struggling to get started with generative midi / sequencing

[Gregh1957]

Hi, I am brand new to Cakewalk and have the following I have been trying to create with no success. I have looked for tutes but not finding what I need

 

i would like to do the following

Basic signal flow is

Riffer (midi) > Obelisk (midi) > Synth(audio)

 

Riffer is a sequencer, it will send out midi notes. Those notes then go into Obelisk which will turn each note into a midi chord. Those chords go to the synth.  I just cannot figure out how to do this in Cakewalk. I have many years using Reaper where not surprisingly I find this easy to do and I am sure it will be easy in Cakewalk with some help

thanks, Greg

https://audiomodern.com/shop/plugins/riffer/

https://frozenplain.com/product/obelisk/

 

 

[scook]

A plug-in sending MIDI data either shows up in plug-in lists as an effect or a synth. This describes the how to set up both to send MIDI data to another plug-ins.

 

[Gregh1957]

thanks - that works a bit - however if I expand the riffer track so that I can see the various parameters (on left hand side) then the output from riffer stops and the synth stops. To hear the synth again I have to expand the synth track . The re are other minimise/expand combinations that dont work as well - it this a normal feature?

 

Also where would I put something like Obelisk or Harvest  for generating variations?

Edited October 5, 2019 by Gregh1957

[scook]

My guess is Always Echo Current MIDI Track is enabled. Try disabling this feature and manually set input echo as needed.

[Gregh1957]

thanks for that advice

 

 

Edited October 5, 2019 by Gregh1957

[scook]

It is a button on the track header, inspector and console track strips immediately to the right of the record button. If you do not see it in the track header make sure the track control manager drop down is set to All.

A small piece of the input echo button is shown to the right of the record button in this image. Better images of the button are shown in the help linked above.

[Gregh1957]

thanks again, slowly getting there - I have riffer going to a synth working. I can still not get riffer > obelisk (the midi harmoniser) > synth. Does that need a track for obelisk, or can I put obelisk on the riffer track as an fx?

Edited October 5, 2019 by Gregh1957

[scook]

I have neither plug-in, that said, every VST plug-in that uses MIDI I/O needs its own track(s) to handle MIDI data. Audio track FX racks handle only audio I/O to the plug-ins. MIDI FX racks are for MFX plug-ins which are DX format.

[Gregh1957]

thanks - that is not going to work for me - I would end up with 4 or 5 tracks feeding into every sound source.  Would get very difficult to follow, whereas in Reaper I can just have one track for each sound source with as many plugins on that track as I want eg 5 midi plugins>synth>5fx  makes it very easy to follow what is going on. Reaper has its own annoying problems though, hence me looking at Cakewalk

 

thanks again for all your help

 

 

Greg

[User 905133]

Interesting idea: daisy-chaining midi plug-ins.  If there were  "MIDI Chains" like "FX Chains" that might be fun to play around with to algorithmically (including randomly) manipulate midi data.  

[Michael A.D.]

For more fun, try adding this freebie to any of the above-mentioned programs (or just use it by itself):

https://www.codefn42.com/transition/index.html

It's a generative MIDI sequencer called Transition and you can make some crazy cool stuff with it.

 

 

[abacab]

I think Reaper is way more flexible in this regard than many other DAWs.

In Reaper a track is a track, and can route any type of track data from one track to another.

In Cakewalk, and some other DAWs, the track objects are strictly defined as either MIDI, instrument, or audio tracks, which can limit the available  routing attributes, all dependent on how the respective developer designed the features.

There is no standard for this. You just need to use what works best for a given workflow.

 

 

Edited October 9, 2019 by abacab

[Matthew Sorrels]

 

On 10/5/2019 at 1:52 AM, Gregh1957 said:

thanks - that is not going to work for me - I would end up with 4 or 5 tracks feeding into every sound source. 

With Cakewalk you have to have a separate MIDI and sound channel for every one of the MIDI generative instruments your using, it doesn't work like Reaper.  So to do what you are describing you'd have to have 3 audio tracks and 3 midi tracks, even though two of the audio tracks aren't used (Riffer and Obelisk).  If you don't have the audio tracks the MIDI instruments won't work (they can't be headless).  But you can hide them.  Then you need to turn echo on all three MIDI tracks.  You should be able to hide a few of those as well.  So you only "see" the starting MIDI track (Riffer) and the resulting audio track (Synth).  Or maybe you could stuff them into a group folder or something.

[Matthew Sorrels]

I was able to get Riffer feeding into Obelisk feeding into a synth but it was very twitchy.  Audio engine keep stopping due to the lag.  Had to dial everything back a lot to make it not just halt.  The trick is all the manual echo's on the MIDI tracks (see the image below) and using the In/Out on the tracks to feed everything from one synth to the next.

 

 

[Leighton Cooper]

Wouldn't this be the ground that PG Music Band in a box covers?  or is it a totally different subject?

[Gregh1957]

On 10/10/2019 at 3:13 AM, Matthew Sorrels said:

I was able to get Riffer feeding into Obelisk feeding into a synth but it was very twitchy.  Audio engine keep stopping due to the lag.  Had to dial everything back a lot to make it not just halt.  The trick is all the manual echo's on the MIDI tracks (see the image below) and using the In/Out on the tracks to feed everything from one synth to the next.

 

 

thanks - unfortunately too clunky to be workable  -thanks for showing me the method tho