Mark Morgon-Shaw Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 On 3/12/2024 at 12:16 AM, Morten Saether said: Thanks for clarifying. The goal is not for Sonar to look just like CbB I think what many are complaining about is that it's harder to use. Less clear, not as sharp , more washed out, less contrast with strange icon / button choices. I understand that under the hood there are big benefits but we still have to use it and it still looks like a visual downgrade from the free product for many users. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Morgon-Shaw Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 On 3/15/2024 at 2:58 PM, msmcleod said: @norfolkmastering / @Sal Sorice / @Heinz Hupfer 1. We'll be including a "Tungsten Classic" theme that more closely matches the colours of CbB, and certainly to my eyes has a more preferable contrast to the new Tungsten. Can you please do the same for Mercury too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msmcleod Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 Just now, Mark Morgon-Shaw said: Can you please do the same for Mercury too. It's in the oven.... 13 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Faughey Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 3 hours ago, Mark Morgon-Shaw said: I think what many are complaining about is that it's harder to use. Less clear, not as sharp , more washed out, less contrast with strange icon / button choices. I understand that under the hood there are big benefits but we still have to use it and it still looks like a visual downgrade from the free product for many users. you are correct sir! i am all about whats under the hood, but when i have to spend a 10 hour plus session recording a band i would like to have something better to look at. i know it sounds stupid since its supposed to be about making music...but i do see it as a downgrade as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Faughey Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 3 hours ago, msmcleod said: It's in the oven.... that is fantastic news!!! take my money now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Morgon-Shaw Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 28 minutes ago, John Faughey said: you are correct sir! i am all about whats under the hood, but when i have to spend a 10 hour plus session recording a band i would like to have something better to look at. i know it sounds stupid since its supposed to be about making music...but i do see it as a downgrade as well. From reading through all the posts the people with 4k monitors seem happier than those without. I am very happy to hear about the Classic Themes though. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjoens Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Unfortunately. I have a 4K but it's too small for DAW use at those res's. At standard res's, new Sonar is somewhat less readable than CbB for more than one reason. Properly scalable vector based UI's should be crisp at all res's. My main DAW screen is 2K so it's somewhat of an issue. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John T Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 1 hour ago, Mark Morgon-Shaw said: From reading through all the posts the people with 4k monitors seem happier than those without. I don't have 4k, but I think the new look at 100% scaling is generally sharp and readable for me. I've not done any precise comparisons, but subjectively, I find it mostly clearer to look at than CbB. Seems like there are a range of user experiences going on. So I'm guessing some of this is just gremlins to work out with the new tech. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Morgon-Shaw Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 15 hours ago, John T said: I don't have 4k, but I think the new look at 100% scaling is generally sharp and readable for me. I've not done any precise comparisons, but subjectively, I find it mostly clearer to look at than CbB. Seems like there are a range of user experiences going on. So I'm guessing some of this is just gremlins to work out with the new tech. Interesting. I have 2 identical 24" Dell screens so I've had it side by side and CbB is definitely easier on the eyes. Cripser, more contrast - better demarcation between items. Whether that's just design choices or other more technical reasons I don't know. I just call it as I see it. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno de Souza Lino Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 19 hours ago, sjoens said: Unfortunately. I have a 4K but it's too small for DAW use at those res's. At standard res's, new Sonar is somewhat less readable than CbB for more than one reason. Properly scalable vector based UI's should be crisp at all res's. My main DAW screen is 2K so it's somewhat of an issue. Not only they should be crisp at all res, but also scalable at all res as well. As soon as you see someone moving for a format suitable for 4k panels, you seem to always lose the ability to either scale lower than 100% or you lose screen space because, as I mentioned before, the vector UI seems to be a change made for 4k users by 4k users with little to no consideration for other screen resolutions. And while you can technically use resolution scaling to put your monitor at 4k then scale it down to native res, you're gonna have worse results if you already start with poor readability. And to say this is not people nitpicking on changes because of preference, the UI changes implemented in Cubase 13 were similar to the Sonar ones and a lot of people complained about poor contrast and also citing visual impairments which made the interface hard to read. Though my main personal nitpick with the change to the vector UI is the 15% size increase. How is it not possible to maintain the exact same interface size from before when you have freely scalable graphics. And let's consider that CbB already had quite a bit of screen space lost to dock borders and such. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John T Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 45 minutes ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said: Though my main personal nitpick with the change to the vector UI is the 15% size increase. How is it not possible to maintain the exact same interface size from before when you have freely scalable graphics. I'm not seeing that. I've done a comparison with both apps running, and everything is almost exactly the same size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Morgon-Shaw Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 2 hours ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said: Though my main personal nitpick with the change to the vector UI is the 15% size increase. How is it not possible to maintain the exact same interface size from before when you have freely scalable graphics. And let's consider that CbB already had quite a bit of screen space lost to dock borders and such. I had the same complaint when we moved from Sonar 8.5 to X1 - I don't recall the % change but less track and few mixer channels fitted on the screen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sal Sorice Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 I noticed that the ProChannel strip overlaps the track strip, and there is also no visual separation between them. As you can tell by my example I am no graphic artist, but hopefully it gets the idea across... ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misha Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 I like clean + sharp looks of new UI, great job! Couple of items that I've noticed (perhaps user error) 1) Strips for arranger, video tracks... I know you can minimize them, but I don't see a way to get rid of them completely. Personally, I have no use for them and I wish you could simply make these go away. 2)My display scaling recommended value is 200% (3070x1440 native). Tools are blurry at that scale, while everything else is sharp. If I switch scale to 100%, they are sharp, but Sonar is so tiny that I can't make out text. 3) Under View>Display there is an option to disable "Display Muted takes in Parent Track".... I wish there would be an option to NOT display muted take lanes all together. Simple scenario: You have 30 take lanes, 5 of which you will use, others just keep for backup or future re-mix. Simply hiding muted take tracks would make UI so much cleaner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Baay Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 6 hours ago, Misha said: 3070x1440 native Imperfect 17.06:8 aspect ratio? Seems unlikely. I'm thinking maybe you confused the width with a 3070 RTX model number...? A more conventional 16:9 aspect ratio would be 2560 x 1440. If it's really 3070, I wouldn't be surprised that you might encounter scaling issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misha Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 3070x1440 native - that's the resolution. Everything but tools seem to be sharp. Tools are fuzzy(blurry). My guess, they were not vectorized as most of other elements. P.S. I don't have issues with tools being fuzzy in any other software.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjoens Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 (edited) Try different scale settings. I find only a few display cursor icons clearly when using 4K (3840x2160) res's. 100% = clear 125% = clear 150% = blurry 175% = blurry [This scale gives the best overall view for me on a 17" screen] 200% = clear 225% = clear 250% (Recommended) = clear 300% = blurry 350% = blurry Edited March 22 by sjoens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Baay Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 6 minutes ago, Misha said: 3070x1440 native - that's the resolution. Okay, I stand corrected. Weird. Tools seem as sharp as everything else here on both my displays (3072 x 1920, and 1920 x 1200) though their styling has not changed so they don't have the fine, crisp lines of many new elements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misha Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 (edited) David, Thanks! I fiddled with main display scaling per your suggestion. You are partially right. Anything over 175% (where 200% is recommended value) tools get fuzzy. 175% is a bit hard on my eyes. I prefer 200 % scale. It's definitely not a deal breaker, just annoyance, but something likely Bakers should look into. I doubt I will be the only one with this issue. --------------------------------------------- I found the cause! Mouse pointer size. The size goes up to 15. My comfort level is 2. As you go up.... Mouse pointer stays sharp at any size, tools get more blurry with increase. I reported the issue. Hopefully they will address it. Edited March 22 by Misha 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Staton Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Regarding mouse cursors, there are some we've yet to update for high DPI. It's logged and we'll get to it in due course. FWIW, obviously they look fine at 1080p, but they also look OK (not perfect, but definitely acceptable) at 4K too. This is because 4K is exactly 4 times the resolution of 1080p, so the scaled up cursors still look sharp, albeit a little pixellated, because one 1080p pixel equals exactly four 4K pixels. 1440p, on the other hand, doesn't match up neatly with the old cursor size like 1080p and 4K do. Since 1440p can't scale them up perfectly by whole numbers, it tries to fit them in between the pixels, which makes them look blurry. It's definitely something we should address. Thanks for the reminder. 7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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