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thatoneXman

this program is NOT User Friendly.

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10 hours ago, thatoneXman said:

I mostly use DAWs for making music. so far, I have LMMS, OpenMPT, Soundbridge, and Cakewalk. Yes, I have experience with DAWs.

 Although Cakewalk  was formerly a full fledged commercial DAW called Sonar that cost hundreds of $$$,   4 days of "screwing around" with it does not qualify as experience.

If you are serious about getting help  with Cakewalk, then there are plenty of helpful, friendly, experienced folks here that are willing to help get you started, if you let them.

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10 hours ago, thatoneXman said:

I mostly use DAWs for making music

Well, ummm right. But that's generally what they do. 😁

What kind of music do you make, and how do you plan to use a DAW to produce it?

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And for reference, I think it's only fair to compare modern DAWs, that are currently supported and developed.

These are the top mainstream DAWs in use today. Many will disagree with the rankings in here, but I present it here with the disclaimer that rankings don't really count. If you made this list of their top 12, you're in. Two DAWs that didn't show up on the list that I know some folks around here use,  are Samplitude and Tracktion, so consider them added as an honorable mention. I personally have several of these DAWs..

The best DAWs 2020: the best digital audio workstations for PC and Mac

https://www.musicradar.com/news/the-best-daws-2020-the-best-music-production-software-for-pc-and-mac

Edited by abacab

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Who promised you that it would or should be user-friendly?  No other DAW this feature-rich is user-friendly either. 

If someone installed an old rotary phone in your home, and told you you could use that to make phone calls -- or you could have a brand new iPhone 15 with a gazillion features, which would you choose?  If you chose the iPhone, would you expect to know every available feature right out of the box?  Or would you take the time to learn it?  I'm guessing the latter.... So why would you have a different attitude about a complex piece of software?

 

 

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So, if you're a PC user on the lookout for a new DAW, you've got literally nothing to lose by trying this one.

JMO: I suspect this quote from the popularity contest poll you mention might be causing more harm than good because it sets up a false expectation for many PC users who have no or limited experience with SONAR/Cakewalk. 

Cakewalk is a robust, extremely flexible / customizable piece of software that has many steep learning curves. ". . . you've got literally nothing to lose . . . " clearly refers to the $0.00 price tag. However, it gives a false impression that time spent learning to use the software is trivial (". . . by trying this one").

If fairness to the OP, "screwing around" with the program fits with "trying this one." 

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On 9/10/2020 at 10:25 PM, thatoneXman said:

I mostly use DAWs for making music. so far, I have LMMS, OpenMPT, Soundbridge, and Cakewalk. Yes, I have experience with DAWs.

@thatoneXman, I get what you're saying; I really do.  Of the four DAWs you've tried so far, which do you like best?  Many of the forum users here use more than one DAW so by knowing your likes and dislikes a little better and more about what you are want to use a DAW for we can help.

I have looked at LMMS, OpenMPT and SoundBridge so I have a small degree of familiarity with them.  Of the three, SoundBridge likely operates most similar to Cakewalk.  In my opinion LMMS and OpenMPT are strong at working with prerecorded music like loops or creating beats while Soundbridge is more about creating midi or audio recording from scratch.  Like Soundbridge, Cakewalk's strengths are recording, editing and mixing.

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On 9/10/2020 at 4:50 AM, John said:

One thing a new user should do is learn the language of the program. What terms mean what.

Ooh, the Cakewalk Glossary. That would be a very handy tool for new users.

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48 minutes ago, Starship Krupa said:

Ooh, the Cakewalk Glossary. That would be a very handy tool for new users.

You mean this one ?

It's easy to bookmark links from the online manual. See my Signature below for examples

Edited by Colin Nicholls

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11 minutes ago, Colin Nicholls said:

You mean this one ?

It's easy to bookmark links from the online manual. See my Signature below for examples

Similar to that one, except it would have descriptive entries for  Cakewalk-specific things like  "Console View," "Clips Pane," "Multidock," "Matrix View," "Step Sequencer," "Smart Tool," "Track Header," "Take Lane," "Clip Automation," "Track Automation," "Drum Pane," "Drum Grid," etc.

Imagine never having seen SONAR (or maybe even a DAW) and coming to this forum for help and seeing all these terms thrown around. I was a complete n00b to Cakewalk 2 1/2 years ago, when there was no Reference Guide, and while I knew what those things were from using other DAW's, I didn't know the Cakewalk-specific nomenclature. Even if I had had access to this glossary, it would not have helped me.

In general it also needs updating, about which I shall alert the authorities. It refers to WASAPI as a "new" driver mode and makes no mention of ASIO, VST, Freeze, and many other commonly used terms.

 

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57 minutes ago, Starship Krupa said:

Similar to that one, except it would have descriptive entries for  Cakewalk-specific things like  "Console View," "Clips Pane," "Multidock," "Matrix View," "Step Sequencer," "Smart Tool," "Track Header," "Take Lane," "Clip Automation," "Track Automation," "Drum Pane," "Drum Grid," etc.

Those topics can be searched for in the manual. Maybe just direct links from a glossary to the appropriate manual page would be useful.

For example, "Console View": https://www.cakewalk.com/Documentation?product=Cakewalk&language=3&help=Views.30.html

 

Cakewalk manual - Console View.PNG

 

But alternatively, by just clicking on the "Index" button on the manual page as shown in the screen shot above, the index entries are already hot-linked to the appropriate manual page...

 

Cakewalk manual - Index.PNG

Edited by abacab
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Yes, make the glossary entries links to the full topic.

Just knowing what people on the forum or the docs themselves are referring to when we say "Comping Mode."

When I was learning to sail a boat, before I left the dock I learned what a "tiller" and "rudder" and "centerboard" and "cleat" and "boom" were. "Forward," "aft," "port," "starboard," "winch," "jib," you can't even crew for someone unless you know those terms.

How about teaching someone how to start a car if they had never seen a car before. A friend who grew up in a hunter-gatherer tribe in South America and is visiting a city for the first time. If I say "sit down behind the wheel," they might think I'm telling them to go around behind the car and sit on the concrete.

Edited by Starship Krupa
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3 hours ago, twelvetone said:

The OP seems to have left the building.

Probably a drive-by troll.

I would give them another couple of days before concluding that... but the post title itself does scream out loud with a flame baiting topic, and is most likely the result of frustration. I think most here have handled that with a bit of restraint, but ...

This is not fruity loops... which I tried once and could say the same about that one... and after screwing around with it have decided that the user interface is a bit cluttered IMHO...

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Re: the OP, I agree that CbB has a learning curve. It has been in development for 32 years and it shows. Why are the menu commands for inserting new tracks up on the global menu instead of down in the Track Pane? Who knows. At least it has the buttons up above the Track Headers.

The analogy to learning to play guitar is a good one. If you just pick up a guitar, yes, you can learn how to play music  on it without studying anything, but it will be frustrating and take a long time. Learn the E, A, D, G and C chords, though, and you're good to start off. Even learning those chords takes hours.

When I first started playing guitar I tried stringing it left handed, because it was my impression that the guitar was designed backward for a righty. The stronger and more dexterous hand just strumming and picking, and the weaker hand doing the hard work on the frets. It was counterintuitive, it made no sense. The experiment didn't last, though.

These days, a DAW is as much an instrument as it is a means for recording and mixing performances, maybe more so.

How long does it take to learn an instrument? I've been playing drums for over 5 years and I try to sit at the kit and practice every day. It's just 6 objects that I hit with sticks and 2 that I operate with pedals.

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11 minutes ago, abacab said:

This is not fruity loops... which I tried once and could say the same about that one

My personal WTF DAW is Reason. I got the Lite version as a PluginBoutique freebie. Can't do diddly squat with it. I spent most of my time just starting at it dumbly because I couldn't figure out how to do anything. I couldn't even figure out how to get to the MIDI editor, if it even has one. And of course, Cakewalk's Console View has me spoiled for anything else.

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4 minutes ago, Starship Krupa said:

My personal WTF DAW is Reason. I got the Lite version as a PluginBoutique freebie. Can't do diddly squat with it. I spent most of my time just starting at it dumbly because I couldn't figure out how to do anything. I couldn't even figure out how to get to the MIDI editor, if it even has one. And of course, Cakewalk's Console View has me spoiled for anything else.

Agreed. I've tried Reason a few times and reached the same conclusion. Same with FL Studio...

My favorite WTF DAW is Ableton Live.  ☺️

I think it's actually worth the effort to learn, even if you are used to a linear DAW. There are some things in there that a conventional linear DAW can't touch.

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Starship Krupa wrote

"Why are the menu commands for inserting new tracks up on the global menu instead of down in the Track Pane? Who knows. At least it has the buttons up above the Track Headers."

You do know that there is a right click menu on the track header area for doing that?

Track Header menu.png

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5 hours ago, Starship Krupa said:

When I first started playing guitar I tried stringing it left handed, because it was my impression that the guitar was designed backward for a righty. The stronger and more dexterous hand just strumming and picking, and the weaker hand doing the hard work on the frets. It was counterintuitive, it made no sense. The experiment didn't last, though.

It's strange, the same thing happend to me, too!

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5 hours ago, Starship Krupa said:

Why are the menu commands for inserting new tracks up on the global menu instead of down in the Track Pane? Who knows.

In addition what @John said, if you use the right click menu to insert a new track, you can select one track in the same breath to define where the new track has to be inserted. I like to use it that way, because often you do not want the new track to be added to the end.

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