So... Mono tracks are supposed to go to a stereo bus all the time?

[Christian Jones]

I'm in there in CbB w/ my dual amp sim rig on two separate tracks and playing through them simultaneously when suddenly I notice the Interleave button on the tracks, which I've never messed with before. Clicking it alternates between mono and stereo Interleave. This confused me because I've already set the track inputs to mono, so what's this "stereo/mono Interleave" business? I searched and found this great post by bitflipper (7th post down) http://forum.cakewalk.com/m/tm.aspx?m=2956296&p=1

This explained it better than I had hoped for, but then he said this:

"The output of every mono track will normally be routed to a stereo bus. This is not a conundrum, it's how it has always been. The single audio stream is simply split and sent to both sides of the stereo bus. The track's pan knob merely determines how much of the signal goes to the left side and how much goes to the right side."

I always take what bitflipper says about Cakewalk as Cakewalk gospel so I'm only looking for a bit more clarification - because I had researched this previously and read several places that mono tracks should go to mono buses unless there's stereo effects on said buses.

Because I run a dual amp sim rig, in order to keep the two audio tracks which the sims are on at unity but still be able to blend them I send each sim track to their own mono bus so I can freely blend the two sim levels to taste w/ each other. So basically I treat those two mono buses as if they were the main amp sim audio tracks and this way I can leave the initial tracks' faders alone and blend the two sims w/ the bus faders - and then those two mono buses get routed to a "guitar amp master" bus which is mono in the meantime until a stereo effect gets put on there, though I suppose this guitar master bus can be stereo from the get go if that's how it should be... 

Is it appropriate, for this particular scenario, that I use mono buses for those two amp sim tracks, or should those two buses even in this scenario be stereo? 

So after reading bitflippers post at the old forum, here's how I'm thinking to set things:

The two audio tracks, each w/ their own amp sim for the dual amp rig, will be mono input tracks that are each set to mono Interleave - and those two tracks get sent to their own separate mono buses for blending purposes, and then those two buses get sent to a stereo "Guitar Master" bus (where any stereo effect like reverb etc would be placed) which ultimately gets sent to the main stereo Master bus. How does that sound? 

Thanks for that old post @bitflipper, that was rad, answered all the things. 

[RBH]

Either scenario as you described are just fine. The advantage of running Mono tracks to a stereo buss is to add stereo effects to that buss which can serve a different purpose when combining different instruments with common effects.  - In the box it's essentially all good.  Mixing at the buss  level and leaving inputs tracks fixed in order to drive amp sims is a good way to keep them more predictable -  depending where the amp sim is inserted and how it's " internal " effects are broken out.

[CJ Jacobson]

There really is no right or wrong way to process a mono track to a stereo or mono bus.

The right way is thew way that sounds best for you and the wrong way is the way it doesn't sound its best in that context of that specific mix. 

The same guitar track may sound better in one mix if you send it to a mono bus with a delay and that same guitar track may sound better in another snog being sent to a stereo bus with a delay. It all depends on ware you want the guitar sound coming form in the 3D mix (sound stage). do you want it coming form the back left corner or from the middle right side of the 3D stereo field.

[bitflipper]

11 hours ago, Christian Jones said:

The two audio tracks, each w/ their own amp sim for the dual amp rig, will be mono input tracks that are each set to mono Interleave - and those two tracks get sent to their own separate mono buses for blending purposes, and then those two buses get sent to a stereo "Guitar Master" bus (where any stereo effect like reverb etc would be placed) which ultimately gets sent to the main stereo Master bus. How does that sound? 

 

Sure, that'll work fine. But do you really need those extra buses if they're each being fed a single mono track?

Having a common (stereo) bus for guitars makes perfect sense, just as does having common buses for vocals and drums, for macro-mixing or exporting stems. But a mono track doesn't necessarily lose any of its mono-ness when routed to a stereo bus.

[Christian Jones]

4 hours ago, bitflipper said:

Sure, that'll work fine. But do you really need those extra buses if they're each being fed a single mono track?

Well which of the aforementioned buses are you referring to as not necessarily being necessary?

Well the reason I'm sending each of those amp sim tracks to their own mono buses -- and there are two audio tracks, each w/ their own amp sim -- is because this is a virtual dual amp rig where I'm splitting my guitar signal and playing through two separate amp sims simultaneously, and on the first amp sim track there's a cranked Marshall amp, on the second audio amp sim track there's an amp w/ a big muff and so these amps sound quite different from one another and need to be able to be blended to tatse and the only way I can think to do that while leaving the main track faders at unity is to send each of those tracks to their own separate mono bus (or aux tracks, alternatively) and blend them there.

 Then, the reason I then send those two mono amp sim buses to a Guitar Master bus is because once I've blended to taste those two amps on those two buses I then need a master volume for those two blended amps/buses. That's why that Guitar Master bus yet and still then gets sent to the main Master bus - because the Guitar Master bus is basically a master volume knob for this dual amp sim rig.  

If I were to just send both of those amp sim tracks to a single shared mono (or stereo bus) there'd be no way (that I know of) for me to adjust their levels separately to get the perfect blend of the two amps. Does that make sense? I know this is maybe a unique setup and maybe it seems a bit excessive but for the type of control I'm needing for these two amp sims this is the best way I can think to do it, but I not 100% on that.. Lol I thought I was being clever w/ this arrangement but I'm obviously no expert, though as I get a little better at this whole thing I've been trying to intuit stuff like this per my specific needs/ideas, and that's why I'm tyring to make sure my tees are crossed etc so I can skillfully manipulate stuff "correctly." 

Just to add: the reason I don't just dual track those two amps separately rather than playing through them simultaneously like I do now is because the dual amp sound *is* my guitar sound and always has been. I've always split my guitar signal between two amps back when I was using real amps, where each amp sounded quite different and my sound came from a blending of the two. These days I'm trying to replicate that in the virtual realm so that's what's going on here. 

Edited November 23, 2019 by Christian Jones

[bitflipper]

OK, I get it. Your (mono) effects are on the buses, not on the tracks. In that case, it makes sense.

[Christian Jones]

Yeah, I see now w/ more testing I've been overdoing this. I can just blend the two amp sims on thier main track faders since the faders have no effect on the gain staging of the input going to the amp sims - that's controlled by my front end and interface - and I don't need to be sending these tracks to buses for the sake of blending them. I see now that was some superfluous s#!t. Just a stereo Guitar Master bus is all I need for a "master volume" of those amps and for effects if any. I'm way better at guitar than this stuff. Thanks all. 

[Noel Borthwick]

Yes I think you have been over thinking this

Just put the ampsims in the mono tracks and output to the guitar bus. You can use simple track gain and pan to adjust the exact blend of the two amp sims and add  other common fx if needed directly in the guitar bus.