Mark Morgon-Shaw

Or maybe they are not hitting the numbers they expected. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ If everything is wrapped up in one al encompassing BL membership do they even know who's using the various Apps it includes? Maybe it doesn't matter to them whether it's the existing Sonar users or new Bandlab / Next users.

I know right ? And really it confirms what I've felt since this Cakewalk Sonar announcement. The Devs are beavering away but whoever decides how this DAW is sold and marketed doesn't really seem to be at all connected to the users.

Okay so Mike has doubled down and gone into more detail in a new video....Very interesting and chimes with my thoughts on the marketing side of things. Have linked it at the most interesting part

The least offensive IMHO

Yes it's definitely better, some long standing bugs seem to be fixed.

None of them are bug free...my Cubase mate is always complaining, just look at the Cubase 11 debacle. The problems led to a lot of backlash, and Steinberg later committed to improving their system, including ditching eLicenser for a more modern licensing solution. My Logic Pro owning composer friends were all high fiving each other this week because ' THEY FINALLY HAD A WAY TO SEARCH FOR PLUGINS !!! ' I mean WTF....we've had the Browser since 2011 !!! So although we sometimes look enviously at other DAWs that are more popular and have more swanky new features, the grass isn't always greener. That said I think we no have the ugliest GUI, many agree and I wish they'd improve it. I trialled Cubase 14 and the clarity of the GUI is s night and day. However it doesn't suit my Workflow so I am staying put.

I know like 2 people who use it in my world out of hundreds

The difference is if you don't care for the upgrades, what you already paid for becomes no longer useable. It becomes crippleware. I was happy on Sonar 8.5.3 for a almost a decade, right up until CbB. None of the new X-series features bothered me much until they added ARA in Sonar Platinum. As a semi-pro I can't have access to my files held to ransom. This week a music company wanted a track I wrote 3yrs ago and had to deliver stems and altenative mixes for example. I don't mind paying the sticker price of the App either up front or over a time period but I believe that once it's paid for you should have the right to use that version with full functionality even if it's not the latest and greatest. I should be the one who decides whether new features will benefit me and pay accordingly.

CbB or Cakewalk Sonar. Over time they will diverge and if the only way is a subscription plan then will you still always use it?

Yes it's sad to hear it from someone like Mike who has been one of the leading advocates for Cakewalk over recent years. Even I have learned a few things I'd overlooked from his videos and I've been using it since the mid-90s too. I do have to agree with him though, it seems like Bandlab built up a ton of goodwill for 5yrs with CbB and then totally bungled the release of Cakewalk Sonar. Many were left confused by the early preview that came with the Bandlab Membership which subsequently became the only way to get it much to the dismay of the loyal user base. I don't know who Cakewalk Sonar is aimed at anymore? It's a professional level tool but many Pro Users have little use for the slew of extras like Distribution - Promomotional/Fan outreach stuff. Not having a way to purchase it without all that is very offputting. Meanwhile other DAWs cater better for hobbyists by adding music creation tools to help those without tradition music skills that Cakewalk & Sonar lack. Yeah it's not like the Dev Team haven't been hard at work so it's a shame the marketing team seem to be pulling the rug from underneath them. We don't know the numbers in the background of all this thogh - Maybe they are selling enough memberships to justify it all ?? But all I seem to see in the Fb groups and on forums is people not happy with the situation and saying they are leaving to go elsewhere, and Mike is a notable one in that category. My suggestion would be : 1: Sort out the licensing model, give people another option over the subscription - Pro Tools aside, every other DAW has at least some sort of non-subscription or hybrid upgrade plan where stopping the monthly fee doesn't lose your access to the version you paid for. This is what makes people mad. 2: Take a serious look at getting a better GUI designer in - The Sonar GUI now looks a mess compared to Skylight and all other DAWs, it's the least legible and hardest to use GUI across all DAWs now IMHO and I've tried most of them over the last few years. 3: Get some feature parity with the competion. StudioOne and Cubase have left Cakewalk Sonar far behind now -I find this sad as it used to be a leader and had features before everyone else. 4: Communicate better with your user base - when was the last time we heard from Meng for example? Seems like it was 5yrs ago 5: Lack of media coverage. Most of the other DAWs still have columns in Sound On Sound - we lost ours and the visibility of Cakwalk suffered. That's my list off the top of my head - whether anyone listens who knows but Mike has summed it up well and I thank him for that.

Thoughts?.......... Mike explains further in this new video

No. Nothing improved there. Cubase 14 has a fantastic score editor now ( basically built in Dorico ) and superior video handling

Yeah you are 100% correct I have the orginal 15 button model and at first I tried to use it like a control surface replacement. Wrong idea. What it's great for is setting up your own macros and hotkeys that are time consuming and/or repetitive. This is my Cakewalk page ( I use it in multple different Apps too ) - they are all designed to be used in the Track View Superzoom presses the keys to hide the browser , the inspector , and maxes the app to full screen. Press again to reverse it Hide / Unhide is a toggle switch that hides tracks not selected Fit - Fits the selection to screen Transpose is a macro to transpose the selected clip up or down an octave in the track view. I probably use this the most. Scale Vel - Reduces the selected clip or midi notes velocity by 10% Tempo Track - Hides or displays the tempo track CAL - this opens a subfolder of CAL Routines I use sometimes and selecting will run them on the selected midi Normalize - a macro that saves a few keystrokes, set to -2db Melodyne - a short cut to make a RegionFX clip Humanise - Runs my most commonly used CAL Reset Midi & Audio - this can be a lifesaver having it on a dedicated button Bounce to clip - this is a macro because Cakewalk has no bounce in place so it's a workaround for that Audient - Opens my Audio Interface driver And I have a spare button that I've still to think of something for, but these fit my needs nicely - Of course everyone does things a little differently but the Stream Deck is highly configurable to do all sorts of things, I am sure I have only really scratched the surface.

It wasn’t a conclusion; it was a clarification because the original info wasn’t clear. How would they even know if they'd not used Sonar?

I wasn't asking. The way you put it could lead anyone to a different conclusion. If you didn’t mean to confuse people, a little more precision would help.