greg54 Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 How do you get a reference track from a CD on CbB? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynn Wilson Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 Go into My Computer>insert disk in drive>right click on drive>choose open>when it opens you can drag and drop individual files (songs) into CW. You may have to shut off auto-play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg54 Posted May 2, 2023 Author Share Posted May 2, 2023 Great. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol_Jonesey Posted May 2, 2023 Share Posted May 2, 2023 Just remember that any track you use as a reference will have already been mastered so route it directly to your interface, not your master buss 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg54 Posted May 3, 2023 Author Share Posted May 3, 2023 16 hours ago, Bristol_Jonesey said: Just remember that any track you use as a reference will have already been mastered so route it directly to your interface, not your master buss Not really understanding this. Don't you just put the reference track into a track in your project? Then you mute it when your song plays, then solo the reference track to compare. Or is that not correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Nelson Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 17 hours ago, Lynn Wilson said: Go into My Computer>insert disk in drive>right click on drive>choose open>when it opens you can drag and drop individual files (songs) into CW. You may have to shut off auto-play. I think you need to rip the track, no? I use Windows'?media player but most players have the rip function. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg54 Posted May 3, 2023 Author Share Posted May 3, 2023 Yes, I need to get the track off the CD and into Cakewalk. I don't have Media Player, for whatever reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg54 Posted May 3, 2023 Author Share Posted May 3, 2023 I have another question. What are you all using to compare your mix with the reference track? I was looking at Izotope's Tonal Balance. Is there one that's better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gustabo Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 28 minutes ago, greg54 said: Not really understanding this. Don't you just put the reference track into a track in your project? Then you mute it when your song plays, then solo the reference track to compare. Or is that not correct? Yes, put it in as a track but output it straight to your interface, not the master bus. Check where your master bus is outputting to as a example as to where to output your reference track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg54 Posted May 3, 2023 Author Share Posted May 3, 2023 41 minutes ago, gustabo said: Check where your master bus is outputting to as a example as to where to output your reference track. I've never thought about where the Master bus outputs to. I always thought of the Master bus as where all the tracks are collected for overall volume control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scook Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 3 minutes ago, greg54 said: I've never thought about where the Master bus outputs to. I always thought of the Master bus as where all the tracks are collected for overall volume control. If that is all you do with the master bus and it's gain and volume are set at unity along with the reference track, then playing the reference track through the bus is OK. If, on the other hand, the reference track is altered any way by the DAW, it kinda changes what the reference is...right? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitflipper Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 16 minutes ago, greg54 said: ...I always thought of the Master bus as where all the tracks are collected for overall volume control. And you are correct. However, the master bus isn't the last place it goes. It's second-to-last. From there the audio is handed off to the audio interface via its driver, and is labeled in the dropdown list of routing destinations with the name that Windows gave it. On my system, for example, it's called "Speakers (Saffire Audio)" because that's what Windows calls my Focusrite Saffire Pro interface. Like Steve says above, it wouldn't matter whether you sent the reference track to the master or to the outside world directly -- if, and only if, there is no processing being done on the master bus. Usually, there is. And you want to bypass that so that the DAW is having zero affect on the sound of your reference. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg54 Posted May 3, 2023 Author Share Posted May 3, 2023 Now I get it! Thanks, everyone, for your comments and explanations. I appreciate the help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol_Jonesey Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 3 hours ago, greg54 said: Not really understanding this. Don't you just put the reference track into a track in your project? Then you mute it when your song plays, then solo the reference track to compare. Or is that not correct? If you run the reference track through any mastering chain that's set up, you are effectively "doubling up" on whatever processing i going on. A ripped CD track that comes it at -0.1dB can be raised to ridiculous levels if there are compressors & limiters in the Fx chain. Also, if the material you're working on isn't going through a mastering chain then, to my mind, the comparison is useless as you're not comparing like for like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg54 Posted May 3, 2023 Author Share Posted May 3, 2023 1 hour ago, Bristol_Jonesey said: Also, if the material you're working on isn't going through a mastering chain then, to my mind, the comparison is useless as you're not comparing like for like. I'm mixing, so I don't have plugins on the Master bus at this point. And I'm comparing levels and overall mix. I've been watching a bunch of mixing videos, and so far they haven't addressed putting plugins on the Master bus during mixing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol_Jonesey Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 1 hour ago, greg54 said: I'm mixing, so I don't have plugins on the Master bus at this point. And I'm comparing levels and overall mix. I've been watching a bunch of mixing videos, and so far they haven't addressed putting plugins on the Master bus during mixing. See, therein lies the problem. You're comparing your, unmastered mix to a mastered reference track. If you can get close without master bus tweaks then kudos to you. Just remember to leave some headroom for when it is mastered 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greg54 Posted May 3, 2023 Author Share Posted May 3, 2023 16 minutes ago, Bristol_Jonesey said: See, therein lies the problem. You're comparing your, unmastered mix to a mastered reference track. If you can get close without master bus tweaks then kudos to you. Just remember to leave some headroom for when it is mastered I've watched at least a dozen videos or more on reference tracks, and so far all of them say to just drop a reference track into a track and compare it to my song to compare. But none of them have said anything about the issue of the reference track being mastered and my mix track being unmastered. It has not been mentioned as being an issue. The only thing they say is to turn down the reference track so that it will be as loud as my mix. If you have a video in mind that talks about what you've mentioned, I would really like to watch it. But so far, I haven't seen anyone talk about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol_Jonesey Posted May 3, 2023 Share Posted May 3, 2023 4 minutes ago, greg54 said: I've watched at least a dozen videos or more on reference tracks, and so far all of them say to just drop a reference track into a track and compare it to my song to compare. But none of them have said anything about the issue of the reference track being mastered and my mix track being unmastered. It has not been mentioned as being an issue. The only thing they say is to turn down the reference track so that it will be as loud as my mix. If you have a video in mind that talks about what you've mentioned, I would really like to watch it. But so far, I haven't seen anyone talk about it. This will mitigate a lot of the associated problems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Nelson Posted May 4, 2023 Share Posted May 4, 2023 14 hours ago, greg54 said: I have another question. What are you all using to compare your mix with the reference track? I was looking at Izotope's Tonal Balance. Is there one that's better? https://www.plugin-alliance.com/en/products/adptr_metricab.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Vere Posted May 4, 2023 Share Posted May 4, 2023 (edited) The problem here is you don’t actually use a reference track in a mixing project as a comparison to a master. You use it to compare your mix balance. As in the balance between the different instruments. This is not the point in production that you are mastering so it is normal not to have processing on a master bus if you choose to do so. It is possible to mix and pre master a song so many of us do have some basic processes on the master like a bit of eq and a limiter. So that’s why the reference track bypasses the master bus. I read about how many studios set up a pre mastering bus so that they can give clients a better idea of how things are going. I never realized that this was how I was working too. Proper Mastering is a completely different process. This is where you export the song(s) and create a mastering project which is now where you do go to town on the master bus as well as using a reference track to compare the loudness and eq and in this case it will for sure need to bypass the master bus. I actually use my own songs as reference tracks. I pick the one that I like the best and use that. I have zero interest in sounding like something I’m not. Edited May 4, 2023 by John Vere 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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