midi and tts1

[fastdraw]

hi

Before, when I opened a midi file, I had the tracks assigned to the instruments with tts.
Now I only have the midi tracks, without knowing which instrument it is!

How to assign the default tts when opening a midi? To guide me towards the choice of instruments

[Wookiee]

@fastdraw not sure how long it is since you visited here or installed the latest version of Cakewalk Sonar sub or free, but TTS-1 is no longer included as part of the package. The TTS-1 program belonged to Roland who have withdrawn support for it and requested that Cakewalk no longer supply it.

[fastdraw]

Is there an equivalent ?

[Wookiee]

1 hour ago, fastdraw said:

Is there an equivalent ?

Not included in Cakewalk Sonar, there are however similar multitimbral plugins some free some not so free.

[Bristol_Jonesey]

2 hours ago, fastdraw said:

Is there an equivalent ?

If you had TTS-1 as part of a previous installation then you should still have access now.

So which previous version(s) did you have and what have you uninstalled?

[user905133]

In addition to what others have said, there is also hardware from decades ago that have the Roland sounds from which the TTS-1 sounds were inherited.

4 hours ago, fastdraw said:

Now I only have the midi tracks, without knowing which instrument it is!

If the midi tracks follow a standard sound bank assignment format (e.g., General MIDI) the tracks actually do know what instruments are supposed to be assigned because they should include standardized MIDI Program Change commands.

Quote

How to assign the default tts when opening a midi? To guide me towards the choice of instruments

So, if you want to try to re-orchestrate the file following the instruments used (but not necessarily the somewhat standardized sounds) you could do that with a numerical listing of the GM/GS instrument assignments. 

For example, the first few Program Change commands [aka patches / presets] are pianos with slightly different sound characteristics, but if you have hardware or software synths (or a sampler, or virtual instruments/sound libraries), you could choose any piano, Likewise with guitars, strings, brass, etc.  

 

Edited Friday at 03:26 PM by user905133
removed an errant word; added a word

[fastdraw]

2 hours ago, Wookiee said:

Not included in Cakewalk Sonar, there are however similar multitimbral plugins some free some not so free.

Which ones? I'm looking for the best (minimum 16 tracks)

 

[Wookiee]

1 hour ago, fastdraw said:

Which ones? I'm looking for the best (minimum 16 tracks)

 

I don't know, I don't use multitimbral plugins. If I want a multitimbral synth I use my JV1080. 

Perhaps you could try searching the Internet for them Roland hasone no idea what it is called.

[Promidi]

I concur with the hardware solution. 

I have used an SW1000XG card (in another PC) since 2002 and this has pretty much been immune to all this TT-S fiasco.....

[msmcleod]

You can always try the Yamaha S-YXG50 - it's 32 bit though, and JBridge is recommended when using it:   Yamaha S-YXG50 Portable VSTi v1.0.0

 

[Bass Guitar]

Sonar is possibly one of the only Daw’s that no longer supports GM playback. Funny thing is that Cakewalk Next does. Next has a way better system of handling midi files. 
Go figure. 
 

When you open a midi file in the new Sonar it will only populate the project with midi tracks but there is no GM instrument included anymore. 
 

I replace that with SynthFont  A fully supported GM player available for around $20.     Synth font.com
The just released a ton of updates 

This is what use to play download midi files

synthmaster.com   

 

But you can also replace some stuff like the bass   Drums and electric piano and strings with the SI instruments. 

It’s a total PITA however what is involved to actually do this in a tidy way when other Daw’s do this 

That’s why I often use the synth master player. 

 

Edited Saturday at 03:11 PM by Bass Guitar

[Wookiee]

2 hours ago, Bass Guitar said:

Sonar is possibly one of the only Daw’s that no longer supports GM playback. Funny thing is that Cakewalk Next does. Next has a way better system of handling midi files. 
Go figure. 

Are you sure about that broad statement "Sonar no longer supports GM (General MIDI) playback". Cakewalk Sonar is most definitely MIDI 1.n compliant. 

Don't you mean Sonar no longer provides a basic multitimbral instrument that complies with the GM instrument set?

Personally I have no problems playing back the basic GM sound sets without TTS-1. 

[Bass Guitar]

Most of the other Daw’s will open a midi file and ask you if you want to assign GM instruments. 
 

In 4 seconds you’ll be playing the file. 
If you desire to use the song you drag and drop better instruments and replace them. 
Example this is how Cakewalk Next will work. Fast, no need to understand why. 
 

Sonars first problem is that it creates only midi tracks , not instrument tracks. So it’s a lot of extra moves to insert instruments and now drag the midi data there or re assign outputs. 
Actually Cubase is the only other Daw I know of that also does that. 
A 16 track project can become 32 tracks. 
Messy and clunky. 

I even prefer Waveform which opens a midi file just like Sonar with no instruments but you can quickly drag them to the track because the track will become an instrument track automatically. Fast and tidy. But you do need some knowledge of what midi instruments to use. 
 

It’s pretty easy to get the TTS-1 back. All you need is a n older CbB download  of the full installer from before the Fall of 2023. That or any old version of Sonar going back like 20 years ago. The TTS-1 was never updated because it is DX. 
 

I think what seemed to happen was Roland totally forgot about it until Bandlab decided to now charge money. It wouldn’t have been included with the code  from Gibson. 
 

 

 

Edited Saturday at 03:34 PM by Bass Guitar

[David Baay]

1 hour ago, Bass Guitar said:

So it’s a lot of extra moves to insert instruments and now drag the midi data there or re assign outputs. 

I count 7 or 8 clicks/keystrokes, depending on how your synth insert settings are defaulted:

- Insert > Soft Synth (2 clicks)

- Select GM synth (1 click)

- OK (select First Synth Audio Ouput if not the default - 1 or 2 clicks)

- Swipe-select all MIDI tracks (1 click)

- Ctrl+click the Output widget and select the synth (1 click and 1 keystroke)

If you create a project template with the synth and tracks already in place, you can just drop the .MID file in the first track and you're done.

[Bass Guitar]

Ya very clunky. And you need to be an experienced user before you can get that far. 

Try Cakewalk Next and then you will see how it should work. Very user friendly for newcomers. 

[Bass Guitar]

31 minutes ago, David Baay said:

create a project template with the synth and tracks already in place, you can just drop the .MID file in the first track and you're done.

Then you have lost a lot of the data from the file. Like tempo and so on. It is important to OPEN a download midi file for it to play correctly. 
 

As I tested around 17 Daw’s back over a year ago that was one of my first tests. Will this Daw open and play a GM file. The majority do. Each had its quirks. But many do this with one click. Some you drag and drop but they ask you about GM as well as the other data. Smart! 

[Jan van Schalkwyk]

I use a hardware synth and it is the default device:
Only 2 steps
1) Open midi file
2) Click play

Nothing is lost

[David Baay]

7 hours ago, Bass Guitar said:

Then you have lost a lot of the data from the file. Like tempo and so on.

Sort of a valid point though the vast majority of pop MIDI files will be 4/4 and have a fixed tempo, and that's pretty much the only thing that doesn't come in when importing - not a "lot" of data. If it's important to get the tempo map  and time signature's, use the manual process. In the grand scheme of how long it takes to complete a project, those few setup steps are completely inconsequential and they are all basic operations that every user needs to get comfortable with. 

[fastdraw]

Thank you for your replies.
I will definitely use the two-pass version.
1st: Open the MIDI files with Synth Font to see which instruments are assigned to the tracks.
2nd: Assign the instruments to the Cakewalk tracks.

I mainly use ZenoLogy, but it's not multitimbral.

A previous post mentioned that we can manually create a GM file with the sounds of the VSTi of our choice, and I hope to load it by default when Cakewalk opens.

As an alternative to a VSTi, can we automatically load a soundfont when Cakewalk opens?

I would find it surprising that a midi player (synthfont) allows something that a daw does not have?

 

Help!
I'm drowning in versions:🤕
Cakewalk Next, Sonar Platinum, Sonar Next, Sonar Brandlab...
What are all these names?
Which is the best?

Edited Monday at 12:46 PM by fastdraw

[Bass Guitar]

The brief history of Cakewalk 

Pro audio and Cakewalk etc were owned by the original developers way back 80’s and 90’s. 12 Tone Systems. That’s why the DX synth was called TTS-1. 
Roland bought it and in those days it was Sonar. Example Sonar 1 to Sonar 8.
Gibsonn bought it around that time and we had Sonar X1 thru X3 lastly Sonar Platinum. Gibson went broke and discontinued the development and support for Sonar. 
 

Bandlab bought just the software not the company, and  renamed it Cakewalk or often called CbB for Cakewalk by Bandlab. It was free but that ended last month. 

Two years ago they announced the upcoming release of 2 new products Cakewalk Sonar and Cakewalk Next. This is where we are. 

They returned to calling it Sonar. Yes that’s a bit confusing when you search Google for that title. 
 

Sonar is based on the Cakewalk legacy but Next is a totally new design that is also cross platform. Sonar has always been PC only and will remain as such. 
Sonar is a very powerful and complex Daw with a very steep learning curve. 
Cakewalk Next is at this point in development very simple so very easy to learn and use. 
 

They are by subscription only which includes both. 
There are free version also available.