Take Lanes state Today

[micv]

2 hours ago, Keni said:

Hi micv...

 

you have that choice. Select clip envelope followed by type. Track envelopes are intentionally for track.

Keni,

I'm talking about Clip env.  In Clip env, the env is created for the entire take lane.  If you then later move/copy that clip to another lane or track, you cannot edit the env for the copied or moved clip.  What I'm saying is to have those env part of the clip and not the lane.

[Keni]

1 hour ago, micv said:

Keni,

I'm talking about Clip env.  In Clip env, the env is created for the entire take lane.  If you then later move/copy that clip to another lane or track, you cannot edit the env for the copied or moved clip.  What I'm saying is to have those env part of the clip and not the lane.

I must be missing something.

 

if you use Clip Envelopes, they copy/move with your clips.

 

that said, if you use copy special and select envelopes, it will copy that portion of the track envelope.

 

[Misha]

I love take lanes! That was one of major reasons for me to use Cakewalk for some years now . I am waiting with my fingers crossed, for the tweak that Noel B. had mentioned. If it fixes the issue of placing newly recorded take lanes into previously muted lanes,  it will make Cakewalk near perfect for me.

One thing that I believe would improve workflow with clips is ability to right click on a clip (or selection of clips) and have a option of "create new track  from clip(s)" with choice of retaining properties of the track it "came from"... or not to retain these properties.  This is helpful if you have 20-40 take lanes, but you want to keep 5-10 from these, archiving or deleting original track for example. I know of "copy special", it is just the above will make things faster and more intuitive.  Sorry, this has to be in features, but had an urge to jump in and say:

DON'T TAKE MY TAKE LANES AWAY FROM ME OR I WILL TURN INTO DRACULA!  ?  (does this look like Dracula?)

Thank you.

 

[chris.r]

3 hours ago, Misha said:

DON'T TAKE MY TAKE LANES AWAY FROM ME OR I WILL TURN INTO DRACULA!  ?  (does this look like Dracula?)

for me more like a pirate's shield ?

[Giorgio Gabriel]

On 1/4/2019 at 2:28 PM, Noel Borthwick said:

Take lanes was essentially built on top of the layers infrastructure. "Rebuilding layers" automatically happens behind the scenes and is no longer required as an explicit operation.

The main reason why Take lanes was built was to provide an actual UI dedicated to take management. Lanes allowed you to do that but had a lot of manual requirements operations that were non intuitive to the main task of take management that many other platforms offered. Hence we had to make changes.

I do agree that take lanes was a change of workflow for people who were used to simply recording lanes and manually comping them later but it was a trade off we had to make to add tools that were more current. And it would have been way too difficult to maintain both the old layers workflow and take lanes simultaneously in the UI. We'll try and improve on this feature in the future. The next release also has a small tweak to take lanes...

Thank you Noel,

Giorgio

[Noel Borthwick]

21 hours ago, Logan_4600 said:

I'll just say that, for me, Take Lanes never worked, and I've tried several times trhougout the versions. I really still miss layers after all this time. But, maybe, like you said, if you're working on them, I could make the jump soon

Can you try and describe the exact workflow you accomplish with the old layers that you cannot do with take lanes? Maybe there is something we're missing here.

[Noel Borthwick]

 

16 hours ago, micv said:

Keni,

I'm talking about Clip env.  In Clip env, the env is created for the entire take lane.  If you then later move/copy that clip to another lane or track, you cannot edit the env for the copied or moved clip.  What I'm saying is to have those env part of the clip and not the lane.

Clip envelopes are per clip and have no relationship to lanes. As Keni mentioned only track envelopes are displayed in lanes not clip envelopes. If you move a clip its clip envelope is completely independent from any envelope on the track.

[Noel Borthwick]

13 hours ago, Misha said:

One thing that I believe would improve workflow with clips is ability to right click on a clip (or selection of clips) and have a option of "create new track  from clip(s)" with choice of retaining properties of the track it "came from"... or not to retain these properties

Why not just Select and control drag the clips on to a blank space below other tracks? This will create a new track with the selected clips.

[Misha]

13 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Why not just Select and control drag the clips on to a blank space below other tracks? This will create a new track with the selected clips.

Hi Noel. Thank you for trying!

For very simple tasks that might work. Take a look in attachment. This track with all of the "takes" is in the middle of the project. To select clips and drag them with mouse all the way to the bottom  would not be very easy... to keep them at the right time, unless some hard snap is involved.  I am not saying it is critical, there is also "copy special" feature too, but I think right click on clip(s) and have a choice:  move to a new track (where their positions in timeline would be preserved) seems logical

P.S. I tried it the way you described, but it is not dragging well and retaining positions. Kind of freehand movement.

[Keni]

6 minutes ago, Misha said:

Hi Noel. Thank you for trying!

For very simple tasks that might work. Take a look in attachment. This track with all of the "takes" is in the middle of the project. To select clips and drag them with mouse all the way to the bottom  would not be very easy... to keep them at the right time, unless some hard snap is involved.  I am not saying it is critical, there is also "copy special" feature too, but I think right click on clip(s) and have a choice:  move to a new track (where their positions in timeline would be preserved) seems logical

P.S. I tried it the way you described, but it is not dragging well and retaining positions. Kind of freehand movement.

Actually it's pretty easy,

create a track immediately below the last lane

select each clip you wish to move

hold down shift-click and dragging one of the selected from the lowest lane to move all while constraining the movement to keep the time locked. (Ctrl-shift-click to drag copy instead of move if you wish to lave the original track for archiving)

when using shift-click to constrain, note that if you move left/right it will constrain track/lane or up/down to constrain time.

 

[Misha]

Keni, Thanks for the magical Shift! I probably have to make a tattoo with Cakewalk shortcuts on my hands...

Works well, but right click would still be a convenience....:)especially with a pop-up such as with "duplicate track". So you have those important choices plus maybe a choice to "name" that new track.  I know that this should be in "feature requests" section. Could not help it.  Tracking using take lanes is  very important to me. If moderator desires, he/she welcome to move my posts there.

Thank you.

[Noel Borthwick]

Yes I forgot to mention the shift modifier to constrain. That can be used whenever you copy data between tracks to retain position.

[Grem]

Yep..Kenni got it right. You can choose between track and clip envelopes. 

 

However, when you choose clip gain on a track, it will put an envelope on every clip on the trk at the current volume level.

[scook]

I thought clip gain in the edit filter displays the clip gain envelopes for clips in a track making them available for edit. If the clip gain  was not previously modified by the user, it is shown at 0db not the current volume setting.

[Keni]

51 minutes ago, scook said:

I thought clip gain in the edit filter displays the clip gain envelopes for clips in a track making them available for edit. If the clip gain  was not previously modified by the user, it is shown at 0db not the current volume setting.

Yup...

 

That's what I see too.

Enabling it displays all clip envelopes of kind for the track and all default to 0 until edited

[Logan_4600]

On 1/5/2019 at 12:06 PM, Noel Borthwick said:

Can you try and describe the exact workflow you accomplish with the old layers that you cannot do with take lanes? Maybe there is something we're missing here.

Sure! Lets take a guitar take as an example. Say I want to do some stretchs, or clip crossfades between chords to fix minor tempo or sustain issues. I usually start splitting those parts, maybe silghtly moving the clips and then doing the stretch and fades to avoid clicks and constantly Sorting Layers for the sake of visibility and space. I usually end up with 3 of 4 layers of clips, that at the end can fit in just two simple layers that I arragle again with the "Sort Layers" option (this is VERY important for me, I always end up with a two layer track, that ended up likes this after the automatic sorting). All in one simple view, really quick. Every time I tried Take Lanes, even watching videos of how to comp and the new tools, I never were able to replicate this workflow. Maybe, even reading topics and watching videos, I'm still missing something...

[Starship Krupa]

On 12/27/2018 at 11:49 AM, msmcleod said:

Setting the record mode to "Sound on Sound",  enabling Auto Punch and then checking "Mute Previous Takes" pretty much gives me the layers functionality I used in Sonar 8.5.

Mark, I tried this last night and for whatever reason wasn`t seeing a waveform in the track as I was recording.

It recorded fine, and I wound up with tidy clips as you said, but I really missed the visual feedback. As talent and engineer, those waveforms are a comfort.

Also, when I tried it with a MIDI track, I couldn`t get it to record at all.

Something I want to ask about is Overwrite mode. At first when I read the Help page it seemed unsuitable because it sounded as if it would discard all previous takes, but digging deeper, it looks like it might work just like I want it to.

What`s the difference with Overwrite mode? It looks like it keeps your previous takes in their own separate lanes, but mutes them, which is what I want. I`m going to try it with a "check one two" project, but I`d like to hear what the collective wisdom says.

[Keni]

14 minutes ago, Starship Krupa said:

Mark, I tried this last night and for whatever reason wasn`t seeing a waveform in the track as I was recording.

It recorded fine, and I wound up with tidy clips as you said, but I really missed the visual feedback. As talent and engineer, those waveforms are a comfort.

Also, when I tried it with a MIDI track, I couldn`t get it to record at all.

Something I want to ask about is Overwrite mode. At first when I read the Help page it seemed unsuitable because it sounded as if it would discard all previous takes, but digging deeper, it looks like it might work just like I want it to.

What`s the difference with Overwrite mode? It looks like it keeps your previous takes in their own separate lanes, but mutes them, which is what I want. I`m going to try it with a "check one two" project, but I`d like to hear what the collective wisdom says.

Sorry... i just noticed this...

 

I'm sure you have the display icon selected amongst the track widgets?

 

I'm not in front of my machine right now but I think a mouse over shows a name like waveform display or confidence display as I think it might once have been called?

 

Edited January 7, 2019 by Keni

[Keni]

Btw... i believe I use sound on sound which seems "normal" to me.

[msmcleod]

I've not really used overwrite mode much, I mostly use sound-on-sound or comping.

As keyboard is my main instrument, for keyboard parts more often than not I'll just CTRL+Z and re-record if I'm not happy with it.

For guitar, I'll use sound-on-sound in the way I've described in earlier posts. I'll keep on playing takes and pick the best one. If I don't get a good take after around 30 odd takes, I'll give up and start comping manually.

Drums is my weakest instrument, so I'm more likely to use comping.

I've occasionally experienced the waveform not displaying. I've not worked out what causes this yet - it might be the zoom level combined with the scroll lock setting perhaps?

Maybe some-one else can enlighten us...

Personally I don't pay much attention to the display, as I'm concentrating more on playing. I just keep playing in a loop until I think I've got a good take.