A reply to Wookiee

[Misha]

Wookiee,

I find it strange that you posted argumental message,  locking up thread without me being able to respond.  Especially accusing me of dishonesty.  That was not very polite to put it gently.  

In any case, replying to your  statement about me/my post.  They might want to sell an elephant, which is none of my concern. I speculate the mentioning of Perpetual licenses a dozen or so times, were done to counter rumors that have been circulating that the "other" DAW  might take a path of another DAW that most of us prefer.  Perhaps I am wrong, but it seemed to me that it was done to assure customer base - that they should not worry about switch and bait tactics. Adding clarity into their marketing equation.  I can't blame them for it.  And that is my honest view.

[Shane_B.]

Speaking strictly on payment methods, I would rather pay full new user pricing every upgrade than a monthly license. This applies to every provider of a DAW or vst package.

I want to pay for a license to use the software as much or as little as I want for as long as I can keep the hardware it runs on up and running.

I also don't like having to upgrade to the next version. I want to be able to go back to version I invested time into to learn.

Licensing makes sense to people who want to tinker, and professionals who have to keep up to date and get a tax advantage for doing so. (It's technically a lease and that's a 100% write-off)

But for the rest of us who at this point are the vast majority, as true studios have gone the way of the Do-do, it's not a good idea.

As for all the goodies that come with licensing, for the DAW I tried out the monthly plan on, I got zero benefit. I got access to a few stock plugins I already had 3rd party versions of, and a plethora of samples I had no use for.

Options. That's all people are asking for. Don't force us to pay monthly and if we don't we lose access to our work.

Thanks.

[pwalpwal]

i guess he's been told to shut down any posts like that 🤷‍♀️

[Misha]

That could be true. But I sincerely doubt that somebody told him to accuse OP of dishonesty at the same time.  That was very childish and I believe people with power to lock threads should act  more maturely. 

On the subject. I am confident that DAW that most of us enjoy will come up with licensing that is suitable for majority of users. I decided not to jump a ship for another 6 months or so, giving a full year for BL to come up with something reasonable besides subs.  I feel there is a lesson to be learned from competitor as far as how it should be presented to public. 

[pwalpwal]

furry muff, i guess maybe bl aren't so confident in the product to allow grown up discussion?

[msmcleod]

@Misha FWIW, when I read his post it didn't read to me like you were the person he was accusing of being dishonest, but rather the DAW vendor.

[Misha]

msmcleod,

Not quite sure. They seemed fairly clear of their intentions / offerings.  If I remember correctly, Cakewalk had similar model. Pay for version, get the yearly updates free > keep last variant. Decide if you want to upgrade or not to the next.  Seems very reasonable and honest.  

[pwalpwal]

17 minutes ago, Misha said:

msmcleod,

Not quite sure. They seemed fairly clear of their intentions / offerings.  If I remember correctly, Cakewalk had similar model. Pay for version, get the yearly updates free > keep last variant. Decide if you want to upgrade or not to the next.  Seems very reasonable and honest.  

i have to agree here, first you can go to their webshop, second the wookster said of the op "If you are going talk about something, be honest and upfront" 🤷‍♀️ crossed wires i guess

[Wookiee]

7 minutes ago, Misha said:

msmcleod,

Not quite sure. They seemed fairly clear of their intentions / offerings.  If I remember correctly, Cakewalk had similar model. Pay for version, get the yearly updates free > keep last variant. Decide if you want to upgrade or not to the next.  Seems very reasonable and honest.  

You are referring to the model Gibson offered for SONAR, you seem to forget that that product and offering is no longer available as it is owned by Gibson and Cakewalk Inc, Bandlab Technologies did not purchase Cakewalk Inc or any of its liabilities, only the intellectual property of the code. 

My post pointed out that you missed significant facts regarding the product on offer. You missed that the primary offering was for a subscription for the product, which came with benefits, not available to those buying just a perpetual licence. 

Why did I lock the thread because the subject of a perpetual licence for Cakewalk Sonar by Bandlab has been done to death. Repeatedly you and any another's paying attention have been told that at this time there is nothing on offer. 

You also tried to imply that Bandlab were cheating it's users by not offering a perpetual licence for Sonar.  They are not cheating anyone they have obviously decided to follow the route of many software vendors.

Conveniently you forget to mention six years of free support, bug fixes, new features and that Cakewalk by Bandlab (CbB) is still free. You are under no obligation to purchase the subscription, just keep using CbB. You have been told it will get occasional fixes to keep it running for the foreseeable future. 

Finally we are under instruction to shutdown such topics as the matter is not currently up for discussion. 

[craigb]

[User 905133]

17 minutes ago, pwalpwal said:

 . . . second the wookster said of the op "If you are going talk about something, be honest and upfront" 🤷‍♀️ crossed wires i guess

I can see the potential for Misha's reading, but the way I parse the post is as follows:

Quote

But you missed something, [the DAW maker under discussion talks] about the best option being the annual subscription plan.

Yes they mention the perpetual licence once, but most is talk of the subscription plan.

You will be better off buying the annual subscription plan with all its extras.**

If you are going talk about something, be honest and upfront, they want you to buy a subscription, rather than a perpetual licence. 

[emphasis and colorization added]

**I read this as Wookie saying, "They are clearly saying, 'You will be better off buying the annual subscription . . . ."

After that the "you" seems to me to be a comment on the DAW maker under discussion , not Misha.

 

[pwalpwal]

pffft forums

[User 905133]

1 minute ago, pwalpwal said:

pffft forums

Yes.  The internet (especially forums that allow participants to interact) is notorious for having the potential for misinterpretations.  JMO: That's why I think the rules that say things like "No attacks" etc. are good.  It's also the reason why when someone unintentionally misreads my intent, I usually apologize. 

[pwalpwal]

1 minute ago, User 905133 said:

Yes.  The internet (especially forums that allow participants to interact) is notorious for having the potential for misinterpretations.  JMO: That's why I think the rules that say things like "No attacks" etc. are good.  It's also the reason why when someone unintentionally misreads my intent, I usually apologize. 

like i said, crossed wires 🤷‍♀️

[Misha]

Wookiee, 

I am not "forgetting" anything. And I am glad  that Cakewalk was running for the past 6 years. Also, I am glad you clarified that "dishonest" part was not aimed at me. However, 

33 minutes ago, Wookiee said:

You also tried to imply that Bandlab were cheating it's users by not offering a perpetual licence for Sonar

Did I? I don't recall the "cheating" part. Not being fair to those who want a standard license or clear about near future is concerning, but not cheating. The fact is, no matter what competitor "wants" to sell, they are clear about their intentions upfront. I did not feel that their clip was dishonest. It's my genuine hope that Bandlab takes a similar approach if something is on horizon, even distant horizon, instead of locking threads. 

[User 905133]

20 minutes ago, pwalpwal said:

like i said, crossed wires 🤷‍♀️

I hope you didn't think I was disagreeing with you.  In fact, I was agreeing with you. I guess it wasn't obvious, but when I said "Yes" that was intended to cover the "crossed wires" comment as well as the "pffft forums" comment.  Thanks for the opportunity to clarify any possible misunderstanding.

[Wookiee]

Misha yet again you have to be the one who finds the rabbit hole.

My post wasn't even slightly argumentative, I was posting facts, it was yourself who wanted an argument.