Where is the rollback installer for the last (stable) version?

[Aaron Doss]

I am currently running 2025.02 and am looking for the rollback installer, I can't find it in the release notes like in the previous release versions.

The current version is only usable for about 10 minutes before the UI becomes so slow that I have to close or force kill the application and re-open it.

I would like to run the previous version while this is being fixed.

 

Thanks,

 

Aaron

[ccondon23]

Here is the response I got from Cakewalk support when I asked about that: 

As for rolling back, Sonar doesn’t currently have a built-in rollback installer, but if you need to revert for testing, we can look into possible options.

 

[Bristol_Jonesey]

7 hours ago, Aaron Doss said:

I am currently running 2025.02 and am looking for the rollback installer, I can't find it in the release notes like in the previous release versions.

The current version is only usable for about 10 minutes before the UI becomes so slow that I have to close or force kill the application and re-open it.

I would like to run the previous version while this is being fixed.

 

Thanks,

 

Aaron

You need to try and work out why the UI is becoming slow. Rolling back to a previous version is just papering over the cracks.

Some idea about your system would be useful.

[Wookiee]

@Aaron Doss there is no roll back, and as noted it is not always the solution. 

Perhaps if you provide some system specs, we might be able to identify the issue, 

[pwalpwal]

13 minutes ago, Wookiee said:

there is no roll back, and as noted it is not always the solution. 

but it's always a "workaround" until the issue is identified 🤷‍♀️ 

"no rollback" is quite an ask of users imo

[Wookiee]

3 hours ago, pwalpwal said:

but it's always a "workaround" until the issue is identified 🤷‍♀️ 

"no rollback" is quite an ask of users imo

I disagree, rolling back will not identify what is causing the issue, for his/her system, as you are removing the issue, not resolving or working around it. As the issue does not appear to affect all, just certain individual.

Which implies a certain set of circumstances, soft/hardware combinations. For instance I have not experienced the same problem, how many others are raising the issue in this or other threads on the same problem of sluggish UI?

True no roll back is an irritating but is the situation as it stands.

[pwalpwal]

Just now, Wookiee said:

I disagree, rolling back will not identify what is causing the issue, as you are removing the issue, not resolving or working around it.

True no roll back is an irritating but is the situation as it stands.

that's not the point, it's about letting people keeping working, but forcing them into "it is what it is" is a bit weird - "i was happily working on a cool tune in the excellent sonar but now i can't because the latest update doesn’t work how do i roll back?" - "oh no it is what it is, no roll back, suck it up" - it's just a reason for users to find something else that lets them keep working

are the users all really just testers?

/fwiw

[David Baay]

Rollback is a handy way to confirm that an issue is in fact related to an update. IMHO it should always be available for that purpose and in case it confirms an issue that's a showstopper for a certain workflow that may not be affecting eveyrone.

Edited Saturday at 07:30 PM by David Baay

[Aaron Doss]

The previous version of Sonar (2024.12) worked perfectly. The current version of Cakewalk (2024.12 free) works perfectly.  

I have attached a detailed export of my system information via the "system information" tool.

The brief specs are as follows:

• Dell Percision 5820 Tower
• Win 11 pro 10.0.62100 Build 26100
• Xeon W-2175 CPU
• 64Gb memory
• Sound interface: MOTU M4 (USB)
• Graphics Nvidia Geforce RTX 3060Ti
• I have windows core isolation disabled

I am running dual monitors, I have Sonar split between the two monitors (main interface on one and piano roll on the other)

For VST's I am using Native Instruments Kontakt 8 (full current version, not player)

• Norie Piano
• Claire Piano
• Session Strings 2

 

I am a software engineer myself, I understand the value of troubleshooting. I have sent in crash reports in the past, which the dev team did fix.  However, this issue involves a slowdown, and I don't get the opportunity to generate a crash report.

If there was a profiling tool I could use, I would gladly run that for the dev team. 

 

Aaron

 

 

 

 

 

 

system info.txt

[Wookiee]

@Aaron Doss what Anti virus/ malware software? Are you running a wired or wireless network? 

[Aaron Doss]

Since this is not a .net application, I can't run a profile in visual studio without the debug symbol package.   So I am running sysinternals process explorer.  If I had the code or at least the debugging symbol library  I could probably find the slowdown issue.

I have been monitoring Sonar and Kontakt for the last 10 minutes but have not seen any significant change in CPU utilization, Memory usage, handle count or thread count.  My system has plenty of resources to handle this application.  The audio processing engine does not seem to have issues, it's the user interface that becomes very slow.  Now taking several seconds between pressing play/stop for the project to respond.  

Since I am not familiar with the system architecture, I am open to any suggestions from the dev team on what I should look at.  I have all the Microsoft development tools and can pretty much run whatever utility they provide.

I forgot to mention in the last post I am running NVidia Driver version 32.0.15.7216

Aaron

 

[Aaron Doss]

@Wookiee

I am running Windows Defender on a wired network (directly to my router).  I just tried disabling the defender process but that does not have any effect on cakewalk's performance.

[Salvatore Sorice]

FWIW, on 02/27/2025 I had a project that would not stop playing no matter what I tried. Task manager, etc. showed things running normally (no high CPU for any processes, etc.). Had to kill Sonar via Task Manager.

That was the first time that ever happened - never saw it with a prior build.

All is running OK now. I'll report back if it happens again.

[Wookiee]

3 hours ago, Aaron Doss said:

@Wookiee

I am running Windows Defender on a wired network (directly to my router).  I just tried disabling the defender process but that does not have any effect on cakewalk's performance.

Thanks, Defender won't have any impact on performance, Wired Network puts less load on your system, which is why I asked. Any other programs running at the same time? What Nvidia driver do you have running? 

[Will.]

9 hours ago, Aaron Doss said:

 

I am running Windows Defender on a wired network (directly to my router).  I just tried disabling the defender process but that does not have any effect on cakewalk's performance.

Perhaps we need to look closely at the VST instruments and effects - instead of "system specs."  Does your issue persist in newly created projects? Have you tried to replace them with a fresh insert of the same synth and effect? It could be that a preset  might be locking up the VST synth or Effect - so it might only be related to the project in discussion. 

Try a different preset in all available synths and effects in the project to verify the bug. If it comes down to it being a preset, just replace that synth or effect with the same one. Also, disable and remove any sends and I/O routing tracks before replacing or switching back and forth between presets on your VST synts and effects. 

[pwalpwal]

i think it would be useful if we knew what systems/plugs the dev team dev/test with, debug symbols, and maybe even the test scripts they use... however, i've requested this a couple of times over the last almost-30 years but never got a response

[Aaron Doss]

2 hours ago, Will. said:

Perhaps we need to look closely at the VST instruments and effects - instead of "system specs."  Does your issue persist in newly created projects? Have you tried to replace them with a fresh insert of the same synth and effect? It could be that a preset  might be locking up the VST synth or Effect - so it might only be related to the project in discussion. 

Try a different preset in all available synths and effects in the project to verify the bug. If it comes down to it being a preset, just replace that synth or effect with the same one. Also, disable and remove any sends and I/O routing tracks before replacing or switching back and forth between presets on your VST synts and effects. 

I have created some new projects with the new version, the same issue persists.   The only VST I am using is Kontakt 8 (full version).   If I use a plugin it's typically the compressor that comes with Sonar (I assume the bundled vsts are tested with the system)  Otherwise I am using reverb in Kontakt,  I mostly use its internal effects chain.

I have seen this issue happen with projects that don't even have a vst instrument.  If I drive external midi instruments with a midi track in sonar it can also slow down.    I am pretty sure the issue is related to the piano roll.  The longer that is open the slower it gets.   The slowdown is exponential.  it will only be sluggish and then it will take 2-5 seconds to do something then 10-30 seconds then it will just hang, the longest I have wanted is 5 minutes before I force kill the application.

As a new user in this forum my account is restricted,  I can only post like 4-5 times a day before I get locked out for (presumably spamming).  I contacted the admins to try and lift that restriction but have not heard back from them yet.  So If I don't respond within a day that is why.    It's very annoying to try to get support and not be able to answer questions because my account is timed out. 

I did see in the release notes that the piano roll is now GPU accelerated. I am going to try and disable the acceleration and see if that helps.

 

Aaron

[pwalpwal]

4 hours ago, Aaron Doss said:

I did see in the release notes that the piano roll is now GPU accelerated.

good call, as the symptoms are UI related

[Will.]

6 hours ago, pwalpwal said:

i think it would be useful if we knew what systems/plugs the dev team dev/test with, debug symbols, and maybe even the test scripts they use... however, i've requested this a couple of times over the last almost-30 years but never got a response

It is not a question of what plugs the bakers use - it all comes down to if the plugin vendor support Sonar. I had an issue before where Nexus 4 would lock up CbB - I too just got the "Whats your system specs and what interface are you using" answers here on the forum.

So, I've reach out to the plugin Vendor - they responded by saying they havent tested for Cakewalk and that I should give them 24hours. Sure enough, 24hrs later with fresh new copy and whatever that bug was - it was gone. 

I know from personal experience that the NI Transient Shaper, do not play well with Cakewalk at all its slows the UI down. 

[pwalpwal]

2 minutes ago, Will. said:

NI Transient Shaper, do not play well with Cakewalk at all its slows the UI down.

but not other daws? i'm guessing plugin devs dev their thing and test in some daws, but it does seem that cbb/sonar is an outlier