Plugins start minmized

[Mark Morgon-Shaw]

5 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

can you post a screenshot of your monitor layout from  display properties? I wonder if its somehow related to a 3 monitor config.

5 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Is one monitor lower than the other two?

No , one is higher than the other 2

5 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

The window is always sized correctly, just below the screen right?

Yes, just the menu bar visible - always on monitor 1

Edited Sunday at 08:34 AM by Mark Morgon-Shaw

[Wayne Riggall]

I have had the same issues mentioned here and it has continued over the last 2 days.

Some observations:

• In a track that I have recorded into, if I open a Plugin UI and then close it, I cannot open it again.
• I cannot locate any minimized windows at the bottom for any UI's that I may have minimized.
• If I add a Plugin to a track that I haven't yet recorded into, I can open the UI. If I close it and then try to open it again, it either very briefly appears then disappears, or it returns (no discernable pattern).
• If I delete the Plugin in a track I am working on and then add it in afresh, the UI opens but all settings are lost. (I am taking screen shots of each plugin setup for my recording notes document as a crude backup).
• When creating a new project, I am able to open Plugin UI's, close them and then open them again.
• This behavior only started occurring for me 2 days ago.

[Noel Borthwick]

1 hour ago, Wayne Riggall said:

I have had the same issues mentioned here and it has continued over the last 2 days.

Some observations:

• In a track that I have recorded into, if I open a Plugin UI and then close it, I cannot open it again.
• I cannot locate any minimized windows at the bottom for any UI's that I may have minimized.
• If I add a Plugin to a track that I haven't yet recorded into, I can open the UI. If I close it and then try to open it again, it either very briefly appears then disappears, or it returns (no discernable pattern).
• If I delete the Plugin in a track I am working on and then add it in afresh, the UI opens but all settings are lost. (I am taking screen shots of each plugin setup for my recording notes document as a crude backup).
• When creating a new project, I am able to open Plugin UI's, close them and then open them again.
• This behavior only started occurring for me 2 days ago.

I think you are confusing plugin state with UI position. If you delete a plugin and reinsert it of course its not going to retain its settings because it goes back to defaults. If you cant locate minimized UI its possible that the windows menu bar is obscuring it. 

[Noel Borthwick]

5 hours ago, Max Arwood said:

I had this happen too. I reported it. After I finally found the plugins under the bottom of the track view, I was relieved. I was going to look into it again the next day, but after I moved a couple of plugins where I wanted them to be, they started working correctly. It was the 1st time I opened a song after an update. It never happened again. Sorry I don’t have more info. 
edit - I think I accidentally found the pluggins by pressing F for full screen. 

Are you also running more than a 2 monitor config?

[Noel Borthwick]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I’m pretty sure we can fix this easily once I root cause it. I’ll send a build to try once we have a proposed fix.
I unfortunately don’t have a 3 output video card to try this.

[Chaps]

Very puzzling thread. I use 3 monitors and can't reproduce any problems mentioned here and everything always works fine with Sonar free tier and Windows 11.

[Mark Morgon-Shaw]

23 minutes ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Thanks for the feedback guys. I’m pretty sure we can fix this easily once I root cause it. I’ll send a build to try once we have a proposed fix.
I unfortunately don’t have a 3 output video card to try this.

Here's an observation from today.

I was working on a project this morning , all plugins opening where expected. No issues.

I had to take a break as our dog needs walking , and knowing I'd be gone for quite some time I switched my 3 screens off ( I do this manually as I use a performance power plan with no automatic sleeping or powering off peripherals ) but left Sonar running as I planned to continue on my return.

So I came back 90 minutes later, powered the 3 screens back on, waited for them to sort themselves out and lo & behold, the next plugin I tried to open was down in the corner like in the video I posted.

My console view which I normally place on the right hand monitor had minimised itself so I restored that up back to where it had been. This made no difference to where any plugins opened.

I tried various functions, like inserting new plugins from both the right click menu and dragging from the browser - all had the same result

If I inserted a new VSTi  with "Open Synth Properties" ticked, this also opened itself at the bottom with only the title bar visible.

Nothing short of dragging it to the right place seems to cure it once it happens.      

Edited Sunday at 11:49 AM by Mark Morgon-Shaw

[Noel Borthwick]

3 hours ago, Mark Morgon-Shaw said:

8 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

The window is always sized correctly, just below the screen right?

Yes, just the menu bar visible - always on monitor 1

Can you elaborate? Does it only mess up the window position for plugins that were originally on monitor 1 or was  the plugin originally on Monitor 3 when you closed it? 
Just to reiterate only the last plugin position is saved. There is no mechanics to remember the last position of every plugin you close. When you open a plugin it looks up the static last saved position and places the window there. I suspect something is getting confused in that mechanism.

[Noel Borthwick]

7 minutes ago, Mark Morgon-Shaw said:

Here's an observation from today.

I was working on a project this morning , all plugins opening where expected. No issues.

I had to take a break as our dog needs walking , and knowing I'd be gone for quite some time I switched my 3 screens off ( I do this manually as I use a performance power plan with no automatic sleeping or powering off peripherals ) but left Sonar running as I planned to continue on my return.

So I came back 90 minutes later, powered the 3 screens back on, waited for them to sort themselves out and lo & behold, the next plugin I tried to open was down in the corner like in the video I posted.

My console view which I normally place on the right hand monitor had minimised itself so I restored that up back to where it had been. This made no difference to where any plugins opened.

I tried various functions, like inserting new plugins from both the right click menu and dragging from the browser - all had the same result

If I inserted a new VSTi  with "Open Synth Properties" ticked, this also opened itself at the bottom with only the title bar visible.

Nothing short of dragging it to the right place seems to cure it once it happens.      

This narrows it down a bit. My theory that when you are turning off the monitors and turning them back on somehow windows is reconfiguring the setup that invalidates the last saved position Sonar has. So when you open its falling back to doing something wrong. 
If instead of opening the window immediately after this, you close Sonar, reload the project and then open a plugin window does it work then? If so it would seem to imply that Sonar is relying on some stale information.

[Mark Morgon-Shaw]

27 minutes ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Can you elaborate? Does it only mess up the window position for plugins that were originally on monitor 1 or was  the plugin originally on Monitor 3 when you closed it? 

I  usually have my plugins open on monitors 2 or 3.

I don't typically have them open on screen 1 as this is used for my main track view and I don't want anything obscuring it. 

[Will.]

I've just done some limited research, and this seems to be an issue across all DAWs with both Windows and Mac - nothing from Linux though.

Then some threads were saying that it's an issue with Samsung monitors with the "Auto Adjust" feature and depending on which monitor wakes up first - that monitor grabs the plugins if other monitors are still adjusting from wake-up. They also say sometimes the entire window reverts to the main monitor. 

Some suggest that a possible delay between the auto display in Windows, and the auto adjust feature of Samsung monitors could also confuse message and communication in multiple display setups when they are turned back on for a correct resolution reading - which can cause some display issues with certain windows that might be on a secondary monitor. That's what the people of Mr. Google are saying.

 

Edited Sunday at 02:04 PM by Will.

[Noel Borthwick]

Even though we're had a lot of changes to the UI code in Sonar I'd still be surprised if this is an issue thats entirely new to Sonar. I expect Cbb would have similar issues if its indeed Windows shuffling things around.

[Mark Morgon-Shaw]

1 hour ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Even though we're had a lot of changes to the UI code in Sonar I'd still be surprised if this is an issue thats entirely new to Sonar. I expect Cbb would have similar issues if its indeed Windows shuffling things around.

I may have it  -  just figured out a difference between Sonar and CbB

If you minimise a plugin in Sonar with plugin re-cylcing enabled, the next plugin you open appears in the same location with just the title bar visible.

If you do this is CbB the new plugin opens in the 'old' location before it was minimised. Maybe this is what's causing the confusion.   

Edited Sunday at 03:39 PM by Mark Morgon-Shaw

[timeworx]

55 minutes ago, Mark Morgon-Shaw said:

I may have it  -  just figured out a difference between Sonar and CbB

If you minimise a plugin in Sonar with plugin re-cylcing enabled, the next plugin you open appears in the same location with just the title bar visible.

If you do this is CbB the new plugin opens in the 'old' location before it was minimised. Maybe this is what's causing the confusion.   

This is my observation as well. While in general, plugins opened for the first time appear a bit lower in the display than desired (minor annoyance but not that big of a deal), if a plugin is opened and then minimized, the next plugin opened will paint below the display with only the title bar visible. It can be dragged into position, so again, a touch annoying but workable especially when the behavior is anticipated.

 

[Max Arwood]

19 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Are you also running more than a 2 monitor config?

Yes 2 monitors. The 1st time I tried to open a plugin it was located below and behind the track window. I kept clicking them I thought they were not opening up, while they were actually opening below the dimensions of my monitor. Pressing F for full screen by accident showed the  pluggins title bars lined up at the bottom of the screen.. They were the proper size and opened, but were it sitting at the very bottom of the screen. The title bar was showing and the rest of the plugin was hanging below the actual monitor dimension. They were not minimized they were just outside of the monitors visual area.

Thanks,

Max

[Ben Staton]

Curious if anyone is seeing this behavior on Windows 11 ?

[Mark Morgon-Shaw]

2 hours ago, Ben Staton said:

Curious if anyone is seeing this behavior on Windows 11 ?

For the record I am still on Win10

Edited 19 hours ago by Mark Morgon-Shaw

[Ben Staton]

Fixed an issue described by @Mark Morgon-Shaw above, where, if you have plugin window recycling enabled, minimize a plugin, then switch to/open another plugin, it appears minimized.

[Noel Borthwick]

I've PMed Mark and Max a build with this fix to try.

[lmu2002]

After a recent update I no more have this issue. Which is great because it really was annoying!

FYI, I use a single monitor and win11. Long time user of Cakewalk and I appreciate that I can still use the software, whatever the current name might be.