying out other interfaces, different driver modes and re-installing Sonar on other systems, all with no effect, I went back to changing settings and I think I've found the root cause.

If 'Zero Controllers When Play Stops' is enabled, in the project MIDI section, then the delay occurs.

If this option is not checked, there is no delay - the transport returns to start point immediately the stop button is pressed.

If the option is enabled, but there are no Midi tracks in the project, then the delay is not present.

The behaviour can be replicated by creating a new project with the Basic template (1 audio, 1 midi track) - on my system at least.

This is definitely a regression specific to Sonar, as with this option checked in CbB there is no delay.

Hopefully this helps in solving the issue!

 

[Noel Borthwick]

3 hours ago, Matthew Carr said:

After some fun trying out other interfaces, different driver modes and re-installing Sonar on other systems, all with no effect, I went back to changing settings and I think I've found the root cause.

If 'Zero Controllers When Play Stops' is enabled, in the project MIDI section, then the delay occurs.

 

If this option is not checked, there is no delay - the transport returns to start point immediately the stop button is pressed.

If the option is enabled, but there are no Midi tracks in the project, then the delay is not present.

The behaviour can be replicated by creating a new project with the Basic template (1 audio, 1 midi track) - on my system at least.

This is definitely a regression specific to Sonar, as with this option checked in CbB there is no delay.

Hopefully this helps in solving the issue!

 

Its good that you were able to narrow down your delay. This is not a bug.
In Sonar for hardware MIDI ports, we intentionally introduce a 1 msec delay before rapidly sending CC's across all 16 MIDI channels to reset the MIDI hardware. The reason for this is it would found that there are some MIDI drivers that will hang if you rapidly send CC's to them. MIDI is a serial protocol and there is no working around that. If there are many ports it can add up since its 16 channels per port. Overall, its much better to introduce a small delay rather than hang some devices.
If you have a lot of MIDI out devices not being used, consider disabling them in preferences or simply turn off the zero controllers option if its not doing anything specifically useful to you.

[Matthew Carr]

1 hour ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Its good that you were able to narrow down your delay. This is not a bug.
In Sonar for hardware MIDI ports, we intentionally introduce a 1 msec delay before rapidly sending CC's across all 16 MIDI channels to reset the MIDI hardware. The reason for this is it would found that there are some MIDI drivers that will hang if you rapidly send CC's to them. MIDI is a serial protocol and there is no working around that. If there are many ports it can add up since its 16 channels per port. Overall, its much better to introduce a small delay rather than hang some devices.
If you have a lot of MIDI out devices not being used, consider disabling them in preferences or simply turn off the zero controllers option if its not doing anything specifically useful to you.

Thanks Noel.. Is this a change specifically made in Sonar? CbB doesn't exhibit the same behaviour.

If new to Sonar, would be good if this could be refined a little - I do want my controllers zeroed, but the delay is really irritating.  I wasn't experiencing any issues with rapid msgs in CbB, but the delay now makes the whole transport seem 'fragile' for want of a better explanation.. even though the explanation makes sense.

Couple of ideas:

1. Introduce a sub-option that enables / disables the new delay behaviour in Sonar.

2. Restrict the zero messages sent to only the ports and channels specified as outputs on tracks in the project, rather than for all channels / ports. This would significantly reduce the number of messages / 1ms delays on projects that have multiple midi ports operating on a single channel

 

[brundlefly]

25 minutes ago, Matthew Carr said:

Couple of ideas:

1. Introduce a sub-option that enables / disables the new delay behaviour in Sonar.

2. Restrict the zero messages sent to only the ports and channels specified as outputs on tracks in the project, rather than for all channels / ports. This would significantly reduce the number of messages / 1ms delays on projects that have multiple midi ports operating on a single channel

I was going to suggest the same after testing with all 24 (!) OUTs enabled on my main DAW but only one used in the project, and finding the delay is in excess of 2 seconds. It's been a long time since I used more than 2-3 ports on that DAW, and my laptop has only a single OUT so hadn't noticed it.

@Noel Borthwick I'm also wondeirng if it's necessary to send messages to all ports serially, or only per-port - i.e. could the same message be sent simultaneously to all ports or would some drivers still have trouble with that?

It definitely seem like this needs to be defeatable for users who encounter it and have MIDI interfaces that aren't sensitive to high-speed messages.

 

[bmarlowe]

I just installed paid SONAR. All seems fine with respect switching my current project over from Cakewalk, but I don't see any "Additional Prochannel Modules," other than what I already had with the latest Bandlab Cakewalk. My Cakewalk Product Center app shows all new items installed: "Up to Date".  Note that I do see the new Overloud guitar stuff.

[pingcat]

When I export a wav file an underscore is being added.

test.wav becomes test_.wav

This thread provides details and a video. . .

 

[John Vere]

12 minutes ago, pingcat said:

When I export a wav file an underscore is being added.

test.wav becomes test_.wav

This thread provides details and a video. . .

 

In your screenshot l see you have added an underscore after the brackets (project name)

That would explain why 

[brundlefly]

5 minutes ago, John Vere said:

In your screenshot l see you have added an underscore after the brackets (project name)

Hmmm, yeah, pretty obvious. 🙄😜 Ye olde "picture is thousand words".

[Xoo]

17 minutes ago, John Vere said:

In your screenshot l see you have added an underscore after the brackets (project name)

That would explain why 

Good spot!

[Noel Borthwick]

4 hours ago, brundlefly said:

I was going to suggest the same after testing with all 24 (!) OUTs enabled on my main DAW but only one used in the project, and finding the delay is in excess of 2 seconds. It's been a long time since I used more than 2-3 ports on that DAW, and my laptop has only a single OUT so hadn't noticed it.

@Noel Borthwick I'm also wondeirng if it's necessary to send messages to all ports serially, or only per-port - i.e. could the same message be sent simultaneously to all ports or would some drivers still have trouble with that?

It definitely seem like this needs to be defeatable for users who encounter it and have MIDI interfaces that aren't sensitive to high-speed messages.

 

@brundlefly if I remember correctly I made this fix to resolve problems you were having 😂 

And no there is no way to send a single message that's not how the API works.

Anyway I'll move this to a PM so we don't clutter this thread with the details. 

[sjoens]

1 hour ago, John Vere said:

In your screenshot l see you have added an underscore after the brackets (project name)

That would explain why 

That could underscore the underlying problem here.  Except in his video, it doesn't, because there isn't . . . an underscore.