Magic Russ Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 4 hours ago, Jesse Jost said: As someone who worked very closely on Project 5... I can say that much of the philosophy that went into the design of Project 5 has guided the development of Next. ? That may be one of the more interesting things I have heard today. I see that Next offers tagged browsing of plugins. Is this something coming to Sonar as well? Will Sonar import files from Next? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesse Jost Posted June 6, 2023 Author Share Posted June 6, 2023 Just a note about "the new Sonar"... Sonar will provide exactly the same control layout, menus, commands and workflow as CbB has today. However, the UI will be dramatically improved: clearer text, scalable views, support for high DPI resolutions and multi monitor configurations. The net experience for most should be massively improved over CbB. As we move from bitmaps to scalable vector images and dynamically colored backgrounds, the notion of customizing the UI becomes infinitely simpler, while the current notion of heavy handed theming quickly becomes irrelevant. 9 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Light Grenade Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 38 minutes ago, sjoens said: It sounds like it won't look much different but will be vector based instead of image based. So doubtful there will be much interchange but there will be a new easier to use theme editor. There's screenshots on the new site. For some reason I assumed these screenshots were of CbB and were just place holders. "exciting, new visual identity" implied to me that the UI overhaul would be more substantial. Really happy about the vector upgrade though. CbB really doesn't look great on a 4K display laptop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milton Sica Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 2 minutes ago, Jesse Jost said: Just a note about "the new Sonar"... Sonar will provide exactly the same control layout, menus, commands and workflow as CbB has today. However, the UI will be dramatically improved: clearer text, scalable views, support for high DPI resolutions and multi monitor configurations. The net experience for most should be massively improved over CbB. As we move from bitmaps to scalable vector images and dynamically colored backgrounds, the notion of customizing the UI becomes infinitely simpler, while the current notion of heavy handed theming quickly becomes irrelevant. In the paid version, some kind of discounts will be offered to users who, like me, have actively participated in the improvement, enhancements and corrections in the EA versions ???? It is a marketing and relationship suggestion that I bring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgoRr Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 6 minutes ago, Jesse Jost said: However, the UI will be dramatically improved: clearer text, scalable views, support for high DPI resolutions and multi monitor configurations. It would not be superfluous to have the option of scaling the text size in different places of the interface, I don’t know how difficult it is to implement, but I’m sure that 99.99% of users would be most grateful for this option! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Morgon-Shaw Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 Awwwww man. I will no longer be able to laugh at my fellow TV composers they tell me how much they spent on their DAWs whilst mine is free. Mind you most of them have crazily overpriced Apple Macs so I can still laugh at that. 5yrs of CBB has been a good run. It was always going to end, I'm just happy that we have the return of Sonar - I hope the industry starts taking it seriously again as a major platform as we've seen our favourite DAW somewhat shunned, no longer mentioned by other manufacturers ( I have an Oxygen Pro keyboard here with a preset for seemingly every DAW under the sun except CBB ) and no longer appearing in Sound On Sound alongside the other DAW columns etc. Whislt I'm not interested in a streamlined DAW that looks to be what Next is I'm happy to pay for a new Sonar by subscription at the right price, it makes me laugh when people say they want to "own" it because you never do - it's just licence. Very much look forward to Cakewalk Sonar and if @Noel Borthwick is looking for beta testers for it then sign me up. 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Kelley Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 (edited) I would certainly beta test. It would be worth it just to get a feel for the new UI. This all sound interesting and promising. If it's not worth it, there are alternatives. But I suspect ... Edited June 6, 2023 by Terry Kelley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keni Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 BTW... I was just wondering... Will this affect the forum as well? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Misha Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 Mark, "it makes me laugh when people say they want to "own" it because you never do - it's just licence." License that doesn't expire, unlike subscription only models (possibly excluding future Sonar). I see absolutely nothing funny about that. Do you also laugh at people who prefer to own favorite books instead of going to libraries? It's a choice. So far, Sonar/ Cakewalk was great at backward compatibility. It seems this trend will stay. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gustabo Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 2 hours ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said: Suggested specs were also the words the people at TakeTwo used to describe the minimum requirements for KSP2 and you couldn't even run the game properly with a machine better than those. Regardless, it says suggested specs, not minimum requirements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjoens Posted June 6, 2023 Share Posted June 6, 2023 Wonder if we'll see something like this so we're not wondering why "Sonar" crashed while loading a project: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno de Souza Lino Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 3 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said: What bothers you most about subscription? It's essentially a pay as you go lease model and is beneficial for those who can't justify putting down a lumpsum of cash at one time... In practice, subscription plans for software are a solution for a problem which doesn't exist and introduce more problems than they actually solve. While it could be argued that you're benefiting the users by providing them a price which they can justify paying for, this is the advantage of a payment plan and not a subscription service. Subscription plans are an endless endeavor and eventually, you'll end paying more money on your subscription than the cost of a perpetual license. This is a very big issue with people which have infrequent budgets, like people doing freelance work, as they now have to split a budget they may not have for a tool which they were able to only invest in once and use it for as long as they could run it in their hardware. Also, what happens when a person is in dire straights and can no longer pay for the subscription? Now they lost access to a tool which could help them make money, something which doesn't happen with a perpetual license. Add to that the fact most subscription plans are very easy to enter but almost impossible to get out of, might double charge you for a multitude of reasons, charge you for features you're not interested into and can raise in pricing, which in turn results with it also increasing the pricing of the perpetual license as well. There's also the nature of pricing. Unless you're talking about regional pricing which is compatible for general budgets of people from specific regions of the world, there's no way in hell you're gonna cough up a prince in a single currency which will be fair for everyone looking at it. Doing this right would involve some research and investment which might steer away from improvements which could be invested in the software in question instead. Another issue which will happen is the constant need to update the software in order for customers to feel validated in their choice (they're constantly paying for it after all) and writing away any reliability and stability as a result of that. Plus now users have zero control over which versions of the software they have installed in the machine and one update could potentially stop the world or introduce breaking changes in the workflow or installation for some people which could be hard to trace and solve because now you're dealing with more moving parts. 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IgoRr Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 28 minutes ago, sjoens said: Wonder if we'll see something like this so we're not wondering why "Sonar" crashed while loading a project: You can try to load this project in the following way: launch Cakewalk (Sonar), and from the "File" menu (or CTRL+O), select this project in the browser, first hold down the Shift key, and double-click on the project file to start loading the project. This is the so-called "safe mode", in which Cakewalk will show you the options to load/refuse each plugin/instrument that is in the project. In most cases, even if you load all the elements in this mode, the project can load normally. But if still not, then do not download the Melodyne plugin in your case, after the open project, you can add it manually. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rfssongs Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 2 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said: Theme editor is highly bitmap based so it won't work as is. There are no longer images to replace. The advantage is color changes are now much simpler with vectors. To me anyway I thought the theme editor was a waste of time. Both to use & to create. This is about music not graphics. I read about it, even downloaded it. I don't even think I ever used it. I figured why bother. If it does not help with the music then why ? IMO. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyanide Lovesong Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 (edited) I'm a longtime nostalgic fan from Pro Audio & SONAR era. This VECTOR based 4k update to Cakewalk is something I never thought would happen. The Cakewalk team always had great visual design skills -- the new SONAR is going to look incredible in 4K! And I'm willing to pay for it, absolutely. Also, Jess & Noel both answered questions in more detail than most companies will offer before a product is released. That gives me even more confidence in the team. I'm all in! And charging for Cakewalk actually gives me MORE confidence, not less. I couldn't imagine how Bandlab could keep Cakewalk going... but charging for it could make it a viable long-term business model. Oh I can't wait! Congratulations, Cakewalk team. We're wishing you guys the best, and you might just get a lot of ex-Cakewalkers like me to return with this major update! I'm going to install now so I can relearn the workflow. So excited! And again... Vector... 4K... WOW! Edited June 7, 2023 by Cyanide Lovesong 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noynekker Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 So, will there be any Staff View updates ? Sorry, had to ask . . . I'll get me coat . . . 2 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starship Krupa Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 36 minutes ago, rfssongs said: To me anyway I thought the theme editor was a waste of time. Both to use & to create. This is about music not graphics. I read about it, even downloaded it. I don't even think I ever used it. I figured why bother. If it does not help with the music then why ? IMO. Many people like to customize the tools we use to make music. Just look on YouTube and you'll see how many videos there are about refinishing guitars, rewrapping drums, etc. It is a hobby in itself. I've spent many enjoyable hours working with the Cakewalk Theme Editor. These are my Transport and Loop Control Bar modules. I've made everything larger and therefore more visible. Also used the sort of flat transport buttons that many DAW's, for instance Cakewalk Next, also use. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milton Sica Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 1 hour ago, IgoRr said: You can try to load this project in the following way: launch Cakewalk (Sonar), and from the "File" menu (or CTRL+O), select this project in the browser, first hold down the Shift key, and double-click on the project file to start loading the project. This is the so-called "safe mode", in which Cakewalk will show you the options to load/refuse each plugin/instrument that is in the project. In most cases, even if you load all the elements in this mode, the project can load normally. But if still not, then do not download the Melodyne plugin in your case, after the open project, you can add it manually. My current problem is that the program loads, but does not reach this screen. It simply aborts the operation without any message. I've tried everything, reinstalling, redownloading and reinstalling. Any other tips? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InstrEd Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 22 minutes ago, noynekker said: So, will there be any Staff View updates ? Sorry, had to ask . . . I'll get me coat . . . Grab mine too while you're at it 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teksonik Posted June 7, 2023 Share Posted June 7, 2023 2 hours ago, Jesse Jost said: Just a note about "the new Sonar"... Sonar will provide exactly the same control layout, menus, commands and workflow as CbB has today. However, the UI will be dramatically improved: clearer text, scalable views, support for high DPI resolutions and multi monitor configurations. The net experience for most should be massively improved over CbB. As we move from bitmaps to scalable vector images and dynamically colored backgrounds, the notion of customizing the UI becomes infinitely simpler, while the current notion of heavy handed theming quickly becomes irrelevant. That sounds like "it's going to end up looking like Ableton Live". I love the subdued and hardware style of CbB so please don't turn it into something that looks like a box of crayons exploded. 6 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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