The problem with velocity

[Natasha Zakharenkova]

I use midi keyboard, and the certain notes are just louder than others. My keys are totally fine (cause for example when I use PianoMarvel the velocity works perfectly ). 

I also had this problem with FL Studio but there I found the velocity adjustor, and I adjusted it horizontally (initially it was diagonally), so that my keys would sound with the same volume, but the volume wouldn't change no matter how hard I pressed. So my question is: can I do the same with Cakewalk as I did with Fl? Or even better, can I make my keys sound with the same volume but with the keeping of the function"when I press harder it's louder"? 

( if I didn't make myself clear please tell me to give more details)

[Promidi]

3 hours ago, Natasha Zakharenkova said:

I use midi keyboard, and the certain notes are just louder than others. My keys are totally fine (cause for example when I use PianoMarvel the velocity works perfectly ). 

I also had this problem with FL Studio but there I found the velocity adjustor, and I adjusted it horizontally (initially it was diagonally), so that my keys would sound with the same volume, but the volume wouldn't change no matter how hard I pressed. So my question is: can I do the same with Cakewalk as I did with Fl? Or even better, can I make my keys sound with the same volume but with the keeping of the function"when I press harder it's louder"?

I believe you might get what you are asking by inserting an Cakewalk FX Velocity in the Effects Rack of the MIDI track that your midi keyboard is triggering.

With this you can set the resultant velocity to any value. All notes sounded will be that value - regardless of actual velocity played.

Of course there are many other things you can do with Cakewalk FX Velocity, but I'll leave you to explorer those.

[John Vere]

For me this is a function I can set in my Roland keyboard controller. They make it built in for live performance reasons.

You activate the function and pull the slider down until you get what you needed. Pulling it all the way down your “piano” feel becomes an “ organ” feel.  The recording velocity will be 64 no matter how soft or hard you play 

[Will.]

On 6/6/2021 at 9:48 PM, Natasha Zakharenkova said:

can I do the same with Cakewalk as I did with Fl?

Yes you can. I'm nowhere near my home studio to attach screenshots. At the bottom left corner when in the Piano roll view - there's a little button to the control panel that looks like an eject button. Click it one's to mix it in with the notes or twice to have it separate. 

Also keep in mind. It's not the volume that you're changing - its the velocity of the notes (how fast the notes was hit.) Having the volume at random levels: This give you a humanized feeling to the track, which is what you always want, even in EDM. 

Click here to learn the Piano Roll View

Edited June 8, 2021 by Will_Kaydo

[John Vere]

What is important to understand is volume is a different aspect than velocity.
Velocity on a lot of instruments changes the timber. It is the midi way of trying to emulate how hard you hit, pluck or blow an instrument. 

So for most instruments this is important and depending on how elaborate the samples are will be a part of the performance. The piano is the best example. But an Organ doesn’t have velocity. It’s keys are just on off switches. So it is about the only instrument I would need to eliminate velocity for. But that said you could include velocity in this case to control volume. 
Velocity is important and it’s good to purchase a keyboard that feels and responds to your playing so you can maintain more control of the quality of your performance if the music you make is traditional. 

Edited June 7, 2021 by John Vere

[Natasha Zakharenkova]

On 6/7/2021 at 8:40 AM, Will_Kaydo said:

Yes you can. I'm nowhere near my home studio to attach screenshots. At the bottom left corner when in the Piano roll view - there's a little button to the control panel that looks like an eject button. Click it one's to mix it in with the notes or twice to have it separate. 

Also keep in mind. It's not the volume that you're changing - its the velocity of the notes (how fast the notes was hit.) Having the volume at random levels: This give you a humanized feeling to the track, which is what you always want, even in EDM. 

Click here to learn the Piano Roll View

Thank you)  I want all the keys to sound with the same volume by default, not to record and only then correct it, how can I do it?

[Natasha Zakharenkova]

On 6/7/2021 at 2:14 AM, Promidi said:

I believe you might get what you are asking by inserting an Cakewalk FX Velocity in the Effects Rack of the MIDI track that your midi keyboard is triggering.

With this you can set the resultant velocity to any value. All notes sounded will be that value - regardless of actual velocity played.

Of course there are many other things you can do with Cakewalk FX Velocity, but I'll leave you to explorer those.

Thanks for your response!) Is that what you’re talking about? So now how do I adjust it? I tried sth but nothing happened...;)

[user905133]

F1 should bring up the *.chm file, though it might pop up behind another window. Or, if you have a third-party tool that can filter a file list, search for vel*.chm. 

Another thread that might have useful info: Turn off Velocity Sensitivity.

I just ran a quick test of the Cakewalk Velocity MFX with TTS-1 just to make sure it affects volume. I split the Instrument Track into its MIDI and audio components, put the Velocity MFX on the MIDI track (in the track's FX bin), and recorded both midi and audio with the settings that were there. (See image.)  Low velocities and high velocities sounded very close to my ears. If necessary (based on what you want to do), you might need to tweak the settings per the help file if the plug-in meets your needs.

Since I recorded the audio through the Velocity MFX Plug-in, the loudness has been corrected based on the settings.  However, the MIDI track is as I played it (with low and high velocities).  With the plug-in on, all notes sound at the same level to my ears. If I turn the plug-in off, I hear the notes as played (softer and louder notes).

Hope this helps.

Clarification: Based on the following, I don't think the settings I used is the ideal solution you want. Also, I am not sure that you can use the plug-in by itself to adjust for different levels across your keyboard in real time (if that's what you need). That's why I referenced the Help file. 

On 6/6/2021 at 3:48 PM, Natasha Zakharenkova said:

Or even better, can I make my keys sound with the same volume but with the keeping of the function "when I press harder it's louder"? 

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by User 905133
(2) to add clarifications; (1) to add some details based on a test I just did.

[John Vere]

At this point I’m not sure what to op wants, might be a language issue. 
 

First it sounded like wanting recording notes to be all same velocity which is a function built in to most controllers as I mentioned 

Then it would seem they are wanting to change the velocity of the all ready recorded notes. That can be done with either a CAL script or by this. 
in PVR:

Select all. CNTL A 

Pick a note with the lowest velocity

drag the velocity to the max. 
let go 

now drag them down to the desired level 

[Natasha Zakharenkova]

2 hours ago, John Vere said:

First it sounded like wanting recording notes to be all same velocity which is a function built in to most controllers as I mentioned 

Yeah, I want all the keys on my keyboard sound with the same volume relative to each other by default, not for specific recording (now 2 or more keys sound much louder than others). So I wondered maybe I could tweak them forever, and unfortunately I don't have any built-in functions to set it in my keyboard. And as I wrote earlier, the keyboard works good with other software, but still I had the same problem with another DAW (Fl Studio) and I fixed it with just adjusting velocity but that velocity was general for everything. In Fl it looked like this initially, and I adjusted it horizontally. Can I find general velocity settings in Cakewalk?

Yeah I'm sorry that I'm confusing, I'm not a native speaker, Thank you)

Edited June 9, 2021 by Natasha Zakharenkova

[slartabartfast]

On 6/6/2021 at 12:48 PM, Natasha Zakharenkova said:

I use midi keyboard, and the certain notes are just louder than others.

It sound as if you are describing an inconsistency of the velocity sent by the keyboard, but you are not specifically addressing velocity as the issue, and only describe the symptom in terms of loudness. There is no reason to think that the keyboard will send the same velocity with each key strike--they are designed to not to do that so that different key strike forces produce different velocity levels making it possible for the player to control that parameter with technique. What you should expect is that the keyboard will always send the same velocity from a given key strike force for the same key. 

Loudness is a psychoacoustic term that describes the subjective response of the listener. I involves a variety of factors including pitch, timbre, recently heard sounds, simultaneously heard sounds (masking) etc. If you are judging the sound by ear, you are measuring loudness. Volume is the mechanical power of the sound or sound pressure level. If you are using a meter calibrated in dBspl you are measuring loudness. Velocity is a MIDI term of art describing a number which the receiving device or software will interpret in whatever way it is programmed to respond to that number. Velocity need not control volume at all, depending on the programming of the device.

My MIDI keyboard, like many others, has the capacity to be programmed to send different velocity messages as a response to the same strike force on the keys. If your keyboard does, then look for the method to re-program that if the problem is that the velocity being sent is consistently wrong. To check what your keyboard is actually sending you can download MIDIOx which will tell you without involving the DAW settings. If the velocities are not what you expect coming from the keyboard, then your options are to reprogram the keyboard if possible, change your keyboard technique so that the key strike is more consistent, or edit the velocity after it has been recorded in the DAW, or filter the input velocity using the DAW or other software (which is in practice the same as editing the velocity). 

Note that many instruments are designed to respond to velocity differently at different pitches. A real piano for example produces much more sound power for the same amount of key strike force at lower pitches than at the high end of the keyboard. A virtual piano that did not do the same would be difficult to play to sound like a realistic piano. 

 

[Mike Z]

4 hours ago, Natasha Zakharenkova said:

Thanks for your response!) Is that what you’re talking about? So now how do I adjust it? I tried sth but nothing happened...;)

I just tried this, I don't know all the ways to use the Velocity plugin but if you click on the top left of the plugin (Presets) you should find a preset named "All 127". Select that and it will set all velocity of all notes to 127, the highest setting. 

The nice part of this is that it doesn't actually change the velocity of the notes, for example if you look in the piano roll view and expand the bottom section, you'll see that the notes all stay at the same velocity from when you recorded them. But with the plugin activated they play back at the same maximum velocity.  You can see in the volume meter for the track that the notes are playing back at maximum velocity.

[Will.]

2 hours ago, Natasha Zakharenkova said:

Can I find general velocity settings in Cakewalk?

Yes. You do it like this - as i have explained above. 

Edited June 9, 2021 by Will_Kaydo

[Mike Z]

Here are some screen shots. Note that I picked a synth patch where velocity is very noticeable, notes played softly sound very soft and notes where I hit the keys hard sound very different. When I play it back with the effect bypassed I can hear the difference in note velocity (both loudness and timbre) but when the effect is activated the notes all sound the same.

[Natasha Zakharenkova]

14 hours ago, Mike Z said:

 

Here are some screen shots. Note that I picked a synth patch where velocity is very noticeable, notes played softly sound very soft and notes where I hit the keys hard sound very different. When I play it back with the effect bypassed I can hear the difference in note velocity (both loudness and timbre) but when the effect is activated the notes all sound the same.

 

Wow thank you so much, I guess that’s what’s wrong...) Do you know how to fix it?

[John Vere]

If you press the Windows key and PRTSCN Key it will take a screenshot of your computer screen.  it saves this to a folder in your pictures folder. 
 

Of concern in what you are saying is that 2 of the notes are louder/ different than the rest. This happens when the keyboard is broken. It’s the sensor switches fail over time. I had this happen to my old Roland p200. The C and D keys were stuck at full velocity. I had to buy a new controller. 

[Glenn Stanton]

i've had this happen on 2 Kerzweil SP-88 pianos - i open them up and clean under the rubber contact pads (carefully) and they're good to go. they use the Fatar keyboard mechanisms so if your keyboard uses that type also, cleaning the "stuck" keys should help.