Starship Krupa

Really, those higher sample rates that they put on interfaces have no bearing on any kind of real-life situation. The storage media companies pay the interface manufacturers to put them there so that people will use up more drive space. An analysis showing that it's freaking 2dB down by the time it hits 20KHz, then looks like Dr. Frankenstein's lightning storm above 25K isn't surprising when you try to record at sample rates higher than 48K. Just kidding! I own a pair of Firepods, actually Firepods with their firmware upgraded to the FP10 specification. After you posted this I decided to download the RightMark Analyzer and try it on my own system. No problem, looks great, at 96/24 my system is only down about 0.1 dB at 30KHz and about 0.6 dB at 20Hz, with none of that craziness above 20K.

Since Cakewalk streams project audio from the disk as it's playing it back, I keep my project (including audio) files on my SSD. There's actually a lot of disk reading overhead with Cakewalk's normal operation if one keeps a bunch of unused takes around, because Cakewalk streams everything, even if it's muted. There's no way (yet) to archive takes except to move them to another track and then archive the track.

My favorite free optical compressor emulation VST is the AdHd Leveling Tool.

Oh thank heaven. One that you pay for, I presume. I can only hope that it means you will be wasting no more time and energy here.

That's terrible. Vegas Pro Edit 15 is crashy for you where it was a big improvement for me. Video NLE is probably the application that is most finicky about system configuration. If it doesn't like your video card or sound interface, you'll find out about it. I've had to play around with different video cards on my main system. The one that I'm using now was originally causing trouble with Mixcraft when running the 64-bit version. Then after I upgraded my system to Windows 10, I was able to put it back in and it plays nice. But at various times I've used an nVidia, the onboard HD4000 (which caused Cakewalk to have lags drawing screen elements), and then finally, the Radeon. The FP10's still seem to be rock solid, thank heaven. They're good, workhorse interfaces, and a great way to get a lot of inputs.

So telling the world that a single user with a very poor command of grammar and spelling is having unspecified troubles with the software is supposed to motivate the development team at BandLab to deliver a product that better meets your requirements? Ad hominem attacks laced with obscenities, that's your idea of constructive criticism. I start with the assumption that the people making the software want the product to work properly, so if something's going wrong with it, I tell them, and they pretty much fix the trouble, sooner or later. When I'm having trouble I also ask other users if they, too are having the same issue to see if it's a problem with the software that I need to report or something going wrong with my computer setup or what. It's honestly never occurred to me to come here and start insulting the people who work on the product, but to each his own, I guess.

I got lucky and scored Vegas Pro Edit 15 along with Hitfilm Express, Sound Forge and a bunch of other stuff in a Humble Bundle a few months ago for $25. I had been running Vegas Pro 10, and the difference was astonishing, to say the least. Not so much in features or anything in the UI, but smoothness, speed and stability were vastly improved. I am far, far from being any kind of power user of Vegas. Every time I fire it up I have to re-learn how to do a fadeout, but the the improvement was immediately noticeable, so Magix are doing a good job. I've gotten good information in this forum: https://www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/vegas-pro-forum/

That you eventually got Sampletank 3 to work without crashing the host is a mystery to me, because at least with Cakewalk, Mixcraft, and Cantabile, it doesn't last very long before going bye-bye, at least with the sampled grand. The free version at least.

You only need to run BandLab Assistant when you want to install Cakewalk and/or the Theme Editor. It can stay running all the time, but it's very easy to turn that off and just run it when you want to. Cakewalk itself will let you know when there is an update available or a couple of weeks in advance of when your subscription needs to be validated. The subscription needs to be validated at least once every 6 months. Cakewalk has a downloader, just like SONAR did. The difference is that you need to run the same program at least once every 6 months to re-validate your license. You are never forced to update Cakewalk if you don't want to, and SONAR and Cakewalk coexist happily without interfering with each other.

When I click on Advanced options, down at the bottom under Pause updates it gives me the option to select a date up to 35 days in the future. This is Windows 10 Home v. 1903. Down below this is where you can click on Delivery Optimization to stop your system from becoming a torrent server for Windows updates.

What I said to Chris about imaging the system drive, I'm starting to think that anyone running a professional production audio system on Windows 10 should be doing it. This is just terrible. I don't know for sure if it would have helped in your situation, but if being able to take the system back a day or a week in time would have saved the gig, then it might. You say you didn't find the cause until doing a lot of digging. And maybe we need to start "riding" it, adopting practices where we check our schedules and go into Windows 10 Update & Security Settings and make sure that updates are paused during critical times. Stop expecting Microsoft to push out stuff that won't break our systems and make it part of our routine to work around them and anticipate the possibility of downtime. Even Windows 10 Home now allows me to pause updates for up to 35 days in the future, so maybe we need to start using that more.

I'm starting to get it, Chris, thanks. This concept is for people who want to set up a dedicated, single use audio workstation with a certain set of software and leave it as-is. This has been hard to understand because my own system does video editing and runs other programs like photo editing and audio format conversion, all of which I get by purchasing or getting for free and downloading. Also, or course, plug-ins. So my A/V production desktop is always in a state of change. With the advent of Windows 10 and its mandated updates, your concern is that Microsoft may push out an update that will break the workstation. I had this happen to my own DAW a few months ago, so how can I not sympathize? I was getting audible clicks and pops on playback right after the 1903 update. Unfortunately, I don't know if there's a way to do this any more. There is such an expectation from software vendors that we'll all be able to be online for registration, updates, etc. To try to build a Windows 10 system using proprietary software and try to keep it forever isolated from the Internet is a struggle. Microsoft don't want people to use their software that way. Neither do BandLab. So how do we find a way around this.... If I were trying to do what you are trying to do, I would start with Windows 10 Professional, which gives you more control over updates. And I would get a terabyte drive for the purpose of imaging my system drive. Then choose carefully when possible problems would have less impact on use of my DAW to go online for whatever updates (Cakewalk or OS) look good. I can always look here in the forum to see what troubles people might be having with the latest Windows updates. Make an image backup of my system drive before going online, then go for it knowing that no matter what happens, I'd be able to roll it back. One might also be able to finesse it by installing CbB on a drive partition other than their system drive so that they won't lose the validation if they re-image their system drive. All this is some trouble, but the trouble you take also makes your system more robust overall. As a former IT guy, for someone with your concerns I'd recommend having a way to image your drive anyway. It saved me some grief back in the day when critical systems didn't take well to updates or their hardware went casters-up. Good luck with the project. I don't think you need to worry about the CbB validation as long as you do your installation (and any updates) by the book.

That's right, there was an issue that I ran into doing it the old-fashioned manual way. I had a problem after copying files around too, because the developers apparently changed a resource in one version that's outside the Cakewalk Core folder that I was used to being able to copy. As with Marled's situation, CbB looked fine until I tried a certain operation. In my case it wasn't validation that fouled up, it caused a crash. A pain indeed, but that's what I get for trying to fool the almighty BandLab Assistant. ?‍♂️?‍♂️? Like him, I had to let the installer do its thing and the issue was resolved. Steve's utility is the better bet, but even still, all this tricky stuff we do at our own risk. Anything other than "connect to the Internet and install/upgrade/validate using BA" is "off piste," as the expression goes. If you want to avoid hassles, just follow the instructions. Otherwise, be prepared, with a backup or otherwise. Terabyte backup drives are so cheap these days, just get one and image your system drive before you start monkeying around like us wise guys who think we know what we're doing. ?

I sometimes like Sennheiser DrumMic'a, which has great sounds and includes some MIDI loops and since it's a Kontakt Player instrument, allows you to send each output to a different track. Also, free. For everyday use, Sonivox' BlueJay Drums, which is sounds-only. I mostly use drum VST's for sketching out my own ideas into guide tracks for me to play along to while I'm recording, sort of a super click track.

It sounds exactly like what was happening with my system right after the 1903 update, but I thought it was solved by patches long ago. The guy, Pete Brown from Microsoft who posts here sent us a link to the Hotfix that cured it. I shall Google it on your behalf.... Yes. I remember now. 1903 was a strange one. The first computer to get the update was the oldest one I own, a Gateway-branded Core 2 Quad (still runs CbB just fine). Then I manually checked my i5 Dell Inspiron notebook and upgraded it. All seemed to go well in both cases, but on my main system, the Dell that I do my DAW and video work on, I think the deal was that Microsoft had a notice in the updates page in Settings saying that my system wasn't "ready" for the update and that I'd have to wait. Then when they finally let install, Cakewalk started going snap, crackle, pop. Mostly on screen events like moving windows and the like. Pete posted the link to KB4505903 but that was back in August. Sometimes it will take a while for Windows 10 to suck down all the updates and hotfixes after a major update, so maybe if you wait a couple of days and plug it back in and force it to check for updates you'll get a round of hotfixes. When you do a WINVER, what is the OS build number it gives you? I'm at 18362.418.

Oh, snap, now I'm really sorry you had all this trouble, I couldn't figure out where you got the idea to copy these installation files and just run them. This is making sense now. You did know what you were doing, it just doesn't apply with the new download manager, I guess. BA makes some other little files and it seems like they are important. It probably has something to do with identifiers used to integrate with the online BandLab DAW, which is still being worked on. I don't know if you know, but if going back to earlier versions is important, Steve Cook has a utility that lets you archive and switch CbB versions. I keep a few by using the trick of copying and renaming my Cakewalk Core folder before I let BA do the update. I'm always nervous about messing with any software installation that's handled by a download manager, because I'm terrified (to use chris' term) I'll wind up in a situation like yours. Even VST2's, which are pretty forgiving, I don't like moving them from one folder to another because I'm afraid that some resource will wind up in the wrong place. Thank you for answering my question! These are all very valid points. I'll reply, and please, I'm trying not to do it in the spirit of trying to win any argument, but rather provide information and possible solutions that users of the forum might not know or might not have considered. I believe in understanding what's going on rather than waving a hand and saying "a DAW works better when you leave it offline" or whatever. That's why I asked. If that is true, I want to know why. I don't like computer superstitions. I'm a big redneck when it comes to Microsoft forcing me to run updates and malware protection and all that. I use Windows 10 Home and figured out how to permanently disable Defender's realtime scanning because it was causing a performance hit. I just leave it off. My computer, my rules. I had to learn how to enable some hidden features to do it, so I did, but it worked. First, you might be pleased to know that Microsoft seem to have had a lot of users complaining about the forced updates issue and have taken some steps to address their needs. On my Windows 10 Home system I can set up to 18 hours a day as "active hours" where Windows won't try to restart the computer to apply updates, and it will never try to apply them if it detects that I'm active on the system. Also, I can pause updates for up to 35 days at a time if I want to. I still have to accept the updates at the end of the pause period. I don't have a problem with that, although I do understand that others might. On my systems at least, extra disk activity caused by Windows downloading the files for the updates has not caused performance issues. That is, so far. I have Delivery Optimization set to allow downloads only from other PC's on my network, so my computers don't distribute Windows Update files to other computers on the Internet. I recommend that anyone reading this make the same settings. Next, regarding background processes (and disk activity), if someone is, like you, savvy enough to be concerned about them, I encourage them to get to know tools like LatencyMon and Process Explorer and Windows' own Task Manager and Resource Monitor and really take control of your system. It doesn't take that long and it's fun to see what programs are actually doing what. I learned a LOT about how Cakewalk does things by running Resource Monitor and clicking on Cakewalk.exe and watching as I did various tasks. What spiked disk activity, what spiked CPU, etc. If network activity were to affect a modern computer enough to cause a dropout in the audio subsystem, it would mean that something was VERY wrong with the network, and I mean the network inside the house or business, or the computer's network interface configuration. Bad network card drivers can mess up latency, I had it happening on my own system, but it was a problem that needed to be solved by rolling back the driver, not pulling the plug. However, an easy way to eliminate all of the above concerns is taking the simple step of disabling your network interface during critical recording and mixing sessions. Open Settings, click Network & Internet, then Change Adapter Options. Right click on the icon for your Ethernet adapter and select Disable. When you want to turn it back on, go back in, right click and select Enable and you're back online. Then you'll know you're getting the best of both worlds: system updated with the latest patches and untouched while you're working. No need to unplug anything, move anything, reconfigure anything. Same effect as pulling the network cord out. Network outages are ever a possibility. Here I will take a comically defensive pose and ask if your Internet has ever been down for over 6 months? Really, this is not so much a reason to have your computer disconnected but a cause of its being disconnected. As long as the outage doesn't last 6 months, it should be okay from CbB's standpoint? Regarding reducing exposure to hackers and lightning bolts (which left your DAW alone both times it looks like), it's true that no connection at all is the best protection against threats to both hardware and software. But there are many other steps that can be taken to ensure safety, and those threats are rare, despite the amount of attention viruses and malware and all that gets on the news. Get good lightning protection for your electronics, get a good malware solution (more importantly, use best practices on your computer) and you'll be fine. Or only plug your computer in for 10 minutes on a clear sunny day every 3 months and Cakewalk will still be happy and your system not at risk. BandLab is an online company. They seem to be really good folks, but I don't think they are likely to do much more to accommodate people who can't or won't get online. It's a free subscription model and probably going to stay that way.

I understand the hardship argument, for sure. But in both of your cases, you were able to get your systems connected for a few minutes to do the validation, right? One, you run a long cord for 10 minutes then unhook it, the other, it's a laptop, you go to a coffee shop and have some coffee with your Cakewalk. What I'm wondering about is why folks who seem to have ready access to a 'net connection are going to so much trouble to keep a computer isolated. They're not saying they won't have access to an Internet connection, it's like a matter of principle or something, and I'm curious about it. Why is it a burden to have to plug the thing in every so often? People used to pay me a lot of money to make sure their computers were kept updated, and I find that computers tend to run best when they're in that state, and updates these days come through the Internet, so wanting to stay away from that channel seems odd to me. Tell me, guys.

And it allows this. Are you under the impression that it doesn't? All BandLab Assistant does in the brief seconds that it contacts the server is check to see if itself is up to date, and if it isn't, it updates itself, then re-validates Cakewalk. Updating Cakewalk is completely optional. All you are "forced" to do every 6 months is briefly connect your computer to the Internet and run BandLab Assistant long enough for it to contact BandLab's server to re-validate. This has nothing at all to do with Marled's situations and the issues he ran into. You suggested that I read posts quickly and miss what the author is trying to say, but if you read Marled's original post and my responses to him, you will see that he tried his own method of updating Cakewalk and only after that, the validation failed. Instead of just connecting the computer to the Internet, running BandLab Assistant, and letting it go through the process of updating and validating, he manually copied some files he found on one computer over to another computer hoping that it would work. It didn't work, and he blamed the validation process. It's not whether you keep your computer online or offline or dangle it from a fishing line out your window if you want to. Read the post from @John Vere up there where he says that he had two computers that were completely offline for over 6 months and when he connected them to the Internet Cakewalk was in demo mode. So he ran BandLab Assistant on them, and it took them each 4 minutes to update and validate Cakewalk. Done. Marled tried to upgrade the software in an unapproved way and the process failed. He didn't let the computer's validation expire, he was trying to upgrade. John let his computers' (2 of them) validations expire and then upgraded in the approved way and the process went smoothly. Do you get the difference? There is something here to be "terrified" about and that is trying to second-guess or circumvent the upgrade, installation, and validation process. Recording and mixing music is fun to "DIY," but not upgrading software that relies on a download manager. Let the download manager do its job, then you can unplug your computer and go about your business. Certainly not, and if your desire or need is to have your DAW computer not connected to the Internet, and you're running Cakewalk, you should connect for validation well before your previous validation will be running out. Like you do with your passport before taking a journey overseas, except much less trouble and expense.

Getting anything iZotope usually feels like Xmas morning to me, but Nectar Elements is disappointing compared to the other Elements products. Usually the Elements suites amount to subsets of the Standard suites, otherwise they work just the same. A suite of top-notch processors, sometimes with a wizard and a bunch of really good presets. You can let the wizard do its thing or call up a preset, then go in and tune the individual processors, or just jump in and work the controls from scratch. Not so with Nectar Elements. In order to get it to do anything, you have to run the wizard, then you are presented with a set of single slider controls for each of the processors, to control the "amount" of processing. There's no way to get at the modules' individual settings. (I snagged Accusonus' ERA 4 Voice Leveler to get it)

My other DAW, Mixcraft, has markers with tails that extend down the entire length of the project, making them very useful for lining things up. I proposed this as a feature request a while back. Think of having stationary Aim Assist lines wherever you want them. They're also color-coded, so you can have arrangement sections easily visible.

I'll ask the big question here: why should BandLab give us the option for offline activation? What benefit is it to them to accommodate this use case and what is the use case in the first place? You talk as if it is automatically understood why someone would not want to connect their computer to the Internet, but I don't understand it at all. Can you please explain it to me? Why is this so important? Why is it "damn terrifying" to you to have to connect your computer to the Internet for a few minutes every 6 months? You're obviously not afraid of or forbidden to or unable to get on the Internet in general or you wouldn't be able to get Cakewalk in the first place, and you wouldn't be able to post on this forum, so what is it? What's so freaking important about being able to have a DAW computer that's so completely isolated from the Internet that it can't be connected even for a few minutes twice a year?

I said that it is not recommended. I didn't say that they say "don't do it." I misspoke with the "expressly" I suppose. I meant it for emphasis, but that was a misuse of the word. My point was that they tell us what to do to successfully install and register the product. You and others that I have heard from that went through similar misery didn't follow those instructions. It's not meant for someone to download a bunch of files to one computer, try to puzzle out which files are the right ones, copy them to another computer, run them, then connect to the Internet for registration. That's not how the software installation is designed to work. Where is that said? I never read about that! ? You mentioned you copied "the installation files." I did not see where you said you installed the latest version of BA. My apologies for making the incorrect assumption. Still, it's not designed to work like that, and no surprise, it didn't. Just because you ran what you thought were the "installation files" and it looked like the installation completed and you were able to start Cakewalk doesn't mean that it was installed correctly. It is probable that BandLab Assistant does things other than just downloading the executable, running it and then doing the validation. When I've looked around in my file system during download, it downloads other small files which may be key files, unique identifiers or whatever, that are necessary for the validation process. I'm truly sorry that you went through so much hassle, and my tone was harsh, but you're not the first one to go through this thing of copying files around, having the validation fail, then come to the forum blaming the software. Cakewalk's license is free, but it does have a license which is enforced and administered by the BandLab Assistant app. If you try to circumvent the operation of BandLab Assistant, it won't be a surprise that the program doesn't work properly. Installation managers with Internet-connected licensing are common. Waves, Native Instruments, iZotope, Spitfire Audio, Plugin Alliance, BlueCat, HOFA, ImageLine, UVI, Adobe, countless others. BandLab doesn't make us install iLok/PACE or other dongles or save serial numbers or have anything running in the background, all they ask is that every 6 months have their little app talk to their server. And if we want the latest version, use the little app to update it. This is not burdensome. People who try to circumvent this process and then complain that it's the software's fault when they run into trouble are being silly. As for "blind townsfolk," I helped a rural user on the old forum figure out a way to get and maintain CbB via mobile phone data. He bought a "burner" just for this purpose. Otherwise, for heaven's sake, if one is living in a really remote area, save up for a portable computer that can be carried in to the nearest public library to use their Internet connection. It's going to be one of the challenges of living in a remote area, if they want to use Cakewalk, how to get their computer into civilization every 6 months. It's a problem for the user to figure out, not BandLab. If someone can't get their computer 15 minutes of broadband access twice a year, then Tracktion 7 is probably a better solution, or drop $30 for Mixcraft when it's on sale or $60 for Reaper.

You are complaining about a "painful" process that doesn't exist for people who use the product as designed. It only goes wrong for people who try to use it in the wrong way. All of this business of downloading the installation files on one computer, copying the installation files to another computer, running the installer on the second computer, then trying to authenticate using an old copy of BandLab Assistant on the second computer is using the software in a manner that is expressly not recommended by the manufacturer. BandLab Assistant is there for a reason. Its job is to check with the server to see what the latest version of Cakewalk is, then manage the installation/update/validation process. Before it starts that process, it checks itself to make sure it's up to date and ready to perform those tasks. You had what you thought were the latest install files (maybe they were, maybe they weren't), ran the executable manually, then tried to validate using an out-of-date copy of BandLab Assistant. So the program that was supposed to be managing the process found a version of the program that from its perspective, came from the future. BandLab Assistant not surprisingly couldn't validate a version of Cakewalk that was newer than it was, so the process failed. And it was your fault that it did. It's not supposed to work the way you were trying to get it to work and it didn't, so you have no grounds for complaint. I am sorry to be so blunt, but it's the truth, and I want this out here for other people who might try to "outsmart" the installation process: follow the instructions. The instructions say to download BandLab Assistant and then use it to install and validate Cakewalk by BandLab. No other method of download and installation is approved by BandLab except when there is an Early Access build available, and in that case, I would recommend you make sure your BandLab Assistant is up to date before running the EAP installer. Participation in the EAP means the user is willing to accept a bit of risk anyway. Last time I did it, downloading and installing a Cakewalk upgrade took about 5 minutes. If you had followed instructions, you would have been done with the task of updating Cakewalk in under 15 minutes. I don't know what you were hoping to gain by guessing at what installation files were needed by the Cakewalk installation and copying them over from another computer instead of just connecting to the Internet for the download. You were going to connect to the Internet anyway in order to validate the license. If you don't want Microsoft to install the latest security updates and patches for Windows, you can tell it to defer those. Unless you are using an older audio interface, there is no reason to defer Windows updates. Even my antique Firepods still work on the latest Windows 10. Whatever, you blew 4 hours trying it your way, so maybe next time try it BandLab's way and see what happens. Companies these days design and build their software with the assumption that the systems it runs on can connect to the Internet in order to apply updates if necessary. That is just how it is, and if someone chooses to operate outside that, they accept a risk and inconvenience that is not the fault of the software vendor. Why is there such a big deal about connecting a DAW to the Internet anyway? Is it to remove the temptation toward distraction? If it's about fear, I can say that I have yet to read on this forum of anyone suffering a virus or malware or hacking attack as the result of having their DAW connected to the Internet. I have, however, read about many hours of time wasted by people trying various stunts to avoid connecting their DAW to the Internet to let BandLab Assistant update and validate Cakewalk. The greater risk seems to be in not connecting.

Feature, not bug. Seriously, Tim, I can't imagine what SONAR LE could possibly have to offer at this point when you have access to the full version of Cakewalk (most of the features of SONAR Professional plus another year and a half of development) for free. Unless you're on a 32-bit OS, don't even bother, Cakewalk will open your old projects just fine and you'll be up and running.

My point was more that I've seen many ways people try to invalidate others' music, whether it be due to their target audience (jam bands and pop divas get hit with this), production methodology (use of pitch correction, etc.), lack of knowledge of music theory (none of the Beatles could read or write a note), use of found material (despite this being a long established technique in fine art) and on and on and on. As far as I know, nobody in Three Dog Night ever wrote a note or a lyric of their massive number of hits, nor ever moved a microphone or a fader. Most of their career consisted of doing other people's material. Does this make them not one of the all time great pop acts? I don't think so. Maybe the $20 copy of Acid Pro is like the $99 Squier Strat. Something you can have a lot of fun with for very little money, and that's great. Not everyone acquires a DAW with the goal of "going pro." I don't delude myself that my efforts here in my dining room are somehow going to result in money rolling in or even anything other than my friends' polite compliments. If I get something together enough to be played on the local college station's demo show, I'll be very happy.