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Keith Wilby

Ample Sound Guitar Problem

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Hi all, I'm a clueless newbie on this plug-in so I've been working through this tutorial using CbB and the free version of the guitar plug-in. I get as far as drawing "C1" at 6:27 but it doesn't make a sound. On the PRV the note assignments seem to be all wrong. Have I missed a trick? Many thanks.
 

 

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Don't have the plug-in but do know when people refer MIDI as is done in this video things often go wrong. It is not clear what MIDI note the video intends as C1. This should be in the plug-in documentation.

CbB has a preference setting called Base Octave for Pitches to set musical note to  MIDI note relation.

By default, in Cakewalk C1 is 12. The video may expect C1 to be 24 or 36.

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A huge percentage of VSTs have the lowest note possible as C-2.  Cakewalk calls that note C0. That is 2 less than the VSTs. So if the video says C1 you must add 2, which means use C3 ob the piano roll.

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Also, Ample Sound freebies have a limited note range, so that may explain why you are not hearing a particular note.

 

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Posted (edited)

Many sampled instruments are limited to the actual note range of the real instrument, as in the case of guitars, that would be from the lowest open string, to the highest fret.

If you are expecting 88 MIDI notes in a piano roll, as in a grand piano, you might be surprised by the lesser actual note range for example, for a 4-string bass. 🙄

And yes, scook's notes about the base octave for pitches is a very important consideration as well!

 

Edited by abacab
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Posted (edited)

I think Ample Guitar is 5 or7 frets. And it won't go below the standard guitar tuning. Same for the bass . Still useful for the most part.

Edited by Terry Kelley

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Terry Kelley said:

I think Ample Guitar is 5 or7 frets. And it won't go below the standard guitar tuning. Same for the bass . Still useful for the most part.

5 or 7 frets? I don't understand...

E1 to C5 works here. And it appears to include 20 frets. 😉

 

Ample Guitar M II LITE capture.JPG

Edited by abacab

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, abacab said:

5 or 7 frets? I don't understand...

E1 to C5 works here. And it appears to include 20 frets. 😉

 

Ample Guitar M II LITE capture.JPG

On the freebee? That's what I have. On mine, I can't play anything above the 4th fret on all but the high E on the fret-board.  On the keyboard I can play all the way up but if you watch, it only plays in the 1-4 fret range until it gets to the high E. That will go all the way to the top of the neck.

Maybe there is a magic setting to go higher? It's not like I read the book ...

Edited by Terry Kelley

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And just to be complete, you can adjust each tuner to go down 2 half-steps (to low D1 on the low E string, for example) on both AS guitars and basses. Not sure if this is available on the free version, tho.

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Posted (edited)
On 5/3/2021 at 10:22 PM, Terry Kelley said:

On the freebee? That's what I have. On mine, I can't play anything above the 4th fret on all but the high E on the fret-board.  On the keyboard I can play all the way up but if you watch, it only plays in the 1-4 fret range until it gets to the high E. That will go all the way to the top of the neck.

Maybe there is a magic setting to go higher? It's not like I read the book ...

It just tries to play without moving your hand up and down the fretboard. If you want to force it to play a specific note on a specific string/fret, you must force string selection by playing the correct articulation keyswitch with the note.

Using Cakewalks numbering, to force string x play note y with the note:
1  G2
2  G#2
3  A2
4  A#2
5  B2
6  C3

The VST will select the correct fret.

Not sure if available on free version. Probably not.

I suspect @abacab is clicking on the fretboard, as opposed to the keyboard.

Edited by Nigel Mackay

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5 hours ago, Nigel Mackay said:

I suspect @abacab is clicking on the fretboard, as opposed to the keyboard.

Nope. Just my MIDI keyboard controller. Never actually thought about clicking on the fretboard.

It plays the the full range of notes as Terry described, using the lowest frets (open or first position) until you reach the highest string, then advances note by note on that string all the way up the fretboard.

As a keyboardist and not a guitarist, I never noticed this behavior before, as guitar voicing is all a bit foreign to me. All I care about is that the correct pitch is played via a keyboard, and it does do that. :)

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Posted (edited)
On 5/6/2021 at 2:14 PM, fret_man said:

And just to be complete, you can adjust each tuner to go down 2 half-steps (to low D1 on the low E string, for example) on both AS guitars and basses. Not sure if this is available on the free version, tho.

Nope, The tuners don't work on the free Lite II.

One issue I see is the included pdf manual does not distinguish between the free and full versions.  The only way to find out is to try a feature.

Edited by Jim Fogle

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The original OP said he was using the "Free" version.

I suggest that he goes back and uses the "Trial" version, which will have all features, but is limited to 7 days.

This should confirm whether the "Free" version is causing his problems or not.

http://amplesound.net/en/download.asp

 

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Posted (edited)
On 5/7/2021 at 10:19 PM, abacab said:

Nope. Just my MIDI keyboard controller. Never actually thought about clicking on the fretboard.

It plays the the full range of notes as Terry described, using the lowest frets (open or first position) until you reach the highest string, then advances note by note on that string all the way up the fretboard.

As a keyboardist and not a guitarist, I never noticed this behavior before, as guitar voicing is all a bit foreign to me. All I care about is that the correct pitch is played via a keyboard, and it does do that. :)

This is something with guitar VST's that may not be noticed by keyboard players but can be frustrating to guitar players.

The problem is that with keyboards you have 1 note per key, for example there is only 1 "G" on a keyboard, if you play another "G", it will be an octave higher or an octave lower, a different "G".

With guitar there can be different positions for the same octave "G". I can play "G" on the open 3rd string, I can also play the same "G" at the 5th fret on the "D" string, I can also play it again on the 10th fret of the "A" string and again on the 15th fret of the "E" string. So 4 different voicings of the same octave "G". All of these "G"s are the same octave but they have a different timbre because of the string and fret they are being played on.

This can be important for guitarists who may want to re-create the particular timbre of a chord by playing it using those "G"s or any other note in different positions on the fretboard.

Guitar VST's tend to handle this problem in different ways.

Some don't bother, they just sample going up to the first 4 fret of each string and then switching to the next string etc until they get to the high "E" and then they just sample all the way up the fretboard on the high "E".

Others do sample the entire fretboard and they use a capo position identifier (usually a short line above the fretboard) so you can instruct where you want a given chord to be played, usually in a range of about 4 - 5 frets and the notes you play will be selected from those within that range. The Capo identifier can be set by keyswitch. Others allow various keyswitches to pinpoint both string and fret position, although this can be a bit tedious in programming. Some use a mix of these methods.

In practice, I have found that the use of the Capo identifier is usually sufficient to get the Guitar VST to play the notes I want within any given chord at a particular position on the fretboard. If I want to play the open string "G" when I hit "G" on the midi keyboard or write it in the piano roll then I will have the capo not used or set low and it well choose that "G". If I want to play the same octave "G" but on the "A" string, I will set the capo to cover the 10th fret of the "A" string.

This all works when writing notes into the piano roll, to do it playing live, I think you would have to know what the Capo key switches are and play them with your other hand, while you play the chord with your other hand.

 

Edited by Tezza

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11 hours ago, Tezza said:

Others do sample the entire fretboard and they use a capo position identifier (usually a short line above the fretboard) so you can instruct where you want a given chord to be played, usually in a range of about 4 - 5 frets and the notes you play will be selected from those within that range. The Capo identifier can be set by keyswitch. Others allow various keyswitches to pinpoint both string and fret position, although this can be a bit tedious in programming. Some use a mix of these methods.

 

The Capo feature is greyed out on the 'free' Ample guitar.

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12 hours ago, Tezza said:

Others do sample the entire fretboard and they use a capo position identifier (usually a short line above the fretboard) so you can instruct where you want a given chord to be played, usually in a range of about 4 - 5 frets and the notes you play will be selected from those within that range. The Capo identifier can be set by keyswitch. Others allow various keyswitches to pinpoint both string and fret position, although this can be a bit tedious in programming. Some use a mix of these methods.

In the AS non-free version, specifying the fret position causes an automatic fret sliding sound (that cannot be turned off), while specifying  the string does not. This gives you a great way to choose not only which "G" to play, but whether it is accompanied by fret noise or not. Very flexible. I'm a fan.

In addition, this would make a GREAT teaching tool. You can program it to play a piece exactly where and how to play each note. "Watch the fretboard and play it like THIS." They got the left hand down. For the right hand, unfortunately they do not model ponticello - right hand playing close to the bridge. But they handle other right-hand techniques pretty well - mutes, partial strums, up/down strokes (but notice there's no full upstroke strum, unless you place those notes manually), etc. I'm glad they went with their own GUI. They have a pretty good system going there.

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