No audio in playback

[ST1]

I'm having the EXACT same issue as described in this old thread, and it's happened several times now:

http://forum.cakewalk.com/No-sound-in-playback-m3711112.aspx

It seems to happen when I open a song that is expecting to use my bluetooth earbuds for playback and I haven't connected them to the computer yet.

From that point on, it doesn't matter if I connect them and set the playback to earbuds, or set the playback to the computer speaker. There is zero playback audio for that song EVER again. I actually have to recreate the whole song from scratch which is crazy.

Every other song that doesn't have this issue continues to play just fine.

It really feels like a bug, unless someone knows how to resolve it...?

[John Vere]

This is not a bug. Bluetooth is not exactly a compatible audio device for Cakewalk. It has 30- 50 ms of latency so is not usable. 
Follow the instructions in this video and you won’t have any issues. 

 

[ST1]

17 minutes ago, pwal³ said:

if you connect your bt device/earbuds before opening the song does it work?

No. Once this issue happens once for a song, I can never hear that song again in Cakewalk, either on speakers or ear buds. But other songs in Cakewalk continue to be audible.

I should mention that it does not appear to be related to HOW I listen. When I play the problematic songs in Cakewalk, the meters that would indicate playback is happening don’t show any activity either. It’s like the song has actually become silent across all tracks. It is bizarre.

[John Vere]

7 hours ago, pwal³ said:

didn't the bakers make changes not too long ago that allowed audio devices to be enabled after loading the song? seems like a very similar symptom to me ?

Yes you can change devices with a project open. Issues like the OP is having are a good example of what can go wrong if you're not savvy to audio set up in preferences and driver modes.   

And Blue tooth doesn't always support both WASAPI modes. We will assume the OP doesn't have an Audio interface and is using a WASAPI shared mode with Cakewalk, this is why I posted the Video so if they watch that and do a proper Windows audio set up it rules out a lot of possible issues. 

I have a Bluetooth speaker I use for proofing mixes which I do by exporting the song first and using Media player. I also have Bluetooth headphones for this as well. 

I could play directly from Cakewalk by simply changing to WASAPI shared mode as you see in the screen shot. The critical difference is what Cakewalk decides is the timing master. If it gets confused then you won't have sound. In the Bluetooth set up below I had no problem with playback but I was unable to get a recording signal from the Zoom interface. 

With Bluetooth speakers I get 80 MS more latency. This makes it impossible to do any editing.  It's only use is to play projects for comparing a mix in something different than using proper monitors. 
 

That 80 ms does not include the transmission latency of Bluetooth.

This is from the Bluetooth Wiki info

Bluetooth codecs have higher latency than wired headphones, ranging from 34-200 milliseconds, which may be experienced as a noticeable lag between the action occurring and the corresponding audio. In contrast, wired headphones experience an average latency between 5-10 milliseconds.

 

Edited January 25 by John Vere

[ST1]

To illustrate what I said about the meters during playback, here's a screenshot taken during playback of a project that won't play audio. Note how track 1 clearly has audio in the top half of the screen, but there's no activity at all in the meters below.

I watched the video in the first reply and there were no changes to be made. That's why I think this is a bug because there does not appear to be anything different about the projects that suddenly stop playing audio, and I can playback any other project that does not have the audio issue just fine, either with Bluetooth earbuds or with computer audio.

If this isn't a bug, it should be something that can be resolved by changing a setting within the project, but I just cannot find anything different in the projects that have this issue.

If anyone else has any idea what could be happening here, please let me know. I have completely lost audio on a number of projects as a result of this, and it seems my only option is to start over on those... which is frustrating when I've spent days editing and mixing a project until it's almost complete.

Thanks.

[57Gregy]

Looks like your disc performance meter is 100%. That can't be good.

[rsinger]

Track 1 is set to Master and Master is set to None.

[mettelus]

On 1/25/2024 at 11:23 AM, ST1 said:

When I play the problematic songs in Cakewalk, the meters that would indicate playback is happening don’t show any activity either. It’s like the song has actually become silent across all tracks. It is bizarre.

As rsinger noted, this isn't a device issue, this is indicative of a routing issue. You may have opened a project without the initial Master output connected so it may have defaulted to "none" on you at that point. If you saved it after that point, the routing will continue to have no Master out until you assign it manually to something that Cakewalk can see (via Windows). It is always good practice to have devices connected and online before launching the app that needs them.

[John Vere]

That’s what I was saying. It’s what happens when you change to certain devices. Your master goes no where. 
I apologize if that wasn’t in the video. I thought it was. 
 

 

[ST1]

12 hours ago, rsinger said:

Track 1 is set to Master and Master is set to None.

Aha! I never even looked at that setting before. Thank you, that's all it needed.

[John Vere]

29 minutes ago, pwal³ said:

could be a feature request, if the project-saved master out isn't available to select something else ?‍♀️

My observation is that if the device is an ASIO interfaces Cakewalk will automatically set it to 1-2 outputs. You can open a project over the years and change interfaces dozens of times and Cakewalk will always connect with 1-2 on the master.
 Then if there’s no buses it connects directly to 1-2 from the tracks.  
The “none” situation is rare and it only happens to people who are not using ASIO. So there’s no need for any changes to Cakewalk. People who choose not to use an ASIO interface need to be aware of the limitations and complications that will arise and learn how to manually set things up. 

[mettelus]

There have been various iterations of pop ups/warnings over the years to varying degrees of effectiveness for missing components, but this situation warrants a pop up when the transport is started. A pop up with "You currently have no output device selected. Would you like to select one now?" and a button that either drills them directly into the preferences page or a routing blurb would help new folks a lot. A routing map of the current project would be true icing on the cake, but this particular one is a (not-so-obvious) showstopper. Even something as simple as highlighting the drop down in the Master to RED when "none" is selected would make people take notice (they could be monitoring a buss instead, but it would make the situation more obvious just in case).

[John Vere]

This is a great idea but I think the problem is not totally under Cakewalk control. Cakewalk has never liked consumer audio devices.  .

Cakewalk will have no way to know until you set your devices in windows and then choose it in preferences. 
This seems to always work for ASIO devices and Realtek sound cards.
It doesn’t always work with consumer  devices like USB podcast mikes and Bluetooth. Just my own observation that’s all. 
 

[57Gregy]

On 1/27/2024 at 12:29 PM, pwal³ said:

furry muff, but if it's about making things easier, why double-down on asio? a lot of (especially new) users don't know the difference between asio and their elbow and half the posts here recommend waspi (even more obscure than asio) as a driver, so let's be inclusive rather then exclusive ?

 

[Byron Dickens]

On 1/27/2024 at 11:29 AM, pwal³ said:

furry muff, but if it's about making things easier, why double-down on asio? a lot of (especially new) users don't know the difference between asio and their elbow and half the posts here recommend waspi (even more obscure than asio) as a driver, so let's be inclusive rather then exclusive ?

Maybe people should learn....

[57Gregy]

That's right. It's great that they're including WASAPI support and it works reasonably well, but I think it would be wrong to suggest to new users that they will be able to progress into the future of audio production without equipment that can perform at a higher level than the sound card in the computer can perform at.
Which is why, I think, an ASIO sound device is still the recommended minimum.
But even though I am 66 now, and somewhat dinosaurian,  I can see a future where it won't be a requirement. I probably won't be there. ?

[Byron Dickens]

58 minutes ago, pwal³ said:

recommended but not required ffs, if bandlab want to get all the youth on board having a bunch of old men moaning when they ask a reasonable question won't help - come on!

If you want to call being truthful and realistic "moaning," that's your problem.

Edited January 28 by Byron Dickens

[Glenn Stanton]

On 1/25/2024 at 7:54 AM, ST1 said:

It seems to happen when I open a song that is expecting to use my bluetooth earbuds for playback and I haven't connected them to the computer yet.

From that point on, it doesn't matter if I connect them and set the playback to earbuds, or set the playback to the computer speaker. There is zero playback audio for that song EVER again. I actually have to recreate the whole song from scratch which is crazy.

Every other song that doesn't have this issue continues to play just fine.

It really feels like a bug, unless someone knows how to resolve it...?

so try this: ALWAYS connect your bluetooth headset BEFORE opening this particular project ? or create a new clean project as it seems like it's corrupted for some reason (based your comment that ALL OTHER projects WORK).

I doubt it's a "bug" since it's only the one project, and only when you don't connect your headset before opening it. to me, that says something is wrong in the project. 

[John Vere]

6 hours ago, pwal³ said:

recommended but not required ffs, if bandlab want to get all the youth on board having a bunch of old men moaning when they ask a reasonable question won't help - come on!

Actually if you watch my videos I do not put down using on board audio. I just explain it’s limitations and that people need to be aware of them. 
There’s a whole new giant share of the “music”creating community that have zero musical ability and would be to lazy to learn. They are just fine with using the on board audio because they won’t be recording anything as audio.  ( Thank goodness) Welcome to the future of AI produced ( music??) 
But Cakewalk was originally designed with real musicians in mind, not “producers” . Other software like Abelton is designed for that use.
Cakewalk has  now introduced Next which is obviously designed from the ground up for non musicians.   It’s dead simple to use too.
Takes about 2 hours to figure it out and the manual is only 256 pages instead of Sonars 1,958 pages. As a musician I found it very lacking and even old Sonar Home Studio will blow it out of the water. 
So we Musicians will have Sonar. And the Producers will have Next.