Why is Melodyne folder not used for Melodyne transfers storage?

[jesse]

I just assumed any Melodyne edits would be stored in the project "Melodyne" folder, but that folder is always empty. Instead they're stored in "...\Documents\Celemony\Separations"

I'm on my second system install so I don't think it's just me unless I'm consistently installing things weird.

Is there any plans to store them in the Melodyne folder? It's much slower and taking up a ton of GB on my system drive now.

[treesha]

Thanks for posting this, I always saw the project empty Melodyne folder and didnt know the edits were being saved in the docs folder, just emptied it.

[Noel Borthwick]

This would be a question for Celemony support. We don’t manage where Melodyne stores transfers.

[jesse]

Thanks for responding Noel. The fact that the manual says that the DAW can determine the storage location, the fact that there is no option to change the storage location when using Melodyne in Cakewalk (but there is in the standalone), and in fact Cakewalk creates a Melodyne folder led me to believe that Cakewalk can determine where to store the files.

https://helpcenter.celemony.com/editor2/en/singletrack_tour_73.html

"During work on a project or at the latest when it is complete, you should select the project folder of your DAW as the storage location for these transfer files. In this way, you can be sure that all the files Melodyne requires are stored along with the project and don’t get left behind when you pass the project on to someone else.

Exceptions: some DAWs are capable of telling Melodyne where the project folder for the current project is to be found. In these DAWs there is no way of selecting a storage path manually; instead, Melodyne will always use the current project folder as a storage location, in this way ensuring that your transfer files remain part of the project and do not get lost. So please don’t be surprised if in your DAW there is no browse button for selecting the path; if that is the case, Melodyne will store the files for you automatically in the correct location. To find out with which DAWs this occurs, please consult our FAQ on the Internet."

So are you saying that it's Melodyne that creates the folder in the project folder but then still stores it in the Documents folder anyways?

[Noel Borthwick]

We do pass the project file location via the vst3 api and also another API. 

I'll have to check but Cakewalk itself doesn't create the melodyne sub folder. 

There must be some interop confusion. I can check with them..

[Terry Kelley]

I see the Melodyne files in the project audio folder. Seems Cakewalk does it right, again.

Edited November 21, 2022 by TBK

[mettelus]

AFAIK, the Separations folder has always been used, and you can set where that is in preferences (in Melodyne) if you want to keep it off your C drive. That folder tends to get massive on its own over time. What is saved in the (CWP) project file will recreate where you were with Melodyne (even if you delete the contents of the Separations folder). I tested that years ago (with Melodyne 3 Editor) and it worked flawlessly (just takes a little longer for projects with active Melodyne edits to load). Over time I got into the habit of not leaving Melodyne edits active when saving projects (they do make the CWP files larger), so the Separations folder becomes wasted space on the computer.

[Noel Borthwick]

I think there is some confusion about this. When using Melodyne in ARA mode the Melodyne Transfer folder is not used because the audio comes from Cakewalk's project audio folder directly. All assets are managed by the DAW.

If you do not use ARA mode and capture audio in Melodyne then it will create a "Transfers" folder beneath our Audio folder. Cakewalk gives the plugin access to the project folder for this correctly.

I've no idea what the separations folder is used for but it is not per region data managed by the app. Its specific to Melodyne and not handled by the DAW. I suggest talking to Celemony about how to manage the data in that folder.

[winkpain]

For what it's worth, information-wise, I use Melodyne quite a bit, stand-alone and ARA in CW.

Every project that I've used with Melodyne/ARA in CW has this \Melodyne\Transfers folder in the CW project folder file, and every one of them is empty.  The \Separations folder located in \My Documents\Celemony (or wherever determined from within Melodyne Preferences) is the folder with all the pertinent data in it, it would appear. And this folder can grow quite large.

[Michael Richards]

This is interesting. I use Melodyne everyday. How do I know if I’m in ARA mode? I thought it was automatically in ARA mode in Cakewalk.

[msmcleod]

11 hours ago, Michael Richards said:

This is interesting. I use Melodyne everyday. How do I know if I’m in ARA mode? I thought it was automatically in ARA mode in Cakewalk.

If you're using Melodyne as a RegionFX, then you're using ARA.  If you've got Melodyne in an effects bin, you're not.

[Noel Borthwick]

12 hours ago, winkpain said:

For what it's worth, information-wise, I use Melodyne quite a bit, stand-alone and ARA in CW.

Every project that I've used with Melodyne/ARA in CW has this \Melodyne\Transfers folder in the CW project folder file, and every one of them is empty.  The \Separations folder located in \My Documents\Celemony (or wherever determined from within Melodyne Preferences) is the folder with all the pertinent data in it, it would appear. And this folder can grow quite large.

Maybe you added it by accident to an FX bin at some time. Or perhaps Melodyne itself creates the folder even though it doesnt need it. People copy projects with Melodyne all the time. I doubt that the separations folder is necessary and is likely used for internal temporary data. You can prove it for yourself by moving a project to a different machine or by temporarily renaming the seperations folder and opening an existing project. I bet the separations will be regenerarated from the existing project data.

[Michael Richards]

39 minutes ago, msmcleod said:

If you're using Melodyne as a RegionFX, then you're using ARA.  If you've got Melodyne in an effects bin, you're not.

Good, I use it as a RegionFX.

[winkpain]

6 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Or perhaps Melodyne itself creates the folder even though it doesnt need it.

This would seem to be the case. I just did a test project adding Melodyne as a Region/ARA effect (which is all I ever do with it, i.e. not in the FX bin) and making some edits in it while watching both folders.  the empty \Melodyne\Transfers folder within the CW project folder was created when opening the project next time. I closed the project, deleted the \Melodyne folder structure there, re-opened the project, and the folder \Melodyne\Transfers was created, empty, again.  Doing this same process with adding Melodyne in the FX bin (just to test) and then "reading" the clip with Melodyne's "Transfer" button (which is necessary for the effect) created the \Melodyne\Transfers folder within CW's project folder structure, but with a transfers file for the clip in the folder. Deleting this file and re-opening the project required reading the clip with the Transfer button again within Melodyne in the FX bin for the effect to come into play.

And, as far as the \Celemony\Separations folder (in \My Documents or wherever) goes, the following is indeed true

6 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

You can prove it for yourself by moving a project to a different machine or by temporarily renaming the seperations folder and opening an existing project. I bet the separations will be regenerarated from the existing project data.

This is exactly what happens.

 

I have no issues with any of this; just adding information for general interest.

Edited November 22, 2022 by winkpain

[HIBI]

Response from Celemony support:

Quote

The “separations” folder contains the cache files for "Melodyne 5”, which speed up loading projects, but which are not crucial and can be rebuilt by the program. You should open the "Melodyne 5” preferences and then reduce the size of the “audio cache size” here to reduce the maximum size this can grow to. 

File > Preferences > Recording > Audio cache size (10 GB as the Default)