BBCSO Template - Reduce volume MIDI or Audio track?

[sadicus]

 

This template is great, Thanks to Matthew Sorrels.
Spitfire BBCSO Template for CbB

ISSUE
All Audio Tracks are -10db

On Play
There are Tracks with No MID or AUDIO data and yet several channels are blowing up and also stuck notes.
What are some things to check that would cause this?
All the CC control data was deleted.

 

1) Is it better to reduce the volume from the MIDI or Audio?
2) Why does SynthRack show two names of the same thing? Is that what we use to tun OFF/ON a synth so it's not loaded into memory until needed ?

Lets say you wanted to have several orch instruments play at the same time.
MIDI track: Turn Input Echo ON for all you want to hear,
The volume is way to loud, ...so reduce volume from the MIDI or Audio?
(All the Audio tracks in console are hidden in the image)
 

*NOTES (..notes? really? not a musical note, just topics as they happen scratch pad, footnote?! ahhh)
pressing the external midi controller (keyboard) on a the Multi instrument track causes stuck notes
Doing the same on the MIDI track does not

 

 

Edited April 18, 2023 by sadicus

[JnTuneTech]

3 hours ago, sadicus said:

1) Is it better to reduce the volume from the MIDI or Audio?

Way too many variables inherent there, including the qualification - "better" - to answer that generally!   I say - Use which ever method works best for you, in the particular tracking you are doing at the time.

3 hours ago, sadicus said:

2) Why does SynthRack show two names of the same thing? Is that what we use to tun OFF/ON a synth so it's not loaded into memory until needed ?

The name on a synth there is a default assigned by the plugin on loading - you can rename it after loading in synth rack view.   Hmm... I don't think turning off a synth, well, I don't think that means what you think it means...  Generally, the synth rack view can be used to insert or delete synths, and let you have another way to view their properties. There is much more in the documentation.

Not sure what I can say about the rest, maybe someone else can cover that.  -But you do seem to be figuring it out even as we try to keep up with stream of consciousness-ness!  ? Just keep going - you're doing fine!

[sadicus]

I'm trying to do this: tun OFF/ON a synth so it's not loaded into memory until needed.
There is suppose to be some tiny triangle icon that does this in SynthRack view?

Matthew Sorrels
Spitfire BBCSO Template for CbB

Quote

The disconnected synths are the Cakewalk version of Cubase's disabled track.  In an ideal world you'd find the instrument track you want to use (say Trumpets A3) and then enable it and start writing.  Then you'd do more tracks, only enabling the instruments you need, rather than every instrument.  Because the template has everything rigged and routed but disabled you start with a very flexible base.

Quote

The template is created using single instrument tracks of the VST3 version of the plugin.  All the instrument tracks are disconnected synths.  This
allows CbB to load the entire template nearly instantly.  With a disconnected synth you must first find the instrument in the Synth Rack,
select it and at the top of the Synth Rack click the small drop arrow and choose "Synth Connected".  This will
cause the instrument to load.  All the instruments are setup with all the articulations loaded and the Mix 1 mic set to full volume.  Pretty
much the default settings on the plugin for any instrument you load. 

 

Edited April 17, 2023 by sadicus

[Bruno de Souza Lino]

in BBCSO, the volume for the instruments is mapped to the mod wheel (CC1)

 

[sadicus]

So if there is no CC1 data there should be no sound, correct? The MIDI has Velocity, No envelopes, No CC data.

[msmcleod]

29 minutes ago, Bruno de Souza Lino said:

in BBCSO, the volume for the instruments is mapped to the mod wheel (CC1)

 

I hate it when manufacturers do this.  CC 7 is for volume - and there's a good reason for it:  When a synth receives a "Reset all controllers" message, it's meant to reset all of the CC's to their default.  For everything apart from CC 7 and CC 10, and CC 11, this is zero.... which means CC 1 gets set to zero. 

For CC 10 (pan) it's 64 which is centre,  for CC 7 (volume) it's 96, and for CC 11 (expression) it's 127.

If volume is CC1 and it's reset, it gets set to zero which means no volume.

Native Instruments are guilty of this too with some of their instruments.

I really wish plugin manufacturers would respect and follow the MIDI spec.

[sadicus]

Tht's good to know, thanks for that info!
Well ALL the CC were superposed to be deleted, so I have no idea where the stuck notes and increased volume is coming from.

 

[JnTuneTech]

5 hours ago, msmcleod said:

I hate it when manufacturers do this. 

Yes - and in a perfect world, we musicians would have been taught basic MIDI standards, at least since the 1980s or so! ? -I guess we should be glad that those manufacturers aren't forcing users to buy a spiffy new specialized MIDI controller in order to make their program work in the fashion they designed. In most of the cases of CC1 being used for volume, that I have seen, it is because that is the only generally implemented physical control on a keyboard that often easily accessed to push or snap back to a set value. -So it's sort of a cheap workaround to implement easy volume swells, -sort of like a swell lever on an old Hammond organ (in fact.. many organ sims use CC1 in default setups for varying alternate uses, -cough cough- N.I...) -Still, they should at least have a big warning notice & mapping choice when you install the software, you know?

@sadicus If you are sure that there is no embedded MIDI CC in any/all the tracks pointing to the instrument that is changing volume (embedded CCs use channel value, not necessarily the track they are in), then maybe you need to turn off MIDI chase in the project settings when that happens.  I know I have a few orchestral arrangements, with long notes in them, that seem to "hang" and then double in volume, when I am stop-start editing in the middle of sections with those long notes, until I turn that setting off temporarily.

Edited April 18, 2023 by JnTuneTech
clarifications...

[sadicus]

Quote

turn off MIDI chase in the project settings

@JnTuneTechHow to turn off "MIDI CHASE" (...you knew this questions was happening, right?)
btw, i did search Cakewalk How to turn off "MIDI CHASE" before asking.

 

[JnTuneTech]

7 minutes ago, sadicus said:

@JnTuneTechHow to turn off "MIDI CHASE" (...you knew this questions was happening, right?)
btw, i did search Cakewalk How to turn off "MIDI CHASE" before asking.

 

This can be found in Cakewalk Preferences - Project - MIDI - Other Options: MIDI Event Chase On Play. -When a project is open (it is set per project). The other options can be important too!

Edited April 18, 2023 by JnTuneTech

[sadicus]

Here is where the project is at:
1) turn off "MIDI CHASE"
2) Load the BBCSO Template
3) Import Each MIDI track to the corresponding MIDI Instrument track.
4) Select ALL TRACKS (MIDI, AUDIO EVERYTHING)  by Filter> Control 0-127 Chnl 1-16 "ok"
5)  Edit> Delete

On Play, There are still channels with no data and sound showing in the meter with stuck notes.

 

 

[JnTuneTech]

1 hour ago, sadicus said:

Import Each MIDI track to the corresponding MIDI Instrument track.

(P.S. I don't know anything about BBCSO) - If it is a multi-timbral instrument (sounds like it is), you may want to try checking things one track at a time - I know it's tedious, but finding the problem is hard when you just throw everything on all at once.  -But, there are so many ways to do things, just keep working at it!

Troubleshooting mode - only provide MIDI one track at a time - until you find one(s) that don't cause the problem.  -Just a suggestion.

[Bruno de Souza Lino]

On 4/18/2023 at 6:55 PM, JnTuneTech said:

(P.S. I don't know anything about BBCSO) - If it is a multi-timbral instrument (sounds like it is), you may want to try checking things one track at a time - I know it's tedious, but finding the problem is hard when you just throw everything on all at once.  -But, there are so many ways to do things, just keep working at it!

Troubleshooting mode - only provide MIDI one track at a time - until you find one(s) that don't cause the problem.  -Just a suggestion.

Only BBCSO Core and above are multi timbral. The free Discover version isn't.