2020.08 Feedback

[Tony H]

(Re: IK plugins)

Thanks guys I will look into this at some stage.

[TH]

1. After update, Cakewalk fails to fully launch.  Worked fine prior to update.   
   Instead, it starts to launch, displays the usual app screen, checks for plugins, identifies the usual, then the app closes completely. 
   It doesn't appear in task manager.
   Until I resolve this,  I'm totally dead in the water... So, any ideas are greatly appreciated. 

2. When I attempt to launch from BandLab assistant, the same thing happens - but the initial app screen freezes and a Windows error notification is displayed: 
   Access error. Bandlab Assistant can not open C:\program files\cakewalk\cakewalk core\cakewalk.exe,  Try to run app as an administrator

3. If I attempt to launch Cakewalk from app folder above in 2 as Administrator the same thing happens listed in 1 above. I am the admin for the laptop

4. I refreshed activation - no change
    
5. I changed name of folders for 3rd party Plugins to remove paths from cakewalk configuration - no change 
    
6. Rebooted after each change listed  above  before each attempt to re-launch - resulting no change
    
7. I completely uninstalled Cakewalk  (through the BandLab assistant), then BandLab Assistant and and related programs through Windows Apps, then rebooted, and reinstalled Bandlab Assistant, Cakewalk, and other programs, rebooted again, no change. Exact same outcomes

Win 10 Home 2004 19041.388
Dell XPS 15 9570 - on TB16 Dock
Intel Core i7-8750 CPU 2.20GHz
Ram 32 GB
Presonus AudioBox USB 96
Launchkey 49 MK2
Voicemeeter Banana

 

Edited August 11, 2020 by TH

[Xoo]

I'd run a chkdsk ? /f to check for disk errors.  Also worth trying as a different user in case the profile is corrupt.1

[Xoo]

That smiley  was meant to be c colon!

[TH]

18 minutes ago, Kevin Perry said:

That smiley  was meant to be c colon!

? much friendlier than colon.  Thanks for the suggestion.  No errors with Chkdsk.  Now trying a clean installation of  everything which includes some some reg edits that I now realize I didn't do per this link  https://help.cakewalk.com/hc/en-us/articles/360034066393-Clean-Install-Cakewalk-by-BandLab

[Olaf]

9 hours ago, TH said:

1. After update, Cakewalk fails to fully launch.  Worked fine prior to update.   
   Instead, it starts to launch, displays the usual app screen, checks for plugins, identifies the usual, then the app closes completely. 
   It doesn't appear in task manager.
   Until I resolve this,  I'm totally dead in the water... So, any ideas are greatly appreciated. 

2. When I attempt to launch from BandLab assistant, the same thing happens - but the initial app screen freezes and a Windows error notification is displayed: 
   Access error. Bandlab Assistant can not open C:\program files\cakewalk\cakewalk core\cakewalk.exe,  Try to run app as an administrator

3. If I attempt to launch Cakewalk from app folder above in 2 as Administrator the same thing happens listed in 1 above. I am the admin for the laptop

4. I refreshed activation - no change
    
5. I changed name of folders for 3rd party Plugins to remove paths from cakewalk configuration - no change 
    
6. Rebooted after each change listed  above  before each attempt to re-launch - resulting no change
    
7. I completely uninstalled Cakewalk  (through the BandLab assistant), then BandLab Assistant and and related programs through Windows Apps, then rebooted, and reinstalled Bandlab Assistant, Cakewalk, and other programs, rebooted again, no change. Exact same outcomes

Win 10 Home 2004 19041.388
Dell XPS 15 9570 - on TB16 Dock
Intel Core i7-8750 CPU 2.20GHz
Ram 32 GB
Presonus AudioBox USB 96
Launchkey 49 MK2
Voicemeeter Banana

 

TH, I think a lot of problems in Cakewalk come from a faulty way it writes, updates and deletes Windows registry records. I've had problems where it all of a sudden - without me doing anything identifiable - stopped recognizing plugins that were properly installed - or if you changed some of the plugin properties, on the next open, all those plugins appeared as removed and added, without doing anything to the actual .dll or .vst3 files.

When I had the plugin recognition problem, what I did was manually delete all the registry keys related to those plugins, then reinstalled, and it solved the problem.

I think you could try opening up the registry, and looking for all Cakewalk related records, under all categories, and deleting them. You can uninstall Cakewalk before you do that, for a clean reinstall - I don't think it's mandatory, but at this point it doesn't hurt to completely remove all the potential for failure.

After you've manually cleaned the registry, restart, and use an automatic registry cleaner CCleaner, Jet Cleaner to fix any bad references remaining.

Than reinstall Cakewalk.

See if that fixes your problem.

 

Edited August 12, 2020 by Olaf

[Noel Borthwick]

Um no there is nothing "faulty" about how Cakewalk updates the registry. You make a lot of assumptions that every problem is somehow the DAW's fault. There are plenty of environmental factors including Windows updates that can cause symptoms like this. 

[Olaf]

30 minutes ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Um no there is nothing "faulty" about how Cakewalk updates the registry. You make a lot of assumptions that every problem is somehow the DAW's fault. There are plenty of environmental factors including Windows updates that can cause symptoms like this. 

With all due respect, Noel, this is more of a logical conclusion, that an assumption.

As an exercise, what would your own objective and uninvolved conclusion be about a hypothetical third party DAW, that you have no connection with, in the following scenarios:

Plugins stop being seen all of a sudden, seemingly spontaneously, without you doing anything to them, and they are still seen in other environments, the only change happened in that DAW environment.

Or you change properties on other plugins, in the DAW, and the next time you open they get removed and readded as if the individual plugins were no longer the same, or the old references were no longer valid.

Or when you change, in the course of time, hardware components, drivers, and the version of Windows, but certain behaviors remain the same.

Or you install an update, do nothing else, and certain things stop working, or start behaving differently.

But when you add them all together?

Plus other behaviors mentioned in the course of time.

Edited August 12, 2020 by Olaf

[Jonathan Sasor]

51 minutes ago, Olaf said:

With all due respect, Noel, this is more of a logical conclusion, that an assumption.

As an exercise, what would your own objective and uninvolved conclusion be about a hypothetical third party DAW, that you have no connection with, in the following scenarios:

Plugins stop being seen all of a sudden, seemingly spontaneously, without you doing anything to them, and they are still seen in other environments, the only change happened in that DAW environment.

Or you change properties on other plugins, in the DAW, and the next time you open they get removed and readded as if the individual plugins were no longer the same, or the old references were no longer valid.

Or when you change, in the course of time, hardware components, drivers, and the version of Windows, but certain behaviors remain the same.

Or you install an update, do nothing else, and certain things stop working, or start behaving differently.

But when you add them all together?

Plus other behaviors mentioned in the course of time.

It might be a logical conclusion if you're looking from only one perspective. I'm looking at Cakewalk every day across a few different machines both physical and virtual, and there is definitely no global issue with how the app or the installer writes things to the registry. If there were, I think this thread would be a lot more busy. You'd be amazed at weird behaviors that are manifestations of odd system behaviors/components. Hard drives fail. RAM goes bad. Drivers stop working. The CbB (or any DAW) is reliant on the platform on which its run. If something behind the scenes isn't right, it's going to impact the app.

If there were a fundamental issue with how Cakewalk was handling something, you'd see a lot more than the handful of people who have said they're having an issue with any given update. When we identify issues in the app, we fix them as soon as we can. If there's a system-specific problem, it's literally out of our hands.

[TH]

Thanks to both of you for the input!  

Fortunately a Cakewalk clean install did the trick (per  https://help.cakewalk.com/hc/en-us/articles/360034066393-Clean-Install-Cakewalk-by-BandLab  )

For good measures, I also removed other related folders and uninstalled BandLab assistant before starting from scratch. 

I went the clean install route since the day before, I had just updated Windows to 2004 as well as a the Dell Bios, and a bunch of dell apps and drivers and then updated cakewalk - which in retrospect it may have made more sense  to updated my OS and laptop drivers first  - THEN updated cakewalk. Then again, my Cakewalk may have gotten jacked up with all these SW changes happening in a short time frame and me not paying attention.  I had a bunch of other hiccups when I updated Windows 10 to the 2004 build  

Now Cakewalk is brand-spanking new - although I had to reconfigure a bunch of old settings.  Fortunately I didn't customize my setup that much.

Overall, Cakewalk is an amazingly stable and powerful app and I'm amazed at how much time, money and expert development goes into this venture. I hope the business model is sustainable and they don't suddenly switch from a freemium model to a subscription   

Thanks again to all who weighed in! 

[mkerl]

2 minutes ago, TH said:

I hope the business model is sustainable and they don't suddenly switch from a freemium model to a subscription   

 

I wouldn't hesitate to pay for it. The app is better than ever before. But I would like to upgrade my z3ta+ . . . . . . ?

[Will.]

On 8/11/2020 at 6:51 PM, TH said:

1. After update, Cakewalk fails to fully launch.  Worked fine prior to update.   
   Instead, it starts to launch, displays the usual app screen, checks for plugins, identifies the usual, then the app closes completely. 
   It doesn't appear in task manager.
   Until I resolve this,  I'm totally dead in the water... So, any ideas are greatly appreciated. 

2. When I attempt to launch from BandLab assistant, the same thing happens - but the initial app screen freezes and a Windows error notification is displayed: 
   Access error. Bandlab Assistant can not open C:\program files\cakewalk\cakewalk core\cakewalk.exe,  Try to run app as an administrator

3. If I attempt to launch Cakewalk from app folder above in 2 as Administrator the same thing happens listed in 1 above. I am the admin for the laptop

4. I refreshed activation - no change
    
5. I changed name of folders for 3rd party Plugins to remove paths from cakewalk configuration - no change 
    
6. Rebooted after each change listed  above  before each attempt to re-launch - resulting no change
    
7. I completely uninstalled Cakewalk  (through the BandLab assistant), then BandLab Assistant and and related programs through Windows Apps, then rebooted, and reinstalled Bandlab Assistant, Cakewalk, and other programs, rebooted again, no change. Exact same outcomes

Win 10 Home 2004 19041.388
Dell XPS 15 9570 - on TB16 Dock
Intel Core i7-8750 CPU 2.20GHz
Ram 32 GB
Presonus AudioBox USB 96
Launchkey 49 MK2
Voicemeeter Banana

 

Just update all your windows Netframe - especially the "3.5" version. 

2: Disable your anti-virus and see if the problem remains. 

3: Try moving all your plugins folders out from Cakewalk. There could be an old VST causing your problem - especially those that was compatible with "platinium" such as "Concrete Limiter, L-phase plugs, some of those old 32bit channel CA-2A compressor? I promise you now it's not Cakewalk. 

[Olaf]

22 hours ago, Jonathan Sasor said:

It might be a logical conclusion if you're looking from only one perspective. I'm looking at Cakewalk every day across a few different machines both physical and virtual, and there is definitely no global issue with how the app or the installer writes things to the registry. If there were, I think this thread would be a lot more busy. You'd be amazed at weird behaviors that are manifestations of odd system behaviors/components. Hard drives fail. RAM goes bad. Drivers stop working. The CbB (or any DAW) is reliant on the platform on which its run. If something behind the scenes isn't right, it's going to impact the app.

If there were a fundamental issue with how Cakewalk was handling something, you'd see a lot more than the handful of people who have said they're having an issue with any given update. When we identify issues in the app, we fix them as soon as we can. If there's a system-specific problem, it's literally out of our hands.

It's true all these things fail, but all are reported to work fine - and do work fine. Besides, it's a classic case of all variables changing, with one remaining constant. That's the one you should look into.

As for the handful of people, I counted 7 reports of issues on just the first page of this thread. Remember the number on the 07 Early Access. Plus all the numerous other threads. And you could also check the FB groups - I'm on two, and there are several people reporting problems each day. I don't think it's just a handful. And it's not coming up with problems out of boredom.

Edited August 12, 2020 by Olaf

[Olaf]

21 hours ago, TH said:

Thanks to both of you for the input!  

Fortunately a Cakewalk clean install did the trick (per  https://help.cakewalk.com/hc/en-us/articles/360034066393-Clean-Install-Cakewalk-by-BandLab  )

For good measures, I also removed other related folders and uninstalled BandLab assistant before starting from scratch. 

I went the clean install route since the day before, I had just updated Windows to 2004 as well as a the Dell Bios, and a bunch of dell apps and drivers and then updated cakewalk - which in retrospect it may have made more sense  to updated my OS and laptop drivers first  - THEN updated cakewalk. Then again, my Cakewalk may have gotten jacked up with all these SW changes happening in a short time frame and me not paying attention.  I had a bunch of other hiccups when I updated Windows 10 to the 2004 build  

Now Cakewalk is brand-spanking new - although I had to reconfigure a bunch of old settings.  Fortunately I didn't customize my setup that much.

Overall, Cakewalk is an amazingly stable and powerful app and I'm amazed at how much time, money and expert development goes into this venture. I hope the business model is sustainable and they don't suddenly switch from a freemium model to a subscription   

Thanks again to all who weighed in! 

I think at some point CW will not be free anymore, because all this development work costs money, and nobody pays indefinitely without a goal in sight, just so random people around the world can have fun. That's why I think "not rocking the boat" in hopes that it will stay the same (even with some problems, but free) doesn't serve anyone. Not us, and not the developers. Cause it can't be free forever. So I think "rocking the boat" constructively, in good faith and with good intentions is actually a good thing to do, for everybody - especially with a view to a return on the paid market - where all the free user niceness and casual praising are instantly gonna go away.

For one, I'd gladly pay for it, I don't mind, if it's an affordable figure - and I think it richly deserves to be paid for - provided the crashes and unexpected behaviors are taken care of. But I don't like subscriptions either, I'd much rather buy each update and own it.

Glad you solved the problem. From my experience deleting the registers manually helps in many cases.

Edited August 12, 2020 by Olaf

[Bill Campbell]

With this version I can no longer open my older Sonar Platinum projects.   Can I back down to the previous version?

[Jonathan Sasor]

34 minutes ago, Bill Campbell said:

With this version I can no longer open my older Sonar Platinum projects.   Can I back down to the previous version?

There is a rollback installer listed with the product info page on this forum, but there shouldn't be any issues with opening previous projects. What exactly are you seeing? Do new projects create successfully? 

[Bill Campbell]

Hi, Thanks for the response.     In retrospect the problem may be isolated to a particular project.   But I'm thinking that failure cascaded to subsequent attempts to load other projects and it appeared to me to be related to all 'Sonar' projects. The project still get to the "Loading UI" and stops.  But now other projects seem to be working fine.

 

Good thing too... I really liked the changes to the new Arranger feature and I was bummed about having to give that up!

Edited August 13, 2020 by Bill Campbell
spelling

[Noel Borthwick]

@Bill Campbell please PM a link to the project file and we can see if we can reproduce the problem.

[oldie]

Hi,

First a thank you for keeping this product going, I've been a Sonar user since 1.0 and it's great that you've rescued it and keep developing it.

I'm trying to upgrade to 2020.08 and like a few others I am getting a hang at the 'Installing' stage. I left it for an hour and when I couldn't see any activity in Task Manager I rebooted and tried again, same result.

I've read the posts above and tried looking in the Bandlab download folder to make sure I have the right file, and I think I do (Cakewalk_by_BandLab_Update_Setup_26.08.0.100.r1.exe).

I checked I have the latest version of the assistant, and as far as I can see I do (there is no option to update on the Apps tab).

I'm on W10 Home 1909, build 18363.1016 and Cakewalk 2020.05.

In the past I have never managed to get the Assistant to upgrade itself, I always have to uninstall and download the latest, but Cakewalk has always updated fine before this.

I would rather not have to reinstall Cakewalk from scratch to get this update, anyone have any ideas?

[oldie]

I just had a thought - I ran the update .exe manually as Administrator.  Bingo! Updated no problem in about 2 minutes. Weird because I thought I had admin rights but maybe something got changed when I upgraded to W10 from 7 earlier this year.

Maybe all these other people have been having a similar issue?

{edit} Just checked I do have admin rights so not sure what is going on here??

Edited August 14, 2020 by oldie