Projects that are initially set at 44.1 kHz using a custom template are automatically converted to 48 kHz when reopened

[Nilo]

As indicated in the title, CbB's default setting is 48 kHz, which matches the sample rate of all the devices on my PC, to change this, I use the New Project dialog to create a 44.1 kHz project through a custom template designed for audiobook auditions.

While I can work without issues in this setup, a problem arises when I save my work and reopen it at a later time – the project opens at 48 kHz, and the waveform is replaced by a flat line.

Interestingly, if I perform the same process but create the project using one of the built-in templates like Basic or Empty, it retains the 44.1 kHz sample rate.

As far as I know, project templates should not alter the project's sample rate. This behavior is consistent with the built-in templates, where the sample rate remains unchanged. However, there appears to be an issue when using custom templates that results in a sample rate override.

I would appreciate any guidance or assistance in resolving this matter.

[David Baay]

I ran into a similar problem several years ago (2018 per e-mail I sent to the Bakers at the time), but with the Basic template itself. CbB default for new projects was set to 48kHz, but my interface would respond to something in the template and switch to 44.1kHz after a few seconds when starting a new project from it. In playing around with it, I somehow ended up creating a copy of the Basic template that did the opposite, switching the interface back to 48kHz when the first project had switched it to 44.1. I submitted both templates to the Bakers, but they couldn't reproduce it and confirmed templates shouldn't do this. They could only suggest that something was going on between Windows and the MOTU driver, but I never did get to the bottom of it. I only ever used the Basic template to create "clean" bug demo projects for the Bakers so I've just continued using the "Basic (48kHz)" version to do that. And I've never had any issues once audio was recorded a project; CbB would always match whatever rate was set in the audio files.

So I just checked, and the issue no longer occurs with that original Basic template file in the current CbB, using all the same hardware and Win10 installation I was running at the time. I have CbB referencing custom file paths for Cakewalk content so updates don't overwrite anything, but that template file's Last Modified date is the same as the currently shipping one written to the "Cakewalk Core" directory: 8/21/2017.

All that said, what interface are you using, and are you sure it's responding to CbB's request to change rates? Some interfaces like my Roland Duo-Capture have to be physically switched. If you open one of the audio files in another audio application or just look at the file properties does the bit rate agree with it being 44.1kHz?  (706, 1058 or 1411 kbps per channel for 16-bit, 24-bit or 32-bit files)

 

 

 

[John Vere]

Just a question but why do you need to use 44.1? Is that the delivery format?
I only ask because if you’re doing it to decrease the file size it’s not a heck of a lot. Decreasing the bit depth will make more of a difference.  
You should be able to open either format but as David said some interfaces don’t do this very nicely. My Motu is one of them. My other interfaces no problem.  

Always check in the transport module to make sure the Sample and Bit rates are what you wanted before you record. 

[Nilo]

Thank you both @David Baay and @John Vere.

I usually record at 48 kHz and then export my audio files at 44.1 kHz and 16-bit, which is the required format for audiobooks. However, I recently had a project with a substantial recording, with Part One alone spanning over 2 hours, divided into three separate files. To maintain consistency and reduce the file size and CPU load on my relatively slow PC during the editing process, I decided it would be better to both record and edit the project at 44.1 kHz from the beginning.

[I would like to point out that Pro tools Intro, the free version, handles the 3 files at once, on the same PC, very nicely and smoothly, but I am just not familiar with it as I am with CbB that has also all my presets].

The issue I encountered didn't arise during the recording phase; instead, it occurred during the editing process. The audio files were originally recorded elsewhere at 44.1 kHz using my Behringer UMC22 Audio Interface and were subsequently imported in CbB on a different PC (for editing).

That is: the imported file is 44.1 kHz, the new project created in CbB is also 44.1 kHz 16-bit as shown in the transport module, I do all my editing without any problem, save my work, but when I reopen it, it shows 48kHz 16-bit, the waveform's gone, and when I try to recompute picture, there is no associated audio file there!
In this scenario, I think, the audio interface isn't at play, or is it?

Here's some screenshots:

[Nilo]

I believe I've identified the source of this problem, hopefully!

The main difference between the custom and built-in templates lies in that the custom template includes an audio track named "noise floor." This track contains a recording of the background noise in my recording room, which serves as a base for my VO. When I edit the audio to remove unwanted breath sounds, this "noise floor" track fills in those gaps with background noise, ensuring that the audiobook meets the required standards.

This "noise floor" file included in the custom template has a sample rate of 48,000 Hz. When I created a new 44.1 kHz project using the problematic template but removed the "bed" track before saving it, the issue disappeared, and the project maintained the 44.1 kHz sample rate.

So, could this "mixed sample rates" be the root cause of the problem?

[John Vere]

Cakewalk is real good at taking anything you throw at it. If a project is 44.1. And you drag and drop a 48 or even a MP3 audio file  it automatically converts the audio to 44.1.. Of note is the bit depth stays the same as original as Cakewalk can have audio files at any bit depth, but sample rate has to be the same. 

[Nilo]

7 minutes ago, John Vere said:

Cakewalk is real good at taking anything you throw at it. If a project is 44.1. And you drag and drop a 48 or even a MP3 audio file  it automatically converts the audio to 44.1.. Of note is the bit depth stays the same as original as Cakewalk can have audio files at any bit depth, but sample rate has to be the same. 

I agree, and that what happens if I drag or insert the 48k file into the 44.1k project, but apparently this is not the case when a custom template already includes a track with a certain sample rate.
In my case I start a 44.1kHz project, that already includes a 48kHz track from the saved custom template, and the program doesn't warn against this sample rate mismatch!