mix bus help

[greg54]

I have been watching a lot of videos trying to understand a mix bus.   None that I have found so far explain HOW to create a mix bus, only that I should use one.   They say that when you create a mix bus, route everything to it.  Ok.  How?   But if you have a Master bus and route everything to the mix bus, what's the purpose of the Master bus?  Probably easy to understand for everyone else, but for someone like me who is new to mixing, it makes no sense.  And videos don't explain it - at least, not the ones I've watched.

Does anyone have a video tutorial that explains how to create a mix bus and how to use it?

[OutrageProductions]

The concept is simple, but you may be slightly confused by terminology. 

Busses just operate as a summing fader. You can add as many busses as needed and use them to 'group' things like drums, percussion,  guitars, keyboards, vocals, reverb, etc. Each of those 'groups' can have overall EFX treatment if desired, and then all of those busses can be sent to a Master (aka 'Mix') buss, then the Master feeds your audio outputs.

A lot of folks will (if they have enough horsepower) insert some "mastering & monitoring" tools on the Master buss for listening (and sometimes printing) an output file.

 

Edited May 4, 2023 by OutrageProductions

[Bristol_Jonesey]

Console view is comprises of 3 main sections, Tracks, Busses & Mains(Interface/Speakers)

Everything apart from your mains have to be set up by the user (unless you are using a template)

You can drag the little dividers between the sections to the left to expose more busses

Right-click in the blank area to the right of your existing busses and select  "Insert Stereo Bus"

 

[Alan Tubbs]

Right.  And thosefader panels are hard to separate at times.

[greg54]

Thanks your help!  I appreciate it.  For whatever reason, my brain is having a hard time absorbing how to mix and create and use busses.

[greg54]

OutrageProductions, I watched the video you posted,.  Thanks!

I also watched another video by Hardcore Music Studio called, 8 things to do on every mix.   In it he says to create buses for all guitars, drums, keyboards, etc, which I understand.   In the video he says this around 3:25

Then he said  that "everything comes out a main mix bus."  And THAT is what I don't understand and have not seen anyone explain in a video.  What and how?

 

 

[Byron Dickens]

You just route the busses to the master.

[greg54]

17 minutes ago, Byron Dickens said:

You just route the busses to the master.

All the buses I create for guitars, keyboards, horns, etc, are all routed to the Master bus?  So the Master bus is the mix bus?  That was easy.  Thanks, Byron!!

[Andres Medina]

In reality, once you understand the concept, you can use busses in a very flexible way, depending on your needs and your hardware. The first one can be project specific.

Think of them as "super tracks" that sums several audio tracks into one. Keep in mind that a bus can be routed to another bus, which comprises several busses into a "super bus", and so on.

I, for example, use a lot of busses to "group" instruments or families of instruments (Brass-Woodwinds-Percussion, and so on), that goes to my Master Bus, that goes to my hardware audio outs 1+2.

However, I need a secondary mix that goes to my speakers (hardware audio outs 3+4), because I need to process the audio that goes to the speakers in a different way that the "main" audio. Hence the use of a secondary "Main" bus. This one is fed by the Master Bus 1.

You can configure yet another Master Bus that goes to a headphone amp, and so on.

As you can see, busses can be very helpful, if properly used. 

Hope this helps -

Edited May 4, 2023 by Andres Medina

[greg54]

45 minutes ago, Andres Medina said:

However, I need a secondary mix that goes to my speakers (hardware audio outs 3+4), because I need to process the audio that goes to the speakers in a different way that the "main" audio. Hence the use of a secondary "Main" bus. This one is fed by the Master Bus 1.

You can configure yet another Master Bus that goes to a headphone amp, and so on.

As you can see, busses can be very helpful, if properly used. 

Hope this helps -

I understand now about a mix bus.  But all the stuff you mentioned about a bus for audio 3+4 and another bus for headphones - that I don't understand.

What would be the purpose of creating a bus for audio outputs on my interface (I have 8 outputs) or for my headphones?

Also, if I put a reference track in my DAW, can I create a Reference bus to play it through?  

 

Thanks, Andres!

[Andres Medina]

I know, it can be confusing!

Think of buses not only as mix buses, just a multipurpose super track that you can configure to receive from and send to whatever you like. That's why is important to understand the concept first.

Check the documentation here: the concept and the detalis are explained very well: https://www.cakewalk.com/Documentation?product=Cakewalk&language=3&help=Mixing.10.html

---

In my setup:

(Hardware/audio card) 1+2 (means audio out 1+Audio out 2) = Main Out (this is the signal that gets "printed" when you export your mix)

(Hardware/audio card) 3+4 = audio signal that goes to my speakers (from my audio card outs 3+4, via audio cable to my speakers). I want to be able to control my speakers volume without affecting the main signal. I also use a dedicated plugin that "fine tune" my speakers according to my control room, and this is something that I don't need in my exported mix, it's just for monitoring.

(Hardware/audio card) 5+6 = I can use a separate out to connect a headphone amplifier, and for example configure this bus to output a mono signal, that many musicians prefers to use while recording their parts. So, this audio feed need some particular setup that I don't want in my exported audio.

---

[Also, if I put a reference track in my DAW, can I create a Reference bus to play it through?  ]: of course. This way you can control the reference track levels directly from the console, or use several reference tracks all routed to your same "Reference" bus. No need to adjust the volume of each one separately.

[OutrageProductions]

In the 'hardware output' section of the console view, I have enough actual physical outputs that I  have configured a stereo out to headphones, a stereo out to a pair of nearfield loudspeakers, and 6 channels out to my mains in 5.1 Surround (LRCSLsRs) and it is saved in every one of my starting project templates. [I have an outboard monitoring rig that allows me to switch between them]

In the bus section, all of my project templates also start with (obviously) a Master (Mix), a Reverb, and sometimes a Drum bus. 

They are very flexible indeed!

[greg54]

Thanks, Andres and OutrageProductions!  I appreciate your help!

[Alan Tubbs]

I think mix buss became popularized with all the effects that got latched onto the master out to differentiate it.  It is your master buss but you are hearing it with effects so you are mixing thru it.

So a mix buss is your master buss.

Also, many pro projects were recorded on Neve desks, but mixed on SSLs using their built-in buss compressor, again changing it from a virginal master buss to a mix buss.  Most masters beforehand were shipped off to a mastering engineer but now the mix engineer could get the master nice and hot before shipping it off.

[greg54]

1 hour ago, Alan Tubbs said:

I think mix buss became popularized with all the effects that got latched onto the master out to differentiate it.  It is your master buss but you are hearing it with effects so you are mixing thru it.

It's interesting that all the videos I have watched about the mix bus do not say what it is or how to create it.  And come to find out, as you said, it's just the Master bus.   Thanks!

[57Gregy]

On 5/6/2023 at 10:39 AM, greg54 said:

It's interesting that all the videos I have watched about the mix bus do not say what it is or how to create it.  And come to find out, as you said, it's just the Master bus.   Thanks!

A mix bus is any bus you choose to do all your sound processing through. There's nothing special about it.

[Starship Krupa]

Sonically, I also use them to "glue" similar elements together with similar processing.

For instance, let's say I have rhythm acoustic guitar doubled with the same thing played on an electric. I'd send both tracks to a bus and put something like Cakewalk's PCA2 compressor on them so that they share similar dynamics, and use a reverb send from the bus rather than the individual instruments. This helps to create the sonic illusion of a band all playing in one space.

I use the heck out of them for "rock band" type recordings, especially on the tracks that come from the 4 mics I use on my drum kit.

I don't use them as much with my electronic pieces. With those, it's pretty much the Master bus and that's it.

[greg54]

57Greg and Starship Krupa:  Thanks for your input!   That's what I have come to understand.  A mix bus is NOT the Master bus but any bus that has effects that you route tracks into in order to share effects.  A week ago I emailed the guy who made the video I posted, and he sent me this article.   It says what you both said.

https://www.musicianonamission.com/mix-bus/

 

[Alan Tubbs]

That too.  I have a dual stereo transformer coupled outputs on my RND orbit mixer (the only diff between the two signals is one is wound for -6 dB so one can drive it harder).  I’ll often send one or more tracks thru it, and not necessarily with extra hardware on the “mix” buss, but only for the sweetest transformer blooming one can get.  
 

So yea, any buss created to add fx is a mix buss, whether it is folded back into the master buss or is the master buss itself.  Or the mix buss is the master.