Converting Audio to Midi - having problems

[John Vere]

 I fired up my Laptop. Checking in my apps it only shows Melodyne 4 installed. I open the stand alone and you see that it is not activated and if I click on Activate it takes me to the Celemony web site. 

I opened a project which has real drums and bass tracks and I dragged the Bass track to a midi track and it converted the audio to midi just like it always has for me for a long time. But what I never saw was the dialogue that asks you to choose the algorithm. I've think I always see that.  It just asked me if I wanted to proceed. 

I then clicked on the Kick drum track and applied regional effects and this opened the editor with same toast message as the stand alone. It seems the Kick drum was represented in the editor and I noticed there's no option to choose algorithms they are greyed out. So I undid the regional effect and dragged the kick drum to a midi track. It took a long time and the progress bar was moving very slowly. It eventually crashed Sonar ( new version) 

But what will be different for you is you probably don't have Melodyne 4 installed. Check your Program files under Celemony. 

 I come to the conclusion that people who started fresh with CbB over the last 2 year won't have Melodyne 4 and therefore the conversion no longer works. 

And I've never seen this crash before so obviously the Player version which doesn't have the option for the algorithms is touchy. 

Edited March 29 by John Vere

[Roy Slough]

15 minutes ago, John Vere said:

 I fired up my Laptop. Checking in my apps it only shows Melodyne 4 installed. I open the stand alone and you see that it is not activated and if I click on Activate it takes me to the Celemony web site. 

I opened a project which has real drums and bass tracks and I dragged the Bass track to a midi track and it converted the audio to midi just like it always has for me for a long time. But what I never saw was the dialogue that asks you to choose the algorithm. I've think I always see that.  It just asked me if I wanted to proceed. 

I then clicked on the Kick drum track and applied regional effects and this opened the editor with same toast message as the stand alone. It seems the Kick drum was represented in the editor and I noticed there's no option to choose algorithms they are greyed out. So I undid the regional effect and dragged the kick drum to a midi track. It took a long time and the progress bar was moving very slowly. It eventually crashed Sonar ( new version) 

But what will be different for you is you probably don't have Melodyne 4 installed. Check your Program files under Celemony. 

 I come to the conclusion that people who started fresh with CbB over the last 2 year won't have Melodyne 4 and therefore the conversion no longer works. 

And I've never seen this crash before so obviously the Player version which doesn't have the option for the algorithms is touchy. 

Thanks John, I have checked and it is Melodyne 5.3.1.018  And I activated a 30 day trial version (probably premature as yet I don't have the skills to play with it.)

However, I also did notice that if I create a region FX with melodyne, then process that region again with Melodyne the option  to copy Midi events is greyed out.  DO we think THIS is the source of my troubles? (see attached screenshots)

N.B ATM I am working with a mono Bass track, Melodyne does not recognise the note scale (every note is A) and Ctrl Drag does not create a region in the Midi track.  Also the algorithm options within Melodyne are greyed out like yours.  I do get the option to choose algorithm when doing the Ctrl Drag, but Default, automatic, percussive (when trying drums) all have the same result of no region in the new midi track

Approaching from a different angle, is there another free way to convert audio to Midi  ? (outside of CbB & Melodyne)

Thanks again

[John Vere]

You cannot do anything to any audio clip that is open in Melodyne editor.  This is why that is greyed out.    That's why I said above I un-did the regional effect before I dragged the Kick drum. 

For the audio to midi you don't use Regional effect. You just drag the audio to an instrument or midi track and it will ask you which Algorithm to use. Use Melodic for bass and percussive for drums, And then If you want Guitar chords you use Polyphonic sustain. 

I highly recommend you watch the Celemony videos on their web site, they are very well done. 

I use Melodyne for way more than pitch correction. You can adjust time and level as well. As I said it's the best money I ever spent on software. 

 

[mettelus]

19 minutes ago, John Vere said:

You just drag the audio to an instrument or midi track and it will ask you which Algorithm to use.

John had mentioned this earlier, but since you mentioned CTRL-drag again (which is to copy) I am wondering if that is the underlying issue. What happens if you simply left click and drag (no CTRL or Shift) an audio file onto a MIDI track? To save time and also test other material, you could also use a simple audio loop from the browser (put something into an audio track first, then drag it into a MIDI track). Does that do anything differently?

[Roy Slough]

18 hours ago, John Vere said:

You cannot do anything to any audio clip that is open in Melodyne editor.  This is why that is greyed out.    That's why I said above I un-did the regional effect before I dragged the Kick drum. 

For the audio to midi you don't use Regional effect. You just drag the audio to an instrument or midi track and it will ask you which Algorithm to use. Use Melodic for bass and percussive for drums, And then If you want Guitar chords you use Polyphonic sustain. 

I highly recommend you watch the Celemony videos on their web site, they are very well done. 

I use Melodyne for way more than pitch correction. You can adjust time and level as well. As I said it's the best money I ever spent on software. 

 

Okay, I only mentioned the regional FX because it showed both Melodyne and Drum Replacer.  If I start playing with Pitch correction etc. I will look at Melodyne then (I'm not very good at pitch so hopefully Melodyne will identify off pitch stuff for me - People tell me my lead singer was often flat but I can't hear it)

Anyways, back to the Audio to Midi conversion. All the videos I watch show it just working, No matter which algorithm I choose (Melodic, Percussive, Automatic, default) It says Mixing down Audio, Analysing Audio , then nothing in the Midi track. It is the same if my source is Stereo or Mono Audio, Drums or Bass.

Just to double check, what do you mean by instrument track. I can create Audio, Midi and soft synth tracks. Ctrl Drag to both Midi and the Midi track created with a soft synth have the same result = no data?

Once again thanks for all you help on this, I could revert to recording new drums but this would need me to purchase a Midi USB input device for my drum pad (90's Roland  Pad5) and it would be nice to work out if it is user error or a system restriction/problem before I give up.

[Roy Slough]

19 hours ago, mettelus said:

John had mentioned this earlier, but since you mentioned CTRL-drag again (which is to copy) I am wondering if that is the underlying issue. What happens if you simply left click and drag (no CTRL or Shift) an audio file onto a MIDI track? To save time and also test other material, you could also use a simple audio loop from the browser (put something into an audio track first, then drag it into a MIDI track). Does that do anything differently?

Apologies Mettelus, I didn't see your post before John's

I have tried both just left click & Drag and ctrl & drag, Attached are screenshots of the create soft synth track and the result of dragging the Audio to the midi track of the soft synth (I have returned to drums as this is what i need most),

AmI creating the target midi track the correct way?

After the dragI can see nothing in the Midi track and I believe I should see something unless there is another view I should use.?

[Roy Slough]

19 hours ago, mettelus said:

John had mentioned this earlier, but since you mentioned CTRL-drag again (which is to copy) I am wondering if that is the underlying issue. What happens if you simply left click and drag (no CTRL or Shift) an audio file onto a MIDI track? To save time and also test other material, you could also use a simple audio loop from the browser (put something into an audio track first, then drag it into a MIDI track). Does that do anything differently?

I also loaded the time to fly demo project and tried to do the audio to midi convert using one of the tom tom audio tracks. Same result = no data

[John Vere]

So are you just using a Demo version of Melodyne? Possibly that is the problem. This feature might be disabled. 

[Roy Slough]

1 hour ago, John Vere said:

So are you just using a Demo version of Melodyne? Possibly that is the problem. This feature might be disabled. 

Well.....   Initially I got whatever installed with Cakewalk.  Then when I was accessing the Melodyne area (via the region fx)  I was presented with an internet web page offering me a subscription OR a 30 day trial. I took the 30 day trial but as yet have seen no change in what I am presented with. Perhaps I need to do some thing within Melodyne itself to activate the 30 day trial?

I checked and Melodyne says it is in Trial mode (see screenshot)

Edited March 30 by Roy Slough

[Glenn Stanton]

maybe you need to install the version you signed up for from the celemony site? i know whenever i install a version or update i have to  get it from the site as it contains the license. so even a trial version might need this.

[Roy Slough]

1 hour ago, John Vere said:

So are you just using a Demo version of Melodyne? Possibly that is the problem. This feature might be disabled. 

I just started Melodyne directly (not though CbB)  Imported a bass track and it appears as screenshot below

All notes are "A" (which is not correct)  ??

Everyth

[Roy Slough]

7 minutes ago, Glenn Stanton said:

maybe you need to install the version you signed up for from the celemony site? i know whenever i install a version or update i have to  get it from the site as it contains the license. so even a trial version might need this.

Thanks Glenn. I just checked for updates from within Melodyne and it says it is the latest version. Also checking the licence status from within Melodyne also states within trial period (see screenshot in prior post)

Apologies guys that this seems so negative, I am trying my best to explore all the suggestions given.?

[treesha]

I’m using melodyne very very much right now aligning several tracks of backing vocals in small clips so many many times I am applying the region fx. Not once have blobs appeared in the melodyne window. As I said in my earlier post, I have to close melodyne window and go to the clip it is on, and double click that clip. Then melodyne opens a second time with the blobs showing. This has been posted on the forum before, so it’s not just me. Recent post on this picture added. Anyways if you haven’t tried this yet, just a reminder to try this. Also, I have developed the habit of making a loop in the cakewalk timeline so that when melodyne opens, its focus is where I want to work vs scrolling around to find a few blobs. Also, google search for free programs like melodyne and there are some. I downloaded but haven’t tried one neural something or other. Hoping your persistence pays off ! 

Edited March 30 by treesha
To add pic

[Canopus]

 

[Roy Slough]

1 hour ago, Canopus said:

 

Thanks Canopus, I followed the video and fell at nearly the first fence. When I create the drum replacer there is no Midi Note below each sample track. This is probably important and maybe the clue as to why all my attempts to create Midi from Audio Fail. I will try to continue the process later but after 5 solid hours of trying different methods, Audio sources, Manual entry/editing of Midi etc.  My brain hurts and I need to stop for a while

To be continued...... 

[Roy Slough]

Well it seems my Cakewalk doesn't do what everyone else does. Could it be my version 2024.02 (build 098, 64bit)  has had all the best features removed as there will be a new pay for version coming out.

I am going to uninstall and re-install in case there was something I missed.

If anyone knows this version to be restricted can they direct me to an historic download site with a previous version?

[Canopus]

Unfortunately, it seems like the video is based on a slightly older version of Drum Replacer than the one currently in CbB. The MIDI Notes in the video at the bottom right of each kit piece (which you can’t find) are now located inside the area to the left where the wave forms are displayed. Other than that, the video should be correct as far as I can see (although surprisingly scarce).

There are two ways to pick replacement sounds. The first one is to select from the small number of available sounds that come with Drum Replacer, or from any other one-shot files you might have on your computer. The other one is to use a plugin like Addictive Drums, or Toontrack EZDrummer. Most likely, you will get a better result using the latter, but if you haven’t got a good drum plugin, you've got to  go with whatever one-shots you have. Both methods are described in the video.

I think the important thing to remember, in order to get a natural sound, is to find a mix between the old material and the new drum sounds. You do that by adjusting the Dry/Wet knob.

Edited March 30 by Canopus

[mettelus]

2 hours ago, Roy Slough said:

I am going to uninstall and re-install in case there was something I missed.

It seems highly probable that you may have an installation issue, since as you have seen in videos, the audio->MIDI conversion should just work.

Another thing to try is to check out the DAW-specific information on Celemony's support page. If that also fails, use their contact support form on the top of that page... they tend to respond to support questions by the very next day, and Melodyne is doing the "grunt work" for the audio->MIDI conversion so they would have much better insight into the "why" and also recommended solutions. While you are at it, I would throw in, "I am burning off my trial period and unable to use Melodyne because of this, can I also get my trial period reset?" The Melodyne folks are a good bunch, and their product is incredibly powerful, so do not hesitate to reach out the them as well.

Quick edit: You can also save a little typing with their support form by inserting the link to this thread if they need more detail of what is going on so they can read it. This link is what I would insert for the original post you made (you can get links to posts by right clicking the post time/date to the right of the author for each post in case you didn't know that).

Edited March 30 by mettelus

[Roy Slough]

21 hours ago, treesha said:

I’m using melodyne very very much right now aligning several tracks of backing vocals in small clips so many many times I am applying the region fx. Not once have blobs appeared in the melodyne window. As I said in my earlier post, I have to close melodyne window and go to the clip it is on, and double click that clip. Then melodyne opens a second time with the blobs showing. This has been posted on the forum before, so it’s not just me. Recent post on this picture added. Anyways if you haven’t tried this yet, just a reminder to try this. Also, I have developed the habit of making a loop in the cakewalk timeline so that when melodyne opens, its focus is where I want to work vs scrolling around to find a few blobs. Also, google search for free programs like melodyne and there are some. I downloaded but haven’t tried one neural something or other. Hoping your persistence pays off ! 

 

Thanks Treesha, Now working on Bass guitar parts.....   I have tried closing and double clicking as you suggested, but still no blobs in Melodayne AND it has not identified the note pitch (all notes are A.

I have even tried using melodyne directly opening the application and not from within CbB,  but again all results same.

I will try more options over Easter and then on Tuesday if still no success I will follow Canopus suggestion, contact Celemony see what they say and try and get my trial period re-started

If you have any other suggestions for me to try over easter I will be pleased to try

[Glenn Stanton]

here's how it works for me:

1) create the region fx - no blobs

2) simply left-click on the clip (not double-click) and the blobs appear.

if you have full screen view of the melodyne window, then you might have additional steps. but if the ARA is working then you just need to sync the position in melodyne with the clip time. in best programming - this would be done for you already. since it's not (at least for me), i just automatically click on the clip once the window opens.