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John Maar

Instrument definition file questions

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First off...Happy Holidays! And wishes for a happy and healthy 2020!

I could use some help with a couple of SONAR/CbB drum map questions. Any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks in advance!

========================================

ANSWERED 1) Can a comment start AFTER a patch entry?

ANSWERED 2) Can there be two patches with exactly the same name (I would assume the answer to that one is yes)

ANSWERED 3) Do patch numbers have to be in monotonically increasing order?

ANSWERED 4) In the .Instrument Definitions section, it seems that the term “Patch” actually mean “Bank”? Why is it called “Patch”?

ANSWERED 5) What do the following kinds of entries mean?

      Key[0,48]=K2000R Studio Kit 1
      Drum[0,48]=1
      Key[0,49]=K2000R Studio Kit 2 MW
      Drum[0,49]=1
      Key[0,50]=K2000R 2 Live Kits MW
      Drum[0,50]=1
      Key[0,51]=K2000R Rock Kit
      Drum[0,51]=1

NB: I’m guessing that the second value inside each of those square brackets is a note number but what does the zero mean, what does Key vs. Drum mean? What does assigning 1 to those Drum entries mean?

STILL A QUESTION 6) How does one define on which MIDI channel to send out a bank select and program change message?

========================================

That's it? Yup. That's enough, right?

TIA again!

 

Edited by John Maar

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Thanks. Fixed the title. We have questions 1-5 figured out. The remaining unanswered question is:

6) How does one define on which MIDI channel to send out a bank select and program change message?

TIA

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14 hours ago, John Maar said:

6) How does one define on which MIDI channel to send out a bank select and program change message?

Sometimes the little letters [I, O, C, B, P] on the track controls/widgets for the initial bank and preset can be hard to read. 

image.png.1e5335f5c55a1bac71962d69950719e2.png

Not sure if you were asking where to set up the per channel instrument assignments:

image.png.ccf52ede409177adb346e809574d0b02.png

You can also insert/edit Bank/Patch changes in the Event List:

image.png.df68c0776b8829d0b33494f337aeb916.png

 

Edited by User 905133
to get rid of duplicate images

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Thanks User 905133.

FYI, the person I'm asking for is one of the devs of Gig Performer. He's a touring musician (keyboards) and a former employee at IBM Research Labs. I'm not sure how he's using the Instrument Definition files (he uses a Mac laptop when performing), but for sure, it's not with CbB. Here's some additional detail around his Q6.

==========

I saw the answer to that question about MIDI channel in the forum but that’s just how to select it from a dialog. The question is where is that information defined in the Instrument Definition File?

In particular, if you’re auditioning individual patches on a single channel of a multi-timbral synth then presumably you select the channel to which you want those messages sent.

However, if you’re in multi-patch mode or “combi” (as Korg calls it, for example), then program changes are expected to be sent on a channel defined by the synth itself. I’m wondering whether THAT channel number is defined in an instrument definition file.

Or is it the case that instrument definition files can’t handle multitimbral synths?

==========

As ever, muchas gracias!

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The clarification makes sense.

1 hour ago, John Maar said:

I saw the answer to that question about MIDI channel in the forum but that’s just how to select it from a dialog. The question is where is that information defined in the Instrument Definition File?

In particular, if you’re auditioning individual patches on a single channel of a multi-timbral synth then presumably you select the channel to which you want those messages sent.

In a nutshell, the channel is not defined in the Instrument Definition.

The Instrument definition is selected for use within Cakewalk.  As the screen shot from Preferences shows, the 16 midi channels for each port/device can be assigned a previously designed Instrument Definition. 

I think of it as a linear process: (1) Define Instrument, (2) Assign Instrument Definition to a Port/Device + channel(s), (3) Assign a Track Output to a Port/Device, (4) Assign a Track to either a specific midi channel or to None [if using the channel from the midi data itself, such as the case with a multi-channel track], (5) Assign an initial Bank/Patch if using a forced midi channel approach, or None if track has up to 16 channels of midi data.

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Auditioning individual patches on a single channel . . . . It depends on workflow, how the user has the track/project configured, and where in the tune/performance process the audition is being done.  For example, this past year when I was getting back into Cakewalk and setting up an assortment of multitimbral synths--each with up to 32 midi channels, I created a template.  The idea was to have all modules in folders with all midi channels available per midi port as a starting point.

---------------------------

Forced-channel Template Method

image.png.d8ed4dc9c6378571c3666ffb852a2142.png  image.png.d53fd293776b8c2c02b8b87d9b0368e0.png  image.png.6a9275a6b10b7255ec177fe28cbbd07c.png  image.png.81cfbcc919d35dae0799168385705f1d.png  image.png.0fd20f83ec0231e55b1da0596f2ef9ac.png

With the forced channel template, I can use the track control/widgets to make selections from the track itself.  That way the initial bank + preset/patch can be saved on each track within a project.

image.png.033bcaba5c631996676d0d3232b5f2b0.png

Note: During the setup phase, I can use my keyboard to audition sounds (1) by changing the channel it is sending on and (2) by using preset change buttons. Also, I can play notes and record patch changes as well. If I want to then make one of those banks/patches and initial track setting, I can then edit the track controls/widgets.  Or, I can set the Bank and/or Patch settings to none, and then moved the desired Bank/Patch Program Change to tick zero (or wherever I want it).

image.png.1e9b78b20ab788c9cd3a32a07cf4039c.png

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Multi-channel Track Method and other methods [to be added, if needed].

 

 

Edited by User 905133
(2) to add more info anout the Template/Forced Channel Method(1) to add images for Track Template Forced Channel Method

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1 minute ago, John Maar said:

Many thanks! I'll pass this on.

There's more, depending on the user's workflow, setup, etc.  Only 1/2 way done!  I will leave this as is for the time being (except for the "to be completed" comment).  Maybe its enough to help.  If not, I set up my P2500 to verify accuracy of the methods, so can add the other 1/2 if requested.

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You're being most helpful. Thanks so much!

EDIT: That may be enough info. I'll post again if that changes. Vielen Dank!

Edited by John Maar

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