Cakewalk - the only DAW with playback delay issue?

[Will.]

1 hour ago, Antre said:

AMD Ryzen 7 2700X 8 core

Terrible CPU in general. Had one returned it within two days. 80% of this CPU has a poor review. 

https://linustechtips.com/topic/1391211-poor-performance-in-every-games-with-rtx-3070-and-ryzen-7-2700x/

 

https://community.amd.com/t5/processors/ryzen-7-2700x-single-thread-awful-benchmark-performance/td-p/515852

 

It has its goods in certain departments, but its not meant for Music Performances | Nor | Video Editing to mention a few. 

Edited September 27, 2022 by Will.

[bitflipper]

I just replaced my broken i7 with an AMD Ryzen 5 5600x 6-core (which was half the price). Although technically a downgrade (8 cores to 6), I have noticed no difference in performance, either in the number of tracks Cakewalk can handle or in video game FPS. The only benchmarks that matter.

Also not impacted: the speed with which I can impulsively order unnecessary sample libraries.

[Will.]

7 minutes ago, bitflipper said:

AMD Ryzen 5 5600x 6-core (which was half the price).

Yes, no issues with this series in AMD, but definitely with the 3 series and 7 series of the Ryzen series, which is weird. I had to return mine - terrible UI lagging issues. 

The reviews speaks loudly all over this thing we call the "Web of the Wide World." 

 

[Antre]

1 hour ago, bdickens said:

Minimum specs get you minimal performance.

OK, so other DAWs are apparently less CPU-HDD-SDD-RAM hungry, but that is not the question I'm asking.

Here me, again and thats it from me.

Other DAWs plays and stops instantly, eventually after a X tracks with bunch of plugins even on 2048 buf you hit the wall. You get drop outs and audio engine crash but play and stop is instant. So I can freeze tracks or something else...Not frustating at all

CbB - I'm working, no delay at beginning of work... continuous work brings increased delay on play and stop which is at some point far more frustrating than hitting the wall.

So, this is my experience during the years and my only question from the beginning is - Is CbB in this way different from other DAWs, or I need to check/uncheck some button in pref

Everybody can do the test if one wants. You just need  CbB and any other DAW. You can do it with old machine with 30 tracks and other DAW, or with super new PC with 1000 tracks and the other DAW.

That delay is only thing I'm asking about. I experienced it on diferent configurations, but only in CbB and Sonar.

If CbB starts to delay with not enough resources that is, for me, proof that it is different from other DAWs in that behaviour.  

Edited September 27, 2022 by Antre

[Byron Dickens]

I don't have that issue.

How often do you save?

Edited September 27, 2022 by bdickens

[azslow3]

15 hours ago, Antre said:

My laptop:

HP ProBook Intel(R) Core(TM) i5 -3210M CPU @ 2.50GHz

RAM 4.00 GB

HDD 100 GB Free

130 tracks... tons of plug-ins... When I had 4GB RAM, I had to think about each powerful extra plug-in in 3-10 tracks projects.

Yes, REAPER also run on RPi. Stock plug-ins are resource optimized. But that is not a reason to assume everything should have the same requirements. Complicated algos and graphics need resources.

[Antre]

1 hour ago, azslow3 said:

130 tracks... tons of plug-ins... When I had 4GB RAM, I had to think about each powerful extra plug-in in 3-10 tracks projects.

Yes, REAPER also run on RPi. Stock plug-ins are resource optimized. But that is not a reason to assume everything should have the same requirements. Complicated algos and graphics need resources.

I'm not assuming that. You forgot to quote other pc...And please read again what is my question...Is CbB the only DAW that has playback/stop delay issue ON ANY CONFIGURATION when low on resources?

Thats the thing I'm assuming.

Edited September 28, 2022 by Antre

[azslow3]

1 hour ago, Antre said:

And please read again what is my question...Is CbB the only DAW that has playback/stop delay issue ON ANY CONFIGURATION when low on resources?

Then please read my answer one more time: CbB has NO playback/stop delay on any configuration I have ever tried it, till several days on my old system after I have managed to break something in drivers.

You have started claiming "the problem happens without FXes", now you say 130 track filled with PC modules are required to reproduce.
On your notebook I will say any delay in Cakewalk is "normal", such configuration could be fine for Sonar 8.5 under Windows XP, but CbB under Win8 need more CPU and RAM to run modern CPU/RAM hungry plug-ins.

[Antre]

53 minutes ago, azslow3 said:

Then please read my answer one more time: CbB has NO playback/stop delay on any configuration I have ever tried it, till several days on my old system after I have managed to break something in drivers.

You have started claiming "the problem happens without FXes", now you say 130 track filled with PC modules are required to reproduce.
On your notebook I will say any delay in Cakewalk is "normal", such configuration could be fine for Sonar 8.5 under Windows XP, but CbB under Win8 need more CPU and RAM to run modern CPU/RAM hungry plug-ins.

Ok, delay is normal in CbB on my notebook.

Other DAWs in my notebook - no delay. Dosn't meter how much projects are huge. I will get drop out or audio engine crash or program will say that it can read from disk.

That proves my assumptions. Thx

 

Edited September 28, 2022 by Antre

[Byron Dickens]

3 minutes ago, Antre said:

That proofs my assumptions. Thx

Hardly.

 

The fact that others don't have your issue is evidence that the problem is somewhere in your configuration.

Edited September 28, 2022 by bdickens

[GTsongwriter]

I'm considering that Antre may in fact be a Troll on these forms because of the amount of posts he has total, putting everyone into a defensive position by saying "all other DAWS out perform Cakewalk", and in the beginning was taking his time to give us a answer on what computer systems he has ... The amount of stress put of this form is giving this Troll plenty of enjoyment as we try to defend Cakewalk.  I think we should just close this topic.

[John Nelson]

Folks were having difficulties running Sonar and the Blackbird 11 years ago.

http://forum.cakewalk.com/m/tm.aspx?m=2171451&p=1

I mean....think it's time to upgrade.

Edited September 28, 2022 by John Nelson

[Will.]

The things that has been on repeat in this forum. Its only the melody that changes - the lyrics are same. 

[hockeyjx]

1 hour ago, El Diablo said:

I'm considering that Antre may in fact be a Troll on these forms because of the amount of posts he has total, putting everyone into a defensive position by saying "all other DAWS out perform Cakewalk", and in the beginning was taking his time to give us a answer on what computer systems he has ... The amount of stress put of this form is giving this Troll plenty of enjoyment as we try to defend Cakewalk.  I think we should just close this topic.

A sophisticated troll, but a troll nonetheless.

[Noel Borthwick]

On 9/15/2022 at 4:24 AM, Antre said:

When play pressed there is a delay before audio starts playing and this delay is longer if the project is bigger.

For me it was always like this, on several computers during decades using Cakewalk, and it was always extremely annoying.

Along Cakewalk I use few others DAWs and I tried probably every existing DAW - NONE OF THEM IS BEHAVING LIKE THIS.

?

@Antre I realize that it's frustrating when you have a problem that apparently doesn't occur elsewhere, but the truth of the matter with troubleshooting is ALL DAW's are vastly different and that a symptom that appears in one and not another doesn't necessarily shed much light on why this happens. 
As others have indicated there are a ton of moving parts that can lead to something like this.

The proper way to troubleshoot is through a process of elimination:

- Start by deleting tracks - you may be surprised to find that the problem occurs with one of the tracks. If so go further to look at the content.
- Bypass or remove all plugins from the project. Does the transport still take time to start?
- When you press play there are many things that happen as a part of the preroll process. One is opening and prereading to cache audio data for all the tracks. If you have many tracks (many hundreds) and there is a disk fragmentation or slow read issue this process can take a couple of seconds. Try playing with the settings in  Audio | Sync and Caching. Setting a very large playback buffer can cause preroll to take longer.

  

- Check if you have one or more plugins with huge delay buffers. If there is a large delay buffer, again preroll before playback starts will take longer because the engine cannot start playback until all plugins process initial audio.

- Check if always open all device is enabled. If you have many I/Os enabled in preferences and the audio driver is slow it can take long to open the devices.
 

- Check if Allow arm changes during playback and record is enabled. If its on depending on the number of inputs and the driver this can slow the preroll process down 

The above settings are the most typical reasons for lag starting playback.

 

[Noel Borthwick]

Thanks to some tests from @David Baay I have isolated the issue that causes the UI to be unresponsive after stopping when there are hundreds of tracks with certain prochannel modules. It is fixed it for the upcoming release.
The issue is easily reproducible if you have 200 tracks containing the console emulator. The reason for the delay on stop is because the console emulator ends up blocking the user interface under certain conditions. 
I have worked around the plugin issue in our code.

Edit: This fix is included in the 2022.09 official release.