How to use reference tracks witbout having to buy them?

[Max Arwood]

One great option is a Spotify subscription. The artist at least get Pennie’s! The quality is a bit better and the best part you can download them. You could get a bunch of songs in one month!!  YouTube is a great backup. 

[pwal³]

I just go for the yt download 👍

[Kurre]

Second hand shops usually have tons of cd's to a lower than low price.

[T Boog]

I appreciate all the good advice guys. I'm gonna try the CD route. My daughter has a bunch of my old CD's. There's bound to be a couple songs in the ballpark of my mix. Thanks a lot. Cheers!

[Bristol_Jonesey]

1 hour ago, T Boog said:

I appreciate all the good advice guys. I'm gonna try the CD route. My daughter has a bunch of my old CD's. There's bound to be a couple songs in the ballpark of my mix. Thanks a lot. Cheers!

Easiest way by far

[steve@baselines.com]

20 hours ago, AB99 said:

What about mp3 at 320kbps.  Seems to go up to 20khz.

You still are losing some above 6K.  

[steve@baselines.com]

46 minutes ago, Bristol_Jonesey said:

Easiest way by far

Please let us know how those work out.  Do they come out as lossless, or more like mp3?

 

[Bristol_Jonesey]

1 hour ago, steve@baselines.com said:

Please let us know how those work out.  Do they come out as lossless, or more like mp3?

 

If you're importing directly from a CD they are bound to be  lossless

[steve@baselines.com]

59 minutes ago, Bristol_Jonesey said:

If you're importing directly from a CD they are bound to be  lossless

 importing the same thing as ripping as far as losslessness?  I am not sure but I don't think so.

[steve@baselines.com]

I asked Gemini about Windows Media Player - here's what it said.

 

No, Windows Media Player version 12 unfortunately doesn't offer a direct way to rip songs in a lossless format like FLAC or WAV. While it allows ripping in WMA (Windows Media Audio) format, WMA itself has lossy compression.

Here are some alternatives for ripping lossless audio:

Freeware software: There are several free and open-source programs specifically designed for ripping CDs in lossless formats. Popular options include Exact Audio Copy (EAC) and Freac [search Exact Audio Copy] [search Freac].

Paid software: Some paid music management software like dBpoweramp CD Ripper offer advanced ripping features with lossless format support [search dBpoweramp CD Ripper].

While these options require installing additional software, they provide more control over the ripping process and ensure you get the highest quality audio files.

[Bristol_Jonesey]

25 minutes ago, steve@baselines.com said:

 importing the same thing as ripping as far as losslessness?  I am not sure but I don't think so.

Importing a track from a CD into Sonar will grab hold of the wav at 16bit 44.1KHz.

By its very nature it will be lossless. It's at full CD resolution.

There is no other software in play to convert it to anything else

[steve@baselines.com]

33 minutes ago, Bristol_Jonesey said:

Importing a track from a CD into Sonar will grab hold of the wav at 16bit 44.1KHz.

By its very nature it will be lossless. It's at full CD resolution.

There is no other software in play to convert it to anything else

Thanks for the information!  

[Duncan Stitt]

Yeah, I get triggered by "free music", as if Napster just happened. My fault. Ha ha.

After resisting streaming services for years, I finally signed up for Apple Music because they pay more per-listen to the creators than the other streaming services. Even then, if I find an artist I like, I buy their CD or download, ideally through their website or Bandcamp page so the grifters who run the music business get less of a cut. Also, I want to see the credits. It amazes me that songwriters are so often left anonymous on streaming sites.

Curious what the instrumentation is on your cello/piano track. The Branden & James duo might have something similar, although I'm not a fan of the mix of the song I linked. I figured, if their music was similar to yours, you could delve into their catalogue to find something better.

Lyle Lovett has used cello in his productions, including with his 'Large Band' that has a piano player. They've also done some duo tracks on YouTube with guitar/vocal/cello. 

I just finished a folky project with guitars, vocals, cello and bass, although in a couple of songs, we turned off the bass to let the cello take it. It all depends on the arrangement. If the cello is playing distinct lines and the bass is more of a mushy pulse under the track, they can coexist. It also depends on how you mic'd the cello. If it's really thick, with a lot of low end,  of course the bass is going to fight with it. If it's bright and airy ala the B&J track, it's easier to include a bass track.

Mixing is all about compromises.  i'll solo the bass and piano tracks together and then sweep a parametric EQ in boost mode to find a frequency range the "blooms". I'll then cut that range in either the piano or bass so they're not competing. I'll also alter the piano part to leave room for another instrument, but I generally record midi piano so it's easy to edit parts while mixing. With midi piano, you can reduce the velocity of problem notes so they're softer but still there, or you can delete them entirely. With a real piano, you can automate volume, but ducking individual notes in a chord is not going to work. Many mix engineers will tell you the key is volume automation. They use it everywhere.

Keep in mind, mixing is highly subjective. John Mayer went through three A-list mixers before he found the sound he wanted for the Continuum album, and these were all top tier mixing engineers.

[Max Arwood]

I have used EAC. It works very well. 

[T Boog]

On 6/23/2024 at 3:54 PM, Duncan Stitt said:

Curious what the instrumentation is on your cello/piano track.

Cheers Duncan. Glad u messaged back bud. My song is mainly piano driven(tts1 btw) with left & right acoustic guitars, Slate drum kit, lead & backing vocals & the SI strings. Yeah to clarify, it's not a real cello. I meant the left hand part/bass range of the SI strings.

Btw, u gave some great advice on how to make room in the low end but yeah, I kinda took the easy way out and killed the bass guitar. Esp when I realized that panning the cello part anywhere other than center sounds silly.

Now what I did do is I went back in my midi piano parts and made the left hand part more interesting. So it sounds like a real, independent bass line. 

However, since it's being played on piano, it sounds more like an acoustic bass line. That's why I mentioned mtv unplugged. It has that kinda vibe.

Btw, I'll def check out Lyle Lovett again. I used to watch him on Austin City Limits all the time. Great voice & great writer. Not to mention, he hooked up with Julia Roberts. That alone makes him a genius! 😁

[John Vere]

TTS-1 piano? That’s gotta hurt! 

Best free piano I’ve used was XLN ADDICTIVE keys has a lifetime demo that it’s only drawback is it is missing the extreme upper and lower octaves. Not an issue for me as I don’t use those ranges in my parts. it is miles above the flat sound of the TTS-1. 
You just need to create an XLN account and install the Manager app. You also get a lifetime demo of Addictive Drums which is one good kit with the Tom’s missing. Then I use SI drums just for the Tom’s. 

[T Boog]

1 hour ago, John Vere said:

TTS-1 piano? That’s gotta hurt!

Cheers John. I know the TTS1 isnt the best but I believe my stellar, prodigy-like piano playing makes up for it. Have u ever heard of Mozart, Beethoven, Bach?... I make em all sound like they have arthritis!

No seriously, I do have some great(though still free) piano vsts. Like the Soniccouture Hammersmith. That one sounds amazing with pedal noise and everything. However(& Ive mentioned this in a past post) there's a certain consistency & upper mid chime to the TTS1 Piano 1 that I really like in the mix.

I find that the more realistic & rich pianos aren't always what the track wants. Esp the ones that are so realistic that theyre slightly out of tune or one key has a deader attack than the others. 

And although I'm no wizard piano player I do think I have a good touch. And to me, that's the real key. Writing great songs and playing with feeling is what's most important. But I know u already know that.

Now, stop raggin on my TTS1 John! 😠

 

[John Vere]

I’ll admit that I totally agree that as far as piano in a mix goes you are correct. I actually don’t use Addictive Keys on my own songs I use the old Cakewalk True Pianos. 
it is like night and day because it is simple. 
I used to always use the TTS/1 piano for same reason you are saying. I Then got the Addictive Keys demo when Sonar switched from Session Drummer to AD2. 
I was using it but in my last phase of re mixing all my original songs I discovered True Piano was what I was looking for. 
I only mentioned this thinking you were needing a “Better “ piano sound but I regress. 
I will miss the TTS-1 the day Windows updates kill it. 

[T Boog]

2 minutes ago, John Vere said:

I only mentioned this thinking you were needing a “Better “ piano sound but I regress. 
I will miss the TTS-1 the day Windows updates kill it. 

No, I appreciate that John. I know it's hard to know exactly what sound someone else is after. Btw, that one piano sound is all I use the TTS1 for and thankfully u guys taught me that its from the Roland Soundcanvas. So when the TTS1 does die, at least I know where to get it. Other than that, I think u'll miss the TTS1 more than me. I know u've discovered some other players, is the TTS1 still ur go-to?

[John Vere]

I found it still opens with GM files for preview but my favourite is the Coyote player.
I also found the TTS-1 had the best Steel Drum out of dozens of other sources. Once again it wasn’t the best when soloed but it worked the best for the songs I’m covering by Jimmy Buffet.