Tezza

Thanks David, this is what I was hoping, that someone with more technical musical knowledge than me might be able to identify the timing that I am using or at least give me some direction here. I am making the long journey into town today (I am in a rural area) so I'll pick up some new strings for the acoustic and also pick up the Indiginus Renegade Guitar, then I'll record a verse and chorus for you of the actual song on the acoustic and PM it to you, see if you can make any sense out of it. If I am able to duplicate it with Renegade, I'll send that as well. Nice work on Red Mountain, it's hard to believe that is a synth patch?

Nice work, you've got some convincing finger picking going on and a soft, warm voice with great harmonies, the overall mix of all of your productions sounds very professional.

Thanks man, really appreciate it, the strumming sound is about on par with my Kontakt Factory Akkord program and as you say does not sound that convincing, a long way away from the Indiginus demo's I've heard. I would say, strumming engine fail. In addition, the actual sound does not have that shimmering quality to it.

Do you have specifically the Acoustic Guitar 2.0?

Would this be of the Acoustic Guitar 2.0 ?

If your asking me, I play the song on acoustic guitar and record it, then I play it back and manually and enter the relevant notes and information on a midi track linked to a VST guitar to match it. Midi guitar out of the right speaker and original recorded guitar out the left. There is probably a better way that half works, I don't know. I am learning a lot about the weird timing I use when I play the acoustic solo with vocals. No matter what I do, it doesn't make sense on the grid and it is the same with all my songs played with that Jazz style. I remember trying this some time ago and just gave up. I do use the Acoustic to produce songs but that is for different songs in a different style that is more grid friendly and the acoustic never ends up on the final song, it's just a scratch track but I can get the beat, the bass, keyboard and electric guitars all from that scratch track. These songs that I am trying to get done, are like jazz but it's doing my head in trying to work out the timing. Metronomes are complete distracting rubbish on this stuff. I am using a single finger click on an offbeat and that gives me the feel. Also, trying to add any sort of arrangement to them is impossible, the minute I do that, I have to start changing the guitar parts which I don't want to do. I think these particular songs will work best with just acoustic guitar, a simple shaker and vocals, that's it. There is no problem with the vocals and the acoustic working together, it is as smooth as butter. I don't understand how it can sound so in time and smooth when I play live but when I try to move it to a midi grid, it all goes to hell.

Yes, my jazz vocal idol Vince Jones does this with old jazz standards, he also changes the words a little but keeps and enhances the authenticity of the era, he has a quartet of brilliant musicians with him. Frank Sinatra did the same thing. Michael Buble also does it. Some of the paid midi files I have bought of old jazz songs are programmed really well, just need a bit of editing here and there or add drop midi tracks as desired. I just realized that this thread is about motivation slump but I am too motivated to help there at the moment. At the end of the day, if it's that bad, through some sheets on the keyboards and guitars, walk out of the studio, close the door and put a date on the door 2 weeks away, don't go back in until then. Now what are you going to do?

Thanks for the reply's guy's, this has helped me out a lot. At the moment the Indiginus Renegade Acoustic is at the top of my list. They are also offering good support as I contacted them and they respond quickly whereas a couple of others I contacted haven't bothered to get back to me. I think the strumming engine in this is good as well because it's not a pattern player based on chord samples but rather plays midi files for it's patterns, in other words it's playing the individual samples from midi files. It sounds very authentic which leads me to believe that my midi based strum patterns will also sound good. It's also easy to set up your own patterns with your own chords which you can change via the fretboard, so any voicing you can conceive can be played and also incorporated into the pattern player. There are ten slots so basically, you can take your song with whatever chord voicings you want and program those into the slots and then use either the pattern player or trigger your own up/down strums etc through midi. You can also program your own patterns into the pattern player if you want. All this means I should be able to program my acoustic guitar rhythm tracks exactly the same as my real acoustic strummed tracks (which can be odd timings, voicings etc). Finger picking sounds are excellent and I like the way articulations are implemented everything is there and if you want to be lazy you can set up the articulations based on velocity value or key switches from midi. The faux 12 string mode is also good. The option of power chords is also really good, these focus on the bottom 3 strings to add emphasis.. GUI looks fairly simple and logical. To me it sounds fine, better than my recordings of acoustic but without the fret buzz, string imbalance and ring, dodgy timing and the dog barking in the background.. I think it's an excellent strummer and also finger picker as well. So unless something amazing happens between now and tomorrow this is it I think.

Song sounds nice, can't tell what is programmed and what is not.

I've got a bunch of midi covers that I have if I start losing motivation on original work. Old Jazz songs from 40's to 60's, some I am doing as backing tracks for others. I find I'm learning more from editing the pre-arranged midi covers. The whole song comes finished minus the vocals and it's all in midi of course, just midi files, some bought, some free. All you have to do is edit the midi to your contentment and assign instruments/effects and mix etc. So these songs are always "finished". Enjoying it so much, I am going to put vocals on one of them just for fun. I love the old Jazz standards, even though I was not born in that era. I may even threaten to post it in the songs section.

Thanks, yes I like the renegade guitar, the GUI and the sound, the download size, the price is right as well ($100.00 AU). It's sitting at number one at the moment for my choice of Acoustic Guitar VST in the other thread. Have just sent them an email to find out the install/authorization procedure as this will determine if I can install it or not. I will decide which to buy on Tuesday. The Orange Tree samples are out of my price range unfortunately, $265.00 AU amongst other things I have to buy.

In my search for an acoustic guitar VST, I came across this company but cannot find out much about there instruments, especially the acoustic guitar. Their version 2 of this which they currently sell seems to go back to 2009. I don't hear much of a mention of them around the place. Does anyone use these products? Are they any good? They also have an XMAS sale bundle on at the moment which seems to be still running. https://www.pettinhouse.com/

I heard the demo of that, not really what I am looking for, moves too far away from a traditional sound that I am seeking.

I have a theory on what is going on here. Remember, the media killed harry's mother, princess Diana. The paparazzi hounded her and were pursuing and machine gun flashing the car when it crashed. Now the media are hounding his wife.....he knows what happens next if he doesn't do something. I like the royals and am a bit of a Monarchist, I was born in England, lived there until 10 and then came to Australia but the Commonwealth is also strong here.

I've bounced this over from the "Acoustic Guitar VST required" thread because Bill Phillips made a general post about it and I discovered upon investigation that they are currently having a 50% off sale on this. It's an acoustic and electric guitar modeller, very small download (78mb). I don't own it and have not used it extensively, just listened to the demos. Some others who have experience with it might be able to chime in. I don't know that it satisfies my specific need for a traditional acoustic finger picking guitar sound but it does sound really good at what it does and has lots of possibilities for new and high quality sounds. https://www.applied-acoustics.com/strum-gs-2/

Thanks, had a look at this, small download (78mb). Acoustic modelling. I think it fails a little as a dedicated traditional acoustic guitar from what I've heard but it has many possibilities for both electric and acoustic and the sound quality, although different, is excellent. This would be a great way to incorporate unusual guitar sounds into a modern production. They also have a sale on at the moment, 50% off, so I've bounced it over to the deals section. I am enticed to get it because although it won't fill the gap for a traditional acoustic for me, the high quality sounds and plentiful variations it has could really have an application in music.

Thanks, didn't know about this, they also have a finger picking pattern player for $79.00 US but they don't show it's features as a sample player which is what I'm primarily looking for. I've dropped them an email to clarify this. That Acoustic Lite sounds really good for $24.95!

I have a background in film making and ran a production house for a while, also a short film group that also made some independent features. The discussion of "the Producer" was always being discussed. Basically, it worked like this, those films that had a Producer attached got finished, those that did not have a Producer attached struggled or failed. In film, the relationship between the Director and Producer is what drives everything. I would think of composition and production representing the Director and the Producer. The composer is the Director, assembling and creating everything and that's where it ends for most people doing music. They then struggle to finish and market their productions and in reality, it's too much work to do both jobs and most people just can't change hats like that. They are different personalities. We came to the conclusion that unless there was both a Director and Producer attached to a film, no-one else was interested in participating, no crew, no actors etc. These days, most DAW oriented musicians are trying to do both jobs and that will never work as well as having a dedicated Producer overseeing your work. If you are serious about your music, you need a dedicated Producer involved, someone who is not you. The Producer's primary roles are to see that everything runs on time, on budget and that the work is finished, polished and marketed.

I've got Komplete ultimate 10 and attempted to upgrade to 12 using the hard drive option but it didn't work for me because it still needed a huge download (whats the point of offering the hard drive option?). Native Access has destroyed any hope of me using NI products again unfortunately otherwise, this problem would have been done and dusted long ago. I need to be able to go into town and use their blistering speed internet connection to download the product in full and then transfer it to my offline DAW as I don't have a good internet connection where I live, I can't do this with Native Non-Access as you have to download it to your DAW directly. I'm also after a specific type of finger picking sound.

Yes, I have seen the orange tree samples, they are pretty full sounding, they are $179.00 US about $260.00 AUD. I find the interface a little overwhelming, sample size is 11.5gb.

Hadn't seen this, very interesting, the controls are phenomenal, the way they implement the articulations and keyswitches etc are excellent, more options for control over sound than I've seen anywhere else, 12 string, power chords etc good strumming engine as well. Sound quality is really good as well. Price is excellent. On the short list. Requires full version of Kontakt but that's ok I have that. Possibly a little brighter than I was seeking but the sound quality between all of these paid products seems to be more around personal preference than sampling quality, they all sound really good to me.

Thanks Mark, yes they sound good but a bit on the expensive side for me, $169.00 US, $245.00AUS, the free one also has some other limitations:

Lately, I've been transcribing my acoustic guitar bits to midi and playing them back through jazz guitar in kontakt with guitar rig. The sound is ok but of course electric. This is not so bad since my acoustic guitar style is mainly grabbed chords and finger picking jazz style, with the occasional strummed chord. I don't have an acoustic guitar in my collection. So far, the best I've found for the style I play and in terms of price is: https://www.ilyaefimov.com/products/acoustic-guitars/acoustic-guitar.html The price is 99 Euro, which equates to about $160.00 aus. I was wondering if anyone else has any ideas about what might be a good option. I don't want a strumming guitar sound or thin sounding picking and would like to keep the price down if possible. If anyone has any other ideas or can point me in the right direction it would be most appreciated. Also, if anyone has used illya efimov guitars and knows the install and has an opinion on them that would also be handy, I cannot find information about the install and authorization procedure.

The BM800 isn't rubbished on reviews and forums, should be able to get a decent sound. I think it's best to work with the gear that the OP has and give him advice on that, he is just starting out by the sounds of it. The simple way is to set up the right mic position that sounds good, record directly into the audio interface and not worry about EQ cuts, then after it's recorded use a low shelf to cut off the boom if/as necessary and then run a parametric with a narrow Q boost across the midrange to find the ugly frequency(s) and pull those down 3-6db. That should get him in the ballpark. This can be done with the pro EQ in Cakewalk. Then experiment with compression/reverb, start with the presets. Can also use some saturation to brighten it up a bit and give it some grit. https://www.audio-issues.com/music-mixing/acoustic-guitar-eq/ https://www.musicianonamission.com/approach-equalization-two-types-eq/

Most acoustic guitar problems relate to the room you are recording in. This is because when miking an acoustic guitar, the actual output sound is low and depends so much on room reflections. The enemy is primarily reverb rather than frequencies. If your in a very large room or one with lots of wood in it, this is not so much an issue. Most bedrooms are not like that, the wall is too close behind you so you need to deaden that sound coming off the wall behind you into the mic. Hanging a Duna behind you as you play can work wonders. The next thing is mic placement. This depends on what acoustic sound you are trying to achieve. If you just want background strumming to be part of a more complex mix, putting the mic about 6-12 inches from where the neck joins the body and aiming it at that joint will be a good starting point. If you want a fuller sound where the guitar may be the only instrument or one of a few and/or your playing a finger plucking type sound then try concentrating on the base side of the guitar, the body, between the soundhole and the bridge. You want to avoid micing directly at the sound hole as this will be too boomy. Sometimes, when people complain they are not recording the sound they hear, it is because the mic is not positioned where your ears are. I've found good results for a bigger, fuller more realistic sound by micing the guitar over your shoulder so it is over the top of the guitar facing down to a space about 1 inch off the soundhole (bridge side). This approximates what you are actually hearing as you play. You have to try different things depending on what sound you want. You should be able to get a reasonable sound, even with that microphone. If you have 2 mics, you can put a pencil on the neck side and the condenser on the bass side and record in stereo, just need to make sure the mics are the same distance from the guitar. For EQ on the way in, again that depends on the sound you want, if you just want strumming in a big mix, then you can knock off up to 100khz straight away but for fuller sound you might only want to knock off 40-80khz. A full waveform is good, then compress and eq in the track as necessary. You can then add reverb to taste. If you have some decent isolating headphones, you can move the mic around and hear in realtime the difference in sound. In a studio, another person will move the mic around to test. You probably don't have these. You can line up 20 tracks in Cakewalk and then record for 3 minutes on each one, each time moving the mic in a different position. Just say "this is with the mic 6 inches from the neck joint" etc give a verbal description of what you are doing which is recorded on the track. Then, when you've done 20 tracks moving the mic around. Sit back and listen. Chances are that you will find what you are looking for. Of course, better mics will get a better sound but you may find that even with your cheaper mic, a particular position might suit it fine.