Ancient Cakewalk Pro user getting back into things

[Herbert Chong]

Hi everyone. I shudder to think how long it's been since I have done anything music-related but I'm pretty sure the last version of Cakewalk I used was Cakewalk Pro 5 or something like that in the mid-1990s. All I remember is that embedding WAV files into WRK files was a new thing when I packed up my MIDI gear into my storage locker. I was never experienced with music and MIDI but I had fun downloading and reworking MIDI files to match my synth stack and then recording the results. Anyway, on to my question:

I'm rusty on terminology so I might be using the wrong words to describe things. I have downloaded a MIDI file that seems to go on and on after the last MIDI event shown in Events view on the percussion track. It's shown by Cakewalk as the last track with a note in the track view. In the Staff view I can see some note being played over and over past that measure but there's no actual sound.

Various MIDI players for this file have many minutes of silence at the end of playing and I am trying to cut it off after the last audible note has decayed. What should I be looking for so that I can have a proper fadeout and then end for MIDI players so they don't go on for minutes of silence? Attached is the MIDI file.

Africa.mid

[IgoRr]

14 minutes ago, Herbert Chong said:

Что мне нужно искать, чтобы я мог иметь правильное затухание и затем завершение для MIDI-плееров, чтобы они не продолжали минуты тишины?

You should check the "Tempo" track - are there any changes after the last note in the project, and also check the events on the "automation" lines (previously called "Envelope"), there may also be some events registered after the last note in the project. But if you say that you have some repeating notes displayed for many minutes, then you should put the cursor on the last note in the main Cakewalk window (immediately after it), and then open the "Event List" on first MIDI track. And there you will be able to see - what specific notes are registered, in what octave and to what instrument the signal is sent from this track. It happens that some notes are registered outside the working range of most instruments, and then there really will be no sound. In the "Event List" you can scroll through tracks without leaving this window - at the top in the "Track" tab, there is an option "Next Track", and in this way you can scroll through all the tracks and see where something is written after the last note, and delete everything unnecessary.

[Bristol_Jonesey]

1 hour ago, Herbert Chong said:

Hi everyone. I shudder to think how long it's been since I have done anything music-related but I'm pretty sure the last version of Cakewalk I used was Cakewalk Pro 5 or something like that in the mid-1990s. All I remember is that embedding WAV files into WRK files was a new thing when I packed up my MIDI gear into my storage locker. I was never experienced with music and MIDI but I had fun downloading and reworking MIDI files to match my synth stack and then recording the results. Anyway, on to my question:

I'm rusty on terminology so I might be using the wrong words to describe things. I have downloaded a MIDI file that seems to go on and on after the last MIDI event shown in Events view on the percussion track. It's shown by Cakewalk as the last track with a note in the track view. In the Staff view I can see some note being played over and over past that measure but there's no actual sound.

Various MIDI players for this file have many minutes of silence at the end of playing and I am trying to cut it off after the last audible note has decayed. What should I be looking for so that I can have a proper fadeout and then end for MIDI players so they don't go on for minutes of silence? Attached is the MIDI file.

Africa.mid 53.36 kB · 1 download

I've downloaded your midi file and can confirm the following:

The last note data appears at measure 107:03:000 (Timestamp 4:24:08)

On the drum/percussion track (12) the snare on note D3 starts off with a duration of 10 ticks which is about right for a snare track

But this changes at measure 43 and becomes over an entire measure in length, which I would shorten to 10 ticks

But at measure 107:03 where it's supposed to stop, you have a single event which lasts for 430 measures!

This is why your project doesn't stop when it should. Delete it 

The reason you can't hear it is because at the point, the volume is being attenuated down to -INF in TTS-1 (the synth I used to test it)

 

Hope this helps

[pwalpwal]

welcome back! things have changed quite some since the mid 90s, you're in for a real ride!

/goodluck

[Herbert Chong]

Thanks for all that replied. Now that I know what to look for, I can learn more about the current Cakewalk UI and try to edit the several bad events and fix the file. Whoever sequenced it did a good job and I'd like to keep using the file in my projects. My intent is to remember and practice using my Yamaha WX11 and WX5 to replace the melody track with the output from my VL70m. It's a stretch for someone who didn't take music classes anywhere. I've been downloading and carefully going through MIDI files to find high quality ones including music minus one files to learn from and practice with.

Herb...

[David Baay]

3 hours ago, Herbert Chong said:

try to edit the several bad events and fix the file.

Couple quick thoughts on this:

- After re-saving as a "Normal" .CWP (Cakewalk Project) file, go to Preferences > Project > Clock and change Ticks per Quarter to 960.

- To fix the drum track, click the clip to select the whole thing, go to the Event Inspector module in the Control Bar and enter 120 (ticks) in the Duration field. This will change all the drum notes to be a 32nd duration (at 960 ppq which is a convenient length to be able to see them and differentiate them at all zoom levels and will take care of the one hyper-long event at the same time. As I'm sure you know, changing drum note durations has no audible effect because the entire sample is played as a 'one-shot' with no regard to the Note Off timing.

- In addition to setting a fixed the drum note length, you might want to apply a drum map to the track by choosing New Drum Map from the Output pick list and selecting GM Drums (Complete Kit) so that the track displays in the drum pane of the PRV with kit piece names and individual mute/solo controls per drum.

Edited Sunday at 07:04 PM by David Baay

[Herbert Chong]

2 hours ago, David Baay said:

Couple quick thoughts on this:

- After re-saving as a "Normal" .CWP (Cakewalk Project) file, go to Preferences > Project > Clock and change Ticks per Quarter to 960.

- To fix the drum track, click the clip to select the whole thing, go to the Event Inspector module in the Control Bar and enter 120 (ticks) in the Duration field, and OK. This will change all the drum notes to be a 32nd duration (at 960 ppq which is a convenient length to be able to see them and differentiate them at all zoom levels and will take care of the one hyper-long event at the same time. As I'm sure you know, changing drum note durations has no audible effect because the entire sample is played as a 'one-shot' with no regard to the Note Off timing.

- In addition to setting a fixed the drum note length, you might want to apply a drum map to the track by choosing New Drum Map from the Output pick list and selecting GM Drums (Complete Kit) so that the track displays in the drum pane of the PRV with kit piece names and individual mute/solo controls per drum.

Ok, I tried to do step 1 but I don't see Clock as a Project preference. I wonder if the free version of Cakewalk has this? I didn't pay for my Cakewalk, just downloaded the free version and registered. For step 2 I might have known that the duration on a percussion track doesn't affect anything but it's long since vanished from my memory. Eyeballing the event list with a reminder of what to look for, I manually edited the few dozens events with really screwy durations.

I've so far been doing minimal tinkering with these General MIDI files I've downloaded but I'm actually targeting either the TT1 that I found and configured for Cakewalk or my Roland SC-88VL that I recently got, or the Roland SC-55 that I bought many years ago. I understand that the TT1 is a superset of both my Roland hardware synths but there's a certain nostalgia playing with the boxes and getting them to work. I've got maybe a thousand MIDI files to sift through and spend time working on the ones where a) I can mute the lead track where I can play it using one of my wind controllers and my WX5/VL70-m combination, or b) play with it a lot to create something more like James Last/Dick Bakker sound. I want to add a MOTU  Symphonic Instrument to my instruments to do b. Call me a modern day lounge lizard 8-). I think this MIDI file of Toto's "Africa" is something I can try a.

Herb...

[David Baay]

15 minutes ago, Herbert Chong said:

I tried to do step 1 but I don't see Clock as a Project preference. I wonder if the free version of Cakewalk has this?

Click the 'Advanced' radio button at the bottom of Preferences.

[David Baay]

17 minutes ago, Herbert Chong said:

there's a certain nostalgia playing with the boxes and getting them to work.

I still fire up the old hardware regularly, especially the Roland D-110 that was my first MIDI synth module and on which many pre-VST projects were based.

21 minutes ago, Herbert Chong said:

I can play it using one of my wind controllers and my WX5/VL70-m combination

I always thought I should learn to play a breath controller but never got to it, and would struggle to learn breath control at this late date I'm afraid. A lot of my projects have wind/brass accompaniment, and a lot of solo piano works could use some. Maybe we can do a little collaboration to help you re-acquaint yourself with Sonar. Here's an example (I've been told I need to give time for my soloist to breath 😜) :

https://www.bandlab.com/post/89b09300-f6f9-e811-9f2a-00155d77cb96