MODO Bass 2 CS

[user 905133]

11 minutes ago, JT music said:

The only real benefit is for IKM that it tempts you to keep buying more bass models and get more patterns . . . .

After finding I cannot add user patterns, I am leaning towards this ^^^ conclusion. However, now that this is on the table, I am hoping others will chime in to discuss the presence or absence of specific features.  (Let me be direct: I will be horrified if my question and comments inspired another volley of "Are we on this again?")  Peace!

[JT music]

A real shame the very reduced palette of patterns and very low melodic articulation brought the CS version, added to the fact that there is no demonstration of sounds of the new expansions it is really no very tempting for me to pay again for an update to V2 and apparently I am not the only one who thinks this which I have been saying for a while.

[Peter - IK Multimedia]

16 minutes ago, JT music said:

A real shame the very reduced palette of patterns and very low melodic articulation brought the CS version, added to the fact that there is no demonstration of sounds of the new expansions it is really no very tempting for me to pay again for an update to V2 and apparently I am not the only one who thinks this which I have been saying for a while.

The reports I see showing the incredible number of people who bought it yesterday beg to differ.  We have audio and video demos available for all the basses.  And of course to go through this yet again:  you are not "paying again" for everything.

Also, the replies you got last time you made this rant (from other users of this forum, not me) can counter your hyperbole about how many people agree with your logic.

Appreciate you bumping the thread, though.  The more people that know about MODO BASS 2 seems the more people want to pick it up for the most part.  We have an affiliate program if you'd like to make some commissions though I'm pretty sure those links aren't allowed here.

But to be serious.  I am sorry to hear you don't think we have given enough away free for your liking, and I mean that sincerely.  Sometimes things just aren't for someone and I appreciate that this and MODO DRUM 1.5 were not for you.  However, you tend to go on the offensive so I will unfortunately need to correct the misinformation when I see it, as much as I do sincerely appreciate that you're interested to a degree but these products are not for you.

[JT music]

10 minutes ago, Peter - IK Multimedia said:

The reports I see showing the incredible number of people who bought it yesterday beg to differ.  We have audio and video demos available for all the basses.  And of course to go through this yet again:  you are not "paying again" for everything.

Also, the replies you got last time you made this rant (from other users of this forum, not me) can counter your hyperbole about how many people agree with your logic.

Appreciate you bumping the thread, though.  The more people that know about MODO BASS 2 seems the more people want to pick it up for the most part.  We have an affiliate program if you'd like to make some commissions though I'm pretty sure those links aren't allowed here.

But to be serious.  I am sorry to hear you don't think we have given enough away free for your liking, and I mean that sincerely.  Sometimes things just aren't for someone and I appreciate that this and MODO DRUM 1.5 were not for you.  However, you tend to go on the offensive so I will unfortunately need to correct the misinformation when I see it, as much as I do sincerely appreciate that you're interested to a degree but these products are not for you.

Mr Peter, seen and considering these update policies I already think it is not enough for me, too bad I did not realize before buying the first version, greetings.

[user 905133]

1 hour ago, User 905133 said:

After finding I cannot add user patterns, I am leaning towards this ^^^ conclusion. However, now that this is on the table, I am hoping others will chime in to discuss the presence or absence of specific features.  (Let me be direct: I will be horrified if my question and comments inspired another volley of "Are we on this again?")  Peace! (Empashsis added)

DAMMMIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think both of these guys work for the same team and are doing a good-cop-bad-cop kind of thing using a tag team promotional/marketing strategy.  Why else would they repeatedly engage in this behavior?        ?

Edited May 27, 2022 by User 905133

[user 905133]

Apologies to Larry and other participants. I really tried to forestall a repeat another volley of the crap-throwing show .

Edited May 27, 2022 by User 905133

[Peter - IK Multimedia]

6 minutes ago, User 905133 said:

DAMMMIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think both of these guys work for the same team and are doing a good-cop-bad-cop kind of thing using a tag team promotional/marketing strategy.  Why else would they repeatedly engage in this behavior?        ?

I unfortunately must engage in dispelling constant misinformation in this specific case.  Otherwise I'm pretty sure most here know I take factual and constructive ideas to the team all the time (and sometimes I even get a "win" for y'all!).

Edited May 27, 2022 by Peter - IK Multimedia
typo

[user 905133]

Just now, Peter - IK Multimedia said:

I unfortunately must engage in dispelling constant misinformation in this specific case.

I disagree. Unless you are admitting that I am right about the good-cop-bad-cop marketing strategy being intentional and your job duties mandate that you engage in this confrontive promotional campaign for the sake of sales.  

Let me ask: Why did you tell us that the issue with some of the SYN2 instruments not being installed properly was fixed when it was first reported?  You said that in January (IIRC) and repeated that here a few weeks ago when it was clear to multiple users here that it was not fixed. Not only that, but users here tracked down the source of the issue while you were maintaining it had been fixed when first reported.   Clearly support knew about the issue, let it remain, and you told us it had been fixed.

You chose not to reply to the specific evidence users here presented.

You also chose to reply once again to JT Music.

I am calling them as I see them.  You intentionally violated a polite request.  You did not have to escalate the Peter v. JT Music debate. Very regrettably I have to conclude that the dictum "When it comes to publicity, there is no such thing as bad news" has been extended to "Good-cop-bad-cop style marketing is good for sales."

That's the way I see it based on this repeated behavior.

   

[Doug Rintoul]

10 minutes ago, User 905133 said:

I disagree. Unless you are admitting that I am right about the good-cop-bad-cop marketing strategy being intentional and your job duties mandate that you engage in this confrontive promotional campaign for the sake of sales.  

Let me ask: Why did you tell us that the issue with some of the SYN2 instruments not being installed properly was fixed when it was first reported?  You said that in January (IIRC) and repeated that here a few weeks ago when it was clear to multiple users here that it was not fixed. Not only that, but users here tracked down the source of the issue while you were maintaining it had been fixed when first reported.   Clearly support knew about the issue, let it remain, and you told us it had been fixed.

You chose not to reply to the specific evidence users here presented.

You also chose to reply once again to JT Music.

I am calling them as I see them.  You intentionally violated a polite request.  You did not have to escalate the Peter v. JT Music debate. Very regrettably I have to conclude that the dictum "When it comes to publicity, there is no such thing as bad news" has been extended to "Good-cop-bad-cop style marketing is good for sales."

That's the way I see it based on this repeated behavior.

   

Some of your points are valid, especially wrt the issue with some of the SYN2 instruments having misformed zip files.  Actually I am only aware of one instrument, the Syner-V.  However, Peter was probably going off what support had told him. And as frustrating as this may be, this is not a support forum.

But I think  you are off base here with the good-cop-bad-cop accusation. I think you are subscribing to a conspiracy that does not exist. I also disagree with the dictum that there is no such thing as bad news, especially in this case. Good public relations is important and Peter has done a damn fine job of that over the years. He has been patient many times when false accusations have been flung his way and has tried to de-esecalate situations with humour do varying degrees of success. I really cannot see him resorting to tactics that you are ascribing to him.

[Doug Rintoul]

2 hours ago, JT music said:

The only real benefit is for IKM that it tempts you to keep buying more bass models and get more patterns, which by the way very unattractive and tempting seem to be those of the CS version.

Why is this an issue? Toontracks' whole strategy is based on this premise. You don't see people complaining that they have to pay for new instruments or patterns and can't add their own patterns to EZBass, or EZKeys. 

[Monomox]

I want to say I'm disappointed that there is no time-limited, but 100% functional demo of Modo Bass 2. Pre-recorded demos are not a good way of testing the capabilities and ease of use of a plugin. MB2 is not sample-based, so I don't understand why not letting users get the full feel of the plugin for a couple of weeks.

[Vernon Barnes]

10 minutes ago, Doug Rintoul said:

Why is this an issue? Toontracks' whole strategy is based on this premise. You don't see people complaining that they have to pay for new instruments or patterns and can't add their own patterns to EZBass, or EZKeys. 

I agree, but you can add your own patterns to EZ keys.  There are (were?) even third party patterns on sale but they did not seem to catch on.

I think IK have a way to go with patterns if they decide to develop it further the market is probably there.

 Toontrack and Amplesound each take different approaches. TT scores with its AI and Amplesound's Riffer offers complex and powerful pattern editing

[Doug Rintoul]

6 minutes ago, Vernon Barnes said:

I agree, but you can add your own patterns to EZ keys.  There are (were?) even third party patterns on sale but they did not seem to catch on.

Thanks for the clarification. The ability to add your own patterns could be a feature request for MODO Bass and MODO Drums for that matter. 

[user 905133]

54 minutes ago, Doug Rintoul said:

Some of your points are valid, especially wrt the issue with some of the SYN2 instruments having misformed zip files.  Actually I am only aware of one instrument, the Syner-V.  However, Peter was probably going off what support had told him. And as frustrating as this may be, this is not a support forum.

But I think  you are off base here with the good-cop-bad-cop accusation. I think you are subscribing to a conspiracy that does not exist. I also disagree with the dictum that there is no such thing as bad news, especially in this case. Good public relations is important and Peter has done a damn fine job of that over the years. He has been patient many times when false accusations have been flung his way and has tried to de-esecalate situations with humour do varying degrees of success. I really cannot see him resorting to tactics that you are ascribing to him.

I have often wondered if Peter is at the mercy of what people tell him and is being unintentionally misled. In fact, I seem to remember expressing sympathy for his possibly being caught in the middle (between what he was told by co-workers and what users here experience).  

My point here (which you did not address) is that Peter did not have to get into another volley as he claimed.  He chose to escalate the "debate."

I regret that you have brought up "subscribing to a conspiracy."  I do not subscribe to conspiracy theories.  I was making a point which I thought was quite unique. I don't know that anyone else has ever made that connection. If there others, I have no knowledge of them.  ? 

So, the point was Peter chose to exploit the "debate" and then he chose to defend that choice. 

Again, I disagree: He did not have to choose to do that.  But, to give him the benefit of the doubt, I tried to think of a scenario where he had to escalate the issue as he has done before.  And the only way that I can think of that he had to reply is that he had no choice in the matter.  And the reason I could think of that he didn't have a choice was that it was mandatory as part of his job description.  And the best reason for that is that is that by engaging in the debate, it helps sales.  After all, each time he does, he gets to promote the advantages of IK's products.

I am sure you are aware (1) that I appreciate Peter's efforts on behalf of consumers (because I am pretty sure you have read posts where I said as much), and (2) that I appreciate many of the fine qualities of IK products (again because I am pretty sure you have read my posts to that effect).

As for the Coffee House > Deals forum not being a support forum, I could be wrong, but I do not feel that people asking about installation issues (among other topics related to an announced product) and other people trying to help out is such a terrible crime that it needs to be called out and banned.

Peter chose to tell users an issue was fixed when it wasn't.  The fallback is always to contact IK support.  But in my experience, IK support is not the best place to try to address issues with their products. 

I could be wrong, but I see a useful role in the forum is the sharing of issues related to products.  So when he says that an issue was fixed months ago, when in fact the issue still exists, potential consumers (as well as purchasers) should know that the problem was not fixed.

Edited May 27, 2022 by User 905133
added a missing word

[Larry Shelby]

For general information and FAQ's

IK is proud to introduce MODO BASS 2. This new version adds fretless and double-bass models, enhanced performance controls and a new Patterns section.

Another major change with MODO BASS 2 is the availability of 3 versions: MODO BASS 2 (22 bass models), MODO BASS 2 SE (5 models) and MODO BASS 2 CS (1 model), the free version.

MODO BASS 2 CS requires no additional purchases and it will read all of the original basses you own from MODO BASS 1.

With this release, IK will no longer update MODO BASS 1. We strongly encourage all users to update to the free MODO BASS 2 CS for the best experience.

Just launch the IK Product Manager, go to Manage My Products, and use the Install button next to MODO BASS 2 to install this free version.

IK Multimedia

MODO BASS 2 offers these new features:

• New CS version available for anyone for free
• New fretless bass instruments available for purchase: Fretless Jazz and Fretless Bass Man
• New fingerboard option to turn any bass fingerboard to fretless or fretted*
• New double bass instruments: Studio Upright and Rockabilly
• New MICS tab to tweak the microphones position for double basses
• 4 new fretted basses available for purchase: Punk Bass, Fusion J-Bass, Horn Bass and Aluminum
• New PATTERNS tab with over a thousand bass patterns of all genres and styles**
• New Custom Shop implementation to purchase any bass a-la-carte
• Redesigned sound engine for Pick and Slap playstyles
• Improved sound engine for Hammer On/Pull Off, Bend and Slide articulations
• New redesigned GUI
• Apple M1 Native compatibility

*Included with SE versions and above
**Free starter set of Patterns included with CS.

[user 905133]

12 minutes ago, cclarry said:

MODO BASS 2 offers these new features:

• New CS version available for anyone for free
• New PATTERNS tab with over a thousand bass patterns of all genres and styles**

*Included with SE versions and above
**Free starter set of Patterns included with CS.

Thanks for sharing this additional information.  I would still be interested to know if the ability to use user patterns (as described in the MODO BASS Manual) has been incapacitated in MODO BASS 2.  Not expecting you to know, @cclarry, but maybe another MODO BASS CS user knows if it can be done, and if so how to do it. 

[Doug Rintoul]

6 minutes ago, User 905133 said:

My point here (which you did not address) is that Peter did not have to get into another volley as he claimed.  He chose to escalate the "debate."

Okay, I will address this (and to be clear, I do agree with a lot of what you said above) . I think it would be very hard not to engage when someone makes negative comments about you and the company you represent, especially if you are passionate and care about your reputation. I know I would have a problem letting a detractor have the last word. I really don't feel that Peter was exploiting the debate.

17 minutes ago, User 905133 said:

I regret that you have brought up "subscribing to a conspiracy."  I do not subscribe to conspiracy theories.  I was making a point which I thought was quite unique. I don't know that anyone else has ever made that connection. If there others, I have no knowledge of them.  ? 

Okay, subscribing  was maybe the wrong word mainly because the conspiracy did not exist yet. But I did not and still do not feel that Peter's motives for responding to JT was in order to get more publicity, bad or good. 

12 minutes ago, User 905133 said:

I am sure you are aware (1) that I appreciate Peter's efforts on behalf of consumers (because I am pretty sure you have read posts where I said as much), and (2) that I appreciate many of the fine qualities of IK products (again because I am pretty sure you have read my posts to that effect).

To be honest, this fact was not in my field of vision. The tendancy of us humans is to focus on the negatives, and so no matter how many positive things have been said in the past, it is the negative that sticks out. So it is good you pointed out you past responses.

Your point about support in the forum is well taken. It is appropriate for issues to be highlighted when discussing a product. But I don't think we should be treating this like a support forum and demanding responses and solutions to our issues. I know it is frustrating, especially if official channels are not working. Having said that, I do appreciate knowing that I am not alone in my issues and have appreciated the solutions others have come up with in the past.

[Doug Rintoul]

4 minutes ago, User 905133 said:

Thanks for sharing this additional information.  I would still be interested to know if the ability to use user patterns (as described in the MODO BASS Manual) has been incapacitated in MODO BASS 2.  Not expecting you to know, @cclarry, but maybe another MODO BASS CS user knows if it can be done, and if so how to do it. 

This is from the MODO Bass 2 manual:

10.2 – Importing your own patterns
If you would like to save patterns you create with MODO BASS 2 inside the application so that they appear in
the patterns section, you should name them as follows:
Genre_Section_Playstyle_Bars_Signature_BPM_Key_Song Name.mid
See the following examples for detailed naming:
Pop_Bridge-1_Pick_4_4-4_144_C#-_Marshall.mid
Pop_Bridge-1_Finger_8_4-4_132_G-_Strike.mid
Pop_Bridge-2_Finger_8_4-4_132_G-_Strike.mid
Pop_Solo_Finger_10_4-4_132_G-_Strike.mid
Rock_Verse-1_Pick_4_4-4_147_A-_Darkness.mid
Rock_Verse-2_Pick_4_4-4_147_A-_Darkness.mid
Rock_Bridge-1_Pick_4_4-4_110_Bb_Speedway.mid
Soul_Intro-1_Finger_8_4-4_126_Eb-_Soulmate.mid
Jazz_Bridge_Pizzicato_2_6-8_75_E_DB Sunny.mid
Rockabilly_Intro_Slap Double Bass_2_4-4_180_E_DB Graffiti.mid
Ballad_Chorus-1_Finger Fretless_2_4-4_80_Bb_FL Hat.mid
Pop_Verse-1_Slap Fretless_2_4-4_80_C_FL Hoodie.mid
Pop_PreChorus-1_Pick Fretless_2_4-4_80_E-_FL Push.mid
Then, move them inside the following folder:
/Documents/IK Multimedia/MODO BASS 2/Patterns/
These will appear in the Patterns section as well as in the pattern menu in the bottom bar once the application is
relaunched.

[Larry Shelby]

3 minutes ago, User 905133 said:

Thanks for sharing this additional information.  I would still be interested to know if the ability to use user patterns (as described in the MODO BASS Manual) has been incapacitated in MODO BASS 2.  Not expecting you to know, @cclarry, but maybe another MODO BASS CS user knows if it can be done, and if so how to do it. 

You can use any Bass MIDI that you can place on the track to drive Modo Bass 2 to the best of my knowledge

[user 905133]

1 hour ago, Doug Rintoul said:

This is from the MODO Bass 2 manual:   10.2 – Importing your own patterns

Another issue (in addition to a tendency to focus on negativity), is that earlier posts get "lost." I suspect my post from 4 hours ago (citing the same portion of the MB2 Manual) got "lost" because JT Music's reply (which I responded to in such a way to try to avoid seeing another round of JT v. Peter "Are We Gonna Go There Again?") was replied to by Peter and then JT again and then . . . .

6 hours ago, User 905133 said:

Since I have MODO BASS 1, I looked at the comparison table and didn't see any benefit to installing MODO BASS 2 CS. Is there any benefit, other than the option to buy  ala carte basses?

Update: Found it.  MODO BASS 2 CS has features listed that MODO BASS 1 doesn't:

• Reduced number of patterns.
• No fretless capability.

Might be worth installing if it adds the ability to record, save, and load user bass patterns.

Quote

10.2 – Importing your own patterns If you would like to save patterns you create with MODO BASS 2 inside the application so that they appear in the patterns section, you should name them as follows:

Genre_Section_Playstyle_Bars_Signature_BPM_Key_Song Name.mid

Then, move them inside the following folder: /Documents/IK Multimedia/MODO BASS 2/Patterns/ These will appear in the Patterns section as well as in the pattern menu in the bottom bar once the application is relaunched.

This feature seems to make having to scroll past the new locked basses worth the extra effort, but the CS version might not have this feature. (I couldn't get it to work.) I'd be interested in knowing if anyone can add user bass MIDI files.

When Peter chose to escalate the confrontation beyond what JT Music had started, despite my polite comment asking them not to engage (maybe I was too polite?), part of my frustration with the drama these two were creating stemmed from the distraction it took from legitimate questions, including mine.

JT Music was the only one who replied, although it was not helpful in addressing my specific question and in the "volley" I was hoping wouldn't happen, the question got lost.  With the LOL dollar sign face I was trying to deescalate my own frustration at the distraction as if to say the good-cop-bad-cop thing was an attempt at humor. 

4 hours ago, User 905133 said:

5 hours ago, User 905133 said:

After finding I cannot add user patterns, I am leaning towards this ^^^ conclusion. However, now that this is on the table, I am hoping others will chime in to discuss the presence or absence of specific features.   (Let me be direct: I will be horrified if my question and comments inspired another volley of "Are we on this again?")  Peace! 

  DAMMMIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think both of these guys work for the same team and are doing a good-cop-bad-cop kind of thing using a tag team promotional/marketing strategy.  Why else would they repeatedly engage in this behavior?        ?

For what its worth, I have given up trying to get User Patterns to show up in MODO BASS CS on my own.

UPDATE: Despite prior experiences, I asked Support.  While IK's rules preclude sharing what they say, if I find out how it can be done, I will share my own process if successful.  If it can't be done, maybe there will be something on IK's website or in a FAQ or something saying the feature has been incapacitated in CS and I can post a link to that.   

Edited May 27, 2022 by User 905133
to fix typos and to add an update about contacting Support