[Solved] Lastest update just trashed ProChannel in both Sonar and Cakewalk by Bandlab

[Steev]

Is there a way to rollback Sonar? I'm in the middle of working on 4 collaborations and have rapidly approaching deadlines.

Trying to add a module to ProChannel crashes both Sonar and Cakewalk by Bandlab.

I've lost sound output on VSTi synths.

Thank God EVERYTHING works fine with SONAR Platinum, however that requires almost a complete remix.

 

Correction, 

MOST modules in SPLAT show up in ProChannel When I try to add a compressor to ProChannel, it crashes SPLAT

Cakewalk Sonar ver 2024.11

 

SONAR Platinum ver 23.8.0 build 30 [2017.08]

.

 

Glad all over_11272024_135315.dmp

[Chaps]

I have Cakewalk by Bandlab build 29.09.0.120 and I can't reproduce your problem. I have no other cakewalk software. Maybe reinstall the programs?

[msmcleod]

Given that the crash was in mfc140u.dll,  I'd recommend reinstalling the C++ redists:
 

 

[Noel Borthwick]

Its failing to insert the prochannel module itself. I can fix the point of failure but the fact that you claim its new could mean that something mode fundamental changed in at the system level.
Let me know if removing all redists and reinstalling Sonar helps. Several users have been reporting problems with other apps corrupting the redists.
Go to add/remove programs and search for Redistributable and remove ALL the microsoft Visual C++ redists.
Then re-run the latest Sonar installer. Let us know if that resolves the problem. If the issue is indeed the redist then all versions of Sonar should get fixed.

Note that something like this can also get caused by something damaging a common dll dependency. If so all related dll's will fail to load leading to random crashes. This is typically an installation problem.

[Steev]

14 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Its failing to insert the prochannel module itself. I can fix the point of failure but the fact that you claim its new could mean that something mode fundamental changed in at the system level.
Let me know if removing all redists and reinstalling Sonar helps. Several users have been reporting problems with other apps corrupting the redists.
Go to add/remove programs and search for Redistributable and remove ALL the microsoft Visual C++ redists.
Then re-run the latest Sonar installer. Let us know if that resolves the problem. If the issue is indeed the redist then all versions of Sonar should get fixed.

Note that something like this can also get caused by something damaging a common dll dependency. If so all related dll's will fail to load leading to random crashes. This is typically an installation problem.

Thank you, Noel.

Uninstalling all Microsoft Visual C++ redists and running Cakewalk installer worked and I'm back to normal. 👍👍

[Noel Borthwick]

It also fixed cbb and platinum right? Are you aware of any other software you installed recently that could have damaged the redists?

[Kevin Walsh]

It's been a while since I've been in the C++ game so correct me if I'm out of touch on this but it's not always a good ideal to uninstall all of the C++ redistributable packages from your computer. These components contain library code that many programs share. Some versions are used and installed by Windows itself.  Microsoft issues fixes and security updates for them too.

While you may fix one program's operation, you may well end up breaking any number of others.  One safer option is to try to repair an install rather than simply uninstalling it. You can do this by right-clicking on the package in the Programs and Features Control Panel and selecting Change->Repair.

As always, your mileage may vary, caveat emptor and so on.

[Steev]

23 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

It also fixed cbb and platinum right? Are you aware of any other software you installed recently that could have damaged the redists?

Yes, it fixed all 3.

Only new software upgrade I installed recently another drum kit for XLN Addictive Drums 2. And they also updated their installer, Addictive Keys and changed/upgraded the whole GUI for AD-2.

[Noel Borthwick]

8 hours ago, Kevin Walsh said:

It's been a while since I've been in the C++ game so correct me if I'm out of touch on this but it's not always a good ideal to uninstall all of the C++ redistributable packages from your computer. These components contain library code that many programs share. Some versions are used and installed by Windows itself.  Microsoft issues fixes and security updates for them too.

While you may fix one program's operation, you may well end up breaking any number of others.  One safer option is to try to repair an install rather than simply uninstalling it. You can do this by right-clicking on the package in the Programs and Features Control Panel and selecting Change->Repair.

As always, your mileage may vary, caveat emptor and so on.

That is true in general but the universal installer that we now use from Microsoft should cover most bases. We also install prior VC 2005, 10 and 13 installers (as supplied by Microsoft). The issue here arises with redundant duplicates from old VC installers or incompatible toolsets.

This is the important info from Microsoft
“Visual Studio versions since Visual Studio 2015 share the same Redistributable files. For example, any apps built by the Visual Studio 2015, 2017, 2019, or 2022 toolsets can use the latest Microsoft Visual C++ Redistributable. However, the version of the Microsoft Visual C++ Redistributable installed on the machine must be the same or higher than the version of the Visual C++ toolset used to create your application. ”

[Steev]

8 hours ago, Kevin Walsh said:

It's been a while since I've been in the C++ game so correct me if I'm out of touch on this but it's not always a good ideal to uninstall all of the C++ redistributable packages from your computer. These components contain library code that many programs share. Some versions are used and installed by Windows itself.  Microsoft issues fixes and security updates for them too.

While you may fix one program's operation, you may well end up breaking any number of others.  One safer option is to try to repair an install rather than simply uninstalling it. You can do this by right-clicking on the package in the Programs and Features Control Panel and selecting Change->Repair.

As always, your mileage may vary, caveat emptor and so on.

Windows 10 Pro did not repair problems.

And I also checked all other vendor's music and video production software I know that utilize C++ redistributable's. Sony/Magix, Steinberg, Propellorhead, etc. & so on and everything is fully functioning.

And once again THANK YOU NOEL for providing this installation package. 🙏 It worked like a breeze and was infinitely easier and faster than digging though Microsoft's seemingly limitless and tedious pages of "FAQ's" before finding out where to download the stuff I need.

[Noel Borthwick]

Here’s the thing - even if a program installs a “bad” redist, that particular program may work, but it can break a different program that was built using the newest version of the redist. Honestly I’m not sure who’s fault this is - is it a buggy redist installer from microsoft or just that the new redist installers are not compatible with old obsolete ones resulting in this hell.
I’m curious if the other programs you installed were prior to installing the latest Sonar or before?

Its pretty frustrating since we get blamed for it but its really out of our control. We could consider statically linking the dependencies that we need but then our exe size gets huge.

[Steev]

10 minutes ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Here’s the thing - even if a program installs a “bad” redist, that particular program may work, but it can break a different program that was built using the newest version of the redist. Honestly I’m not sure who’s fault this is - is it a buggy redist installer from microsoft or just that the new redist installers are not compatible with old obsolete ones resulting in this hell.
I’m curious if the other programs you installed were prior to installing the latest Sonar or before?

Its pretty frustrating since we get blamed for it but its really out of our control. We could consider statically linking the dependencies that we need but then our exe size gets huge.

Oh yea, I can only imagine how frustrating your job is in my worst nightmares just by reading thru some of the stuff I see here in the forums. The very place where I come from time to time to find quick solutions and also try to help others find quick solutions. And also, a place where my sense of wit & humor has gotten me in trouble from time to time.

While I can ignore 90% of it to avoid getting angry or LMAO, it's like "TAG! you're IT!" and you may very well get blamed for the "Sharon Tate Murders" just because Cakewalk doesn't do exactly what someone wants it to do, exactly the way they want it to do it. 🤯

Everything was previously installed before I even upgraded from Cakewalk by Bandlab to Cakewalk Sonar with the exception of the new Addictive Drums 2 software upgrade.

I've recently been going through hell with REALLY flakey Windows 11 updates on another computer which I basically only use to run Microsoft Office Pro 2021, home security, iOT, and Internet streaming & Google. I recently booted up to 2 "Blue Screens of Death" within a few months. 1st time I managed to reboot to "safe mode" and roll it back to an earlier install, and the 2sd time I had to use a Windows repair disk, and about 45 minutes later while it reinstalled Windows 11, I was almost kicking myself for not rolling it ALL the way back to WINDOWS 10.

[orcmid]

2 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

However, the version of the Microsoft Visual C++ Redistributable installed on the machine must be the same or higher than the version of the Visual C++ toolset used to create your application. ”

I recall that some years ago, there was a new SxS (Side by Side) installation provision where dependencies on specific redistributables were preserved and updates for other (SxS?) apps did not interfere.

Has this gone away with Windows 10/11?  

[Noel Borthwick]

7 hours ago, Steev said:

Everything was previously installed before I even upgraded from Cakewalk by Bandlab to Cakewalk Sonar with the exception of the new Addictive Drums 2 software upgrade.

Its possible that AD2 somehow overwrote something then. 

6 hours ago, orcmid said:

I recall that some years ago, there was a new SxS (Side by Side) installation provision where dependencies on specific redistributables were preserved and updates for other (SxS?) apps did not interfere.

Has this gone away with Windows 10/11?  

Not that I'm aware of. However, I have no idea how Microsoft manages its redistributable installer. We simply run their latest installer.
Their notes say "Redistributable installed on the machine must be the same or higher than the version of the Visual C++ toolset used to create your application. ” which to me indicates that they have a common redist now which is backwards compatible. If this is the case, then another app can come and downgrade that and break other apps. This is the only explanation I have for how these redists are routinely getting trashed for some people. I will create a support ticket but I doubt MS will even know how to troubleshoot this.

[Steev]

2 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said:

Its possible that AD2 somehow overwrote something then. 

I wouldn't rule that out. The new AD 2 GUI is VERY different, not just reskinned, a lot more added functionality.

I also just opened a Cakewalk Project running Reason's Rack VST 3 plugin & noticed Reason's "Humana" synth plugin failed to load and I couldn't find it in the Reason Rack plugin browser. 

I added another Reason synth and Reason Rack VST works fine in Cakewalk Sonar.

Then I opened the Reason 11 DAW and couldn't find the Humana synth there either. It' simply GONE, poof, VANISHED like the ProChannel modules!

And so I went and logged into my Propellerhead account to download a fresh copy Humana synth again and they threatened me with a just 3 more days Black Friday 40% off upgrade to Reason 13 which was hard to refuse and I forgot to "just" download Humana, and I'm starting to get an anxiety headache because the Reason DAW is MASSIVELY HUGE! 

Propellerhead doesn't orphan or discontinue anything in Reason, they just ADD MORE synths and utilities to it, and may reinstall the same old Microsoft Visual C++ Redistributable files that trashed Cakewalk's ProChannel?

I think I'll leave well enough alone, I'm more than happy with Cakewalk Sonar as my main whip and I can do the same things with Dimension Pro and or Rapture Pro that I can do with Humana and at least dozen other synths combined in Reason and Native Instruments together.

That being said, I really wish Bandlab would continue to develop and support Rapture Pro BACK in action which seems quite a bit less quirky in the new Cakewalk Sonar then it was in SPLAT.

How much stuff do we need before we crash under the weight of TOO MUCH STUFF?

 

 

Edited November 30 by Steev