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Questions re: Line 6 Helix Native (Any users? Ed maybe?)

SteveStrummerUK

By SteveStrummerUK
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SteveStrummerUK

SteveStrummerUK

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Have heard some really good reviews about Line 6 Helix, both the hardware and software versions.

As I get a pretty decent discount for being a POD Farm Platinum owner, I was thinking of getting the software (i.e. 'Native' version).

I've been trying to find out some info about it on the Line 6 website, but as we all know, their customer service/website/information is a complete mess.

So, I'm hoping there's a Native user here who can answer these simple questions Line6.com  seems incapable of supplying the information for:

  1. In addition to the plug-in, does it have a 'standalone' version (similar to how POD Farm can be opened as an independent app as well as a VST inside a DAW)?
  2. If it doesn't have a standalone version, does anyone have experience of any half-decent third-party VST host apps that means one doesn't have to go through all the rigmarole of opening Cakewalk, inserting the VST etc?

Cheers in advance ☺️

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Grant Starr

Grant Starr

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 I don't have it, but looks like there is a 15 day free trial https://line6.com/helix/helixnative.html   I haven't dealt with their support for years, but the only experience with them was a really pleasant one.  I had Pod farm Platinum and they upgraded me to Pod Farm 2 for free because the download was no longer available.

  You Beagle and Randy pretty much talked me into my first interface a line 6  tone port when you all finally convinced me the soundblaster X-fi and computer speakers wouldn't do. 

So you still have Platinum Strummy?  Does it work in 64 bit?  

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SteveStrummerUK

SteveStrummerUK

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1 hour ago, Grant Starr said:

 I don't have it, but looks like there is a 15 day free trial https://line6.com/helix/helixnative.html   

Cool, thanks Grant.

I might give that a go while I'm stuck at home for a while.

 

1 hour ago, Grant Starr said:

 Strummy?  Does it work in 64 bit?  

I hardly use the PODFarm stuff these days mate (see below*), but I still use my TonePort UX2 as my interface (on a Win 10 64bit PC).

Line 6 don't really seem to support my older hardware/software anymore, especially on Win 10. It makes my set-up a bit of a pain to record with as the only driver options are 44100/16 and 48000/16.  On my Win 7 machine with the identical hardware/software, I can also set 48,000/24 and 48,000/24. Progress eh? Have to say, this is a major PITA as I'd been using 48/24 since I got my TonePort way back when.

Line 6 "promised" they would get updated drivers out for Win 10 + TonePort/PODStudio users within days of Win 10 'breaking' the 24bit option. Those 'days' have now become four years and I'm still waiting ?  Hence my lack of faith in their customer support.

* Here's how I run when I'm just strumming around and home. I plug into my Kemper and run a mono Line Out into the Line In on the TonePort. Inside my PC, I use the PODFarm interface and run a few different set-ups to play through.

This set-up runs two channels (usually panned ChA = 100%L + ChB = 100%R). The extra digital delay on the B channel let's me switch in a Haas effect if I want to use two (otherwise) identical channels. The beauty is you can switch of the Haas and then stack up a completely different set of FX on each channel - this can be a lot of fun to experiment with and a much more powerful way of using a stereo-based FX section.

SAXMuaV.jpg

 

kemper 001

 

 

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Grant Starr

Grant Starr

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So the UX2 is the issue, bummer. I sold mine several years ago. When they upgraded me to pod farm 2 it was via ilock.  I'm wondering if they would upgrade you to pod farm 2 if you wrote them?  I was just inquiring about the download link to platinum when they upgraded me.  

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Jim Roseberry

Jim Roseberry

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Helix Native is IMO the best software based amp-sim plugin currently available.

 

A workaround for not having a standalone version:

Save an otherwise empty project with Helix Native setup and ready to play.

You've got User presets in Helix Native... so you can swap sounds quickly.

The UI is pretty easy to get around (especially if you're familiar with the hardware Helix).

 

You can load your favorite IRs (for both Cab and acoustic-body-resonance).

 

Another thing to keep in mind:

The better your front end DI, the better results you're going to get with Helix Native.

If you've seen posts saying Helix Native doesn't sound as good as the hardware, it's often because the user is comparing the hardware Helix (120dB dynamic range on the input) to a $100 audio interface (crap DI) as the front end for Helix Native.

 

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SteveStrummerUK

SteveStrummerUK

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6 hours ago, Grant Starr said:

So the UX2 is the issue, bummer. I sold mine several years ago. When they upgraded me to pod farm 2 it was via ilock.  I'm wondering if they would upgrade you to pod farm 2 if you wrote them?  I was just inquiring about the download link to platinum when they upgraded me.  

I'm on PodFarm2 mate, just don't use the amps/cabs as I let the Kemper take care of all that.

As I said, it's fun splitting a mono signal and being able to use PF2's delays/mods independently on the left and right channels.

 

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Mesh

Mesh

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2 hours ago, Jim Roseberry said:

Helix Native is IMO the best software based amp-sim plugin currently available.

 

A workaround for not having a standalone version:

Save an otherwise empty project with Helix Native setup and ready to play.

You've got User presets in Helix Native... so you can swap sounds quickly.

The UI is pretty easy to get around (especially if you're familiar with the hardware Helix).

 

You can load your favorite IRs (for both Cab and acoustic-body-resonance).

 

Another thing to keep in mind:

The better your front end DI, the better results you're going to get with Helix Native.

If you've seen posts saying Helix Native doesn't sound as good as the hardware, it's often because the user is comparing the hardware Helix (120dB dynamic range on the input) to a $100 audio interface (crap DI) as the front end for Helix Native.

 

I'm also very interested in getting this and truly appreciate your input Jim. My DI (IK's Axe I/O) has a 117dB dynamic range which should hopefully be up to par. Will try out the demo and start saving my pennies. :)

 

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Grant Starr

Grant Starr

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Checked out that Kemper on line, nice  bit of kit.  I have to admit, you have my VST monkeys raging with all this Helix talk.  Please don't tell me I need that, I've been off of the VST for sometime now, except for that 57 Fender from UAD... But what harm is a little 15 day demo, no?  Haven't got any external units like that, but after I got the VST thing under control, I had a guitar pedal breakdown though and going to try that hookup with them to see what you're on about with the hass. I don't think I tried that in pod farm.  

Edited by Grant Starr
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  • 3 weeks later...
Mesh

Mesh

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Strummy ol chap, did you test out the Helix yet?

I downloaded the demo last night and just went through some of the presets.....while some sounded very good, others didn't impress me that much.

Mind you, I didn't really tweak anything and I was looking forward to hearing stuff like this vid below (some fantastic tones, especially the clean tones with fx), but didn't get it. He may have honed in the tones prior to the vid and not just using the stock presets IDK.

Either way, I do need to spend some more time on this to get a good feel of it. 

 

 

Edited by Mesh
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Jim Roseberry

Jim Roseberry

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Guitars and players vary so radically, I don't even mess with included presets.

 

Start simple:

  •  Amp block and a Cab block (IR block and be substituted for the Cab block).

If you use an IR block, try to use a Cab IR that you're already familiar with... as this will help "get your bearings" on the overall tone.

Adjust the Amp block parameters like you would on a real amp.

  • Increase/decrease the drive.
  • Roll your guitar volume up/down and listen to how the Amp block responds.
  • If the Amp block feels too tight, increase the Sag parameter.
  • If the Amp block feels too loose, decrease the Sag parameter.

Once you have an Amp block and Cab/IR block that sound decent to your ears, add a Reverb block and dial it to taste.

Sit and play/tweak this for a while.

 

Note that these devices are simulating a mic'd amplified guitar cabinet, they're not simulating the "amp in the room" sound/experience.

That's an important distinction.

ie: Running any of these guitar processors thru  5-8" studio monitors is not going produce the sensation of a 100-watt half-stack.  That's down to physics...  ?

 

I like to start with the Amp block (several slots to the right)... as this leaves room to add block/s before the Amp block.

ie:  You might want to use a high-pass filter prior to the Amp block.  If you hear flabby/tubby/loose bottom-end, this will solve that problem.

FWIW, I use a high-pass filter prior to the Amp block... no matter which hardware/software "modeler I'm using (Helix hardware, Helix Native, GT-1000, Axe-FX III, etc).

 

I've had the fortune of working with all the top-tier guitar processors.  What you learn from using any one of them is directly applicable to all.

If you start with Helix Native... and move to the Axe-FX III (or vice-versa), you'll have knowledge/experience that makes using the new processor more productive.

As with a real amp, all of the top-tier guitar processors are capable of good/excellent results (they're all also capable of sounding bad).

The more time/experience you accumulate, the better results you'll achieve with any of the above.

 

If you're using software based guitar processors, the DI input can make a HUGE difference in quality of results.

Lots of folks complain that Helix Native doesn't sound as good as the hardware version (even though the software algorithms are identical).

Often times, these folks are using a $100 audio interface with a terrible DI.

If you've ever recorded a Fender passive bass with a cheap DI, it can sound extremely weak/anemic (fill in your favorite adjective for bad).

Run that same passive Fender bass thru a quality DI (Neve are some of my favorite)... and the tone is just "there".  

The better your front-end gear, the better Helix Native (or other AmpSim plugin) will sound.

 

Edited by Jim Roseberry
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Mesh

Mesh

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Excellent tips Jim and will definitely do this. If there are any other general block setup's/templates there are your go to, would be greatly appreciated if you could share those.

I've also been watching some of Jason Sadites videos and he nicely breaks it down on how he gets setup quickly. ....very interesting how he starts off with putting a compressor at the end (even before getting the amp and cab).   

 

 

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SteveStrummerUK

SteveStrummerUK

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21 hours ago, Mesh said:

Strummy ol chap, did you test out the Helix yet?

Not as yet Mesh, but I will get round to it.

I did follow Jim's advice and bought a better interface than my old Line 6 TonePort UX2 though. As well as now being able to run at 24/48 (and higher) into CbB, it also has S/PDIF in/out and a MIDI in/out so it connects my Kemper flawlessly/digitally to my PC.

 

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