Quinellipe Zorn Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 7 minutes ago, pwal³ said: Of course they provide feedback internally, but they're the developers not the business, get a grip My grip is if the business does not listen to the developers, the business is at fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinellipe Zorn Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 I'm not necessarily against a subscription model. I'm not necessarily against a Bandlab membership model. Will just wait and see. I don't see a reason to lose time on projects in preparing for a change when it's so speculative, for my own/our situation. Worst case I pay for an unwanted year or such of some subscription while looking at alternatives, which I'd rather do than lose time on projects now. That said, Bandlab has all the earmarks of a company that emphasizes growth to then do a hard "enshittification," as the term has been popularized. But, hey, even those companies can still be relatively okay in the marketplace, such as it is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Kelley Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 (edited) 1 hour ago, Quinellipe Zorn said: If Bandlab isn't watching this forum, that's Bandlab's problem. If "the Bakers" are interacting here, it's also their obligation to provide feedback within their company based on those interactions. A company official cannot transact with customers and then disclaim it isn't their role to provide feedback, or such. (And I'm not suggesting whatsoever that the engineers are making such disclaiming, and I have full confidence that they provide feedback. If not, well, that's on the company.) While I personally think we are being “strung along” at this point, I don’t think it’s the developers doing it and I get the impression they would give us everything we want - if they could. We can bitch at them until the cows come home and all they can do is pass it on. Why bother them with that. Talk to Bandlab directly. I was a developer and development manager for many years and we had little direct say in the pricing and rollout other than giving an opinion. It was marketing, sales and finance that drove the pricing and rollout. Edited April 3 by Terry Kelley 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott C. Stahl Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 (edited) Seems like user feedback would be a metric they would or should look at. I'm sure I'll get on board myself as the bugs are ironed out and the pricing is set. (Unless it's something crazy, which I doubt) Hearing opinions of people either happy or unhappy with the rumour mill can contain some useful info. I've been on these forums since the 90's and have seen a lot worse than the complaints here. BTW I've seen some blowup from Studio 1 users about their marketing and sub plans. All of this potential pricing and subscription upset is not happening in a vacuum Edited April 4 by Scott C. Stahl typos, grammar 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noel Borthwick Posted April 4 Share Posted April 4 On 4/3/2024 at 1:09 PM, Terry Kelley said: While I personally think we are being “strung along” at this point, I don’t think it’s the developers doing it and I get the impression they would give us everything we want - if they could. I understand that users want to get definitive answers on final pricing and purchase options, but please don’t read too much into this,. As mentioned earlier, BSP was the quickest way we could make it the software available to users while all the other moving parts are sorted out for an official release. The wait to final releasse was completely expected to be a few months. BandLab is a big company and Its not just engineering - management, marketing, back end, social, support, all of those have to be coordinated to make it happen. Our team would obviously like this to happen sooner than later and we’ve done our part to communicate whats needed within the org. If you need it now go ahead and use BSP, or wait for the final announcements on purchase options. Its pretty simple. 8 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulo Posted April 4 Share Posted April 4 1 hour ago, Noel Borthwick said: Its pretty simple. Probably would have been more simple to have not said anything at all until everything was in place. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milton Sica Posted April 4 Share Posted April 4 32 minutes ago, paulo said: Probably would have been more simple to have not said anything at all until everything was in place. I completely agree with this. In fact, "pricing" as stated was already a very poorly thought out strategy, but..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John T Posted April 4 Share Posted April 4 Seems to me that if you're not interested in the soft release version, you can just ignore it. I don't see the problem. 4 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Baay Posted April 4 Share Posted April 4 6 hours ago, Noel Borthwick said: BS pass Probably best not to get in the habit of abbreviating it that way. The trolls will have a field day with it. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Baay Posted April 4 Share Posted April 4 4 hours ago, Milton Sica said: 5 hours ago, paulo said: Probably would have been more simple to have not said anything at all until everything was in place. I completely agree with this. In fact, "pricing" as stated was already a very poorly thought out strategy, but..... I also agree... but I think it's the hand-wringers who should not have said anything. ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AB99 Posted April 4 Share Posted April 4 Well, the sale price for annual membership is a fair price and it comes with Sonar and the membership extras (which I do not care about). $105 for a year - with this discount that expires April 6 - two days from now. Will the price several months from now be less? No one knows. I really appreciate Noel's recent response. He is a class act. And frankly between him and other Bakers, the real extra perk is the fantastic customer support on issues and the like. I know I have made requests privately and they have gone out of their way to help me. I imagine there are many other great things they do that do not get publicized. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noynekker Posted April 4 Share Posted April 4 I believe you can cancel the Backstage Pass at any point, if something else is offered that makes more sense for your personal situation, limited time demo if you want. In reality, it's only a discount of about $5.00 for the first month. Anyways, it's a chance to support BandLab, who have offered an amazing free DAW for 5 years, ain't that worth something ? . . . especially if you want to continue working on your existing, and older projects. For those of us who have made the plunge to new Sonar, we get it, it's totally clear where things are going after working in the new version for a few weeks, the new clarity is not just the vector graphics, it's also the less cluttered GUI. Everything is in the same place, just a few adjustments visually. Bring on the feature enhancements. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted April 5 Share Posted April 5 (edited) 3 hours ago, noynekker said: Anyways, it's a chance to support BandLab, who have offered an amazing free DAW for 5 years, ain't that worth something ? . . . especially if you want to continue working on your existing, and older projects. NOPE. Do you really believe the plan was not to have a viable product to SELL at some point? Of course it was. Also, nothing wrong with that-smart business! So in my opinion CW by BL has had over 4 years to come up with a sales plan. Also, I imagine NONE of the long time CW users like me (35 yrs) and many others didn't ask or care that it was free. I would have gladly paid for it. Just sayin! Edited April 5 by Pathfinder 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noynekker Posted April 5 Share Posted April 5 23 minutes ago, Pathfinder said: NOPE. Do you really believe the plan was not to have a viable product to SELL at some point? Of course it was. Also, nothing wrong with that-smart business! So in my opinion CW by BL has had over 4 years to come up with a sales plan. Also, I imagine NONE of the long time CW users like me (35 yrs) and many others didn't ask or care that it was free. I would have gladly paid for it. Just sayin! For sure, folks who love the software will pay, I never believed free could be sustainable . . . I'm just saying, looks like it's moving towards more of a partnership with BandLab, brand new marketing plan, and Cakewalk will have to re-join the reality of the DAW wars, and find and develop new features to stay afloat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathfinder Posted April 5 Share Posted April 5 Just now, noynekker said: For sure, folks who love the software will pay, I never believed free could be sustainable . . . I'm just saying, looks like it's moving towards more of a partnership with BandLab, brand new marketing plan, and Cakewalk will have to re-join the reality of the DAW wars, and find and develop new features to stay afloat. Trust me, I want CW\Sonar to survive and flourish-Honestly! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quinellipe Zorn Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 (edited) On 4/3/2024 at 10:09 AM, Terry Kelley said: While I personally think we are being “strung along” at this point, I don’t think it’s the developers doing it and I get the impression they would give us everything we want - if they could. We can bitch at them until the cows come home and all they can do is pass it on. Why bother them with that. Talk to Bandlab directly. I was a developer and development manager for many years and we had little direct say in the pricing and rollout other than giving an opinion. It was marketing, sales and finance that drove the pricing and rollout. I'm not suggesting the "bakers" are responsible. This is the forum I am on, this is the one where we talk about the product, if Bandlab isn't somehow incorporating this feedback it is not my job to do their sentiment analysis and so forth for them, nor to chase after wherever they might be when this is very clearly a forum they know people are voicing opinions (PS - more specifically, come for support, which will beget a lot of feedback with it; it's their job to review that correspondence, and if they aren't, that says a lot about the company and direction; it also tells me then there's no point in voicing anything at all to them). Edited April 9 by Quinellipe Zorn clarity 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Kelley Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 (edited) If you do nothing, expect nothing. I too hope these comments and concerns make it up to the Bandlab marketing and finance folks. But it’s clear that Bandlab has a vision that isn’t shared by everybody here. We will see. Edited April 9 by Terry Kelley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig Anderton Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 On 4/3/2024 at 10:31 AM, Quinellipe Zorn said: "This is the weirdest, softest rollout of any software I have ever seen, bar none." There's stiff competition from Windows 11 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Kelley Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 And now for something rather off-topic: Remember OS/2 and Windows 1.0? That was a soft rollout! Microsoft kept us hanging for a loooooonnnnngggg time while poo-pooing OS/2. Not that any DAW represents OS/2 mind you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heath Row Posted April 10 Share Posted April 10 My local baker always has a soft roll out, I have half a dozen on permanent order for Thursday night's, Hot Dog Night?????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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