Question - Is Scaler 2 worth it for $35?

[mettelus]

43 minutes ago, Brian Walton said:

it can bring advanced chord substitutions

+1. This is a feature that rarely gets mentioned but can be very useful. Even though piano was my first instrument, I consider myself predominantly a guitarist. A lot of chords and inversions get lost in the "reality" of finger dexterity on a guitar (either difficult or impossible to fret properly), so those options can get blown off for simpler alternatives. Scaler 2 has been a nice tool for me to regain some focus on the sheer versatility of the piano.

There are numerous tutorials online. The GUI is a bit more complex than it appears at first glance, so learning to navigate that right away helps to accelerate the learning curve.

[telecode 101]

11 minutes ago, mettelus said:

+1. This is a feature that rarely gets mentioned but can be very useful. Even though piano was my first instrument, I consider myself predominantly a guitarist. A lot of chords and inversions get lost in the "reality" of finger dexterity on a guitar (either difficult or impossible to fret properly), so those options can get blown off for simpler alternatives. Scaler 2 has been a nice tool for me to regain some focus on the sheer versatility of the piano.

There are numerous tutorials online. The GUI is a bit more complex than it appears at first glance, so learning to navigate that right away helps to accelerate the learning curve.

So for me, in my case. I have medium music theory knowledge. But the way I use these tools is I like to come up with my own chords and progressions but sometimes I use them to help me figure out what chords I am actually playing when adding lots of jazzy notes to them and then I use the tools to help me figure out what other places I could go to chord wise when hitting too many jazzy notes. Also helps me keep track what keys I am in. 

[mettelus]

Re-read this thread so another quick comment. It seems "music theory" gets a lot of attention, which is a nicety for sure, but there is significantly more to Scaler 2 than that. The performance features are also of note, although they are also classified in musical terminology so they sort of force you to learn terms (e.g., Italian). These can also be used to directly drive another VSTi (great for noodling around), or even dragged/dropped into a MIDI track. Although there is a performance engine internally, I find that more overhead than the drag/drop method (too many mouse clicks and you can work faster in the PRV). I also have an affinity for anacrusis, which seems to be the bane of many VSTi sequencing engines.

As mentioned early on, definitely worth the trial. Also recommended to check the tutorials first (to understand the full feature set and GUI) before the trial to get the most out of that decision period.

[GTsongwriter]

Personally, I don't use it.  I can find any chord progression online via Google if needed.

Unless you want the 1gb of instruments it comes with (which I don't), I think it's a waste of money. 

Reaper has a script that basically does the same thing for free. 

 

Edited July 24 by El Diablo
if doesn't equal of

[audioschmaudio]

2 hours ago, El Diablo said:

Reaper has a script that basically does the same thing for free

What script is that?

[GTsongwriter]

25 minutes ago, audioschmaudio said:

What script is that?

Remind me tomorrow to look it up.  I work Sunday - Wednesday night 14 hour shifts.  Thursday will be a night to look that up for you.  I have a copy just in case, although, not sure if I can post it here?

[audioschmaudio]

42 minutes ago, El Diablo said:

Remind me tomorrow to look it up.  I work Sunday - Wednesday night 14 hour shifts.  Thursday will be a night to look that up for you.  I have a copy just in case, although, not sure if I can post it here?

Nah, no need to send a copy here, especially not when it's free anyway. I don't use Reaper myself but have a colleague who does. I'm sure he'd appreciate a script that can do what Scaler 2 does.

[Brian Walton]

5 hours ago, El Diablo said:

Personally, I don't use it.  I can find any chord progression online via Google if needed.

Unless you want the 1gb of instruments it comes with (which I don't), I think it's a waste of money. 

Reaper has a script that basically does the same thing for free. 

 

Respectfully I think you have a limited understanding of what scaler 2 is capable of if you are just thinking about it in terms of grabbing a chord progression from Google and some Reaper script.

 

[GTsongwriter]

2 hours ago, Brian Walton said:

Respectfully I think you have a limited understanding of what scaler 2 is capable of if you are just thinking about it in terms of grabbing a chord progression from Google and some Reaper script.

 

I understand that they "assign" feelings to chords, but you can find that information online. 

I understand they allow you to "loop" like a midi by drag and drop chords in any order you want. 

You can drag and drop chords into your DAW as a MIDI clip.

Pick a key, and it'll show you all the combinations for chords for that key. 

A bunch of minor things to do with chords and things you can do in your DAW anyhow, like playing the chords in a sequencer.

Edit: Establish your musical key and scale with audio detection as well as MIDI detection. [ I've got Melodyne Studio for that, so for me it's not needed. ]

 

With the script plugin, you can drag and drop chords as clips and find chords for whatever key you want. 

With the script plugin, you can play the chords in the script plugin without dropping them into the track. 

The script plugin won't have the "emotions" part, but you can find that information online. 

Anything doing with playing the chords can be done in the DAW already. 

The script plugin doesn't come with the bloat-ware (1 gigabyte of instruments).

The script plugin isn't as pretty as the Scaler 2, but with the script you can edit that source code to make it how you want it. 

 

Edit:

There's a few new things I notice now... But I've got plugins that can do the things they added to Scaler 2 since I last demoed it.

Edited July 24 by El Diablo

[telecode 101]

12 hours ago, El Diablo said:

Personally, I don't use it.  I can find any chord progression online via Google if needed.

Unless you want the 1gb of instruments it comes with (which I don't), I think it's a waste of money. 

Reaper has a script that basically does the same thing for free. 

 

In the case of a product such as EZ Keys, where it comes in handy is when trying to figure out how to play keyboard parts for genres you don’t know that well. The Salsa and Jazz expansion were really handy to me because I haven’t the first clue how to go about approaching how to play a salsa Latino type groove on keyboard and what sorts of common progressions usually occur in those genres. Loading up a track of EZK you got some starting place and then from there move on in your own direction.

Edited July 24 by telecode 101

[Doug Rintoul]

6 hours ago, El Diablo said:

I understand that they "assign" feelings to chords, but you can find that information online. 

I understand they allow you to "loop" like a midi by drag and drop chords in any order you want. 

You can drag and drop chords into your DAW as a MIDI clip.

Pick a key, and it'll show you all the combinations for chords for that key. 

A bunch of minor things to do with chords and things you can do in your DAW anyhow, like playing the chords in a sequencer.

Edit: Establish your musical key and scale with audio detection as well as MIDI detection. [ I've got Melodyne Studio for that, so for me it's not needed. ]

 

With the script plugin, you can drag and drop chords as clips and find chords for whatever key you want. 

With the script plugin, you can play the chords in the script plugin without dropping them into the track. 

The script plugin won't have the "emotions" part, but you can find that information online. 

Anything doing with playing the chords can be done in the DAW already. 

The script plugin doesn't come with the bloat-ware (1 gigabyte of instruments).

The script plugin isn't as pretty as the Scaler 2, but with the script you can edit that source code to make it how you want it. 

 

Edit:

There's a few new things I notice now... But I've got plugins that can do the things they added to Scaler 2 since I last demoed it.

This sounds like a painful workflow to me. What I find Scaler good for is to sketch out a song quickly and to be able to try out different chords, voicings, and inversions. 

I also don't find the instruments that come with Scaler bloatware. I wouldn't use them in a final version of a song, but they are convenient to get an idea of what something might sound like without the tedium of having to open another plugin and set up the routing from Scaler to the plugin. 1 Gigabyte is really not much these days. Scaler is really about having the the things you describe above in a single tool that can be used in any DAW, not just Reaper.

If you are happy with your workflow, more power to you; it is just not the way I would choose to work.

[Brian Walton]

8 hours ago, El Diablo said:

I understand that they "assign" feelings to chords, but you can find that information online. 

I understand they allow you to "loop" like a midi by drag and drop chords in any order you want. 

You can drag and drop chords into your DAW as a MIDI clip.

Pick a key, and it'll show you all the combinations for chords for that key. 

A bunch of minor things to do with chords and things you can do in your DAW anyhow, like playing the chords in a sequencer.

Edit: Establish your musical key and scale with audio detection as well as MIDI detection. [ I've got Melodyne Studio for that, so for me it's not needed. ]

 

With the script plugin, you can drag and drop chords as clips and find chords for whatever key you want. 

With the script plugin, you can play the chords in the script plugin without dropping them into the track. 

The script plugin won't have the "emotions" part, but you can find that information online. 

Anything doing with playing the chords can be done in the DAW already. 

The script plugin doesn't come with the bloat-ware (1 gigabyte of instruments).

The script plugin isn't as pretty as the Scaler 2, but with the script you can edit that source code to make it how you want it. 

 

Edit:

There's a few new things I notice now... But I've got plugins that can do the things they added to Scaler 2 since I last demoed it.

It is fine if it isn't a program for you , but I still think your view of what it does is limited compared to what it actually does.

Reading your post all I can envision is owning a guitar and thinking I don't need a musician to make music with it because I already have the instrument that is capable of chords, scales, etc.  

That workflow sounds dreadful.  This program costs $35, not $800.

[GTsongwriter]

It's been a year since I last demoed it.  Maybe I'll give it another shot.

[SMcNamara]

There is no program to my knowledge that comes close to doing what Scaler does, if you take the time (and it's not a steep learning curve) to play with it and watch YT videos about its processes.  It's fantastic for trying chord progressions and chords (inverted, extensions, etc.) that you might never think about.  Plus it can provide ideas for basslines, arpeggios, melodies, all kinds of things.

At $35? No-brainer.